Help wanted: Mechanical Engineers
Logistics Pro
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,609
Likes: 324
From: Arizona
If the threads in the head are damaged/stretched you could try Timesert. I used it on a Mercedes 603 head where the damper bolt had stripped out, worked great. A bit pricey but far superior to a helicoil.
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++ TIME-SERT Threaded inserts for stripped threads, threaded inserts, thread repair stripped sparkplug's, Ford sparkplug blowouts, threaded inserts threaded, repair stripped threads, stripped threads, inserts threaded inserts, Ford spark plug repair,
Senior User
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 249
Likes: 1
I hope this isn't a stupid question, but were your bolt holes cleaned with a solvent first? My understanding is thread lock won't work on oily surfaces. Hope this wasn't mentioned before, I didn't follow the injector thread of yours.
Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,800
Likes: 52
From: Southern Colorado
The thread locker package implies that Red is the superhuman version of thread lockers. But, Blue sometimes doesn't cut it. I doubt you'd have any issues with Red in those holes. I've had Red be really tight, but I've never had to use heat to remove a Red-held bolt.
You might consider buying brand-new hold down bolts, too, as I have had bolts on my tractor that simply were worn to where they would not stay tight no matter what. I don't think your star washer idea is great, but it's not the worst idea, either.
How about installing studs in the heads and then using two nuts (jammed against each other) to hold it tight? (There may not be room for this, and you risk damage if you lose a nut off the end...) When bolts don't cut it in the 4x4 world (suspension/axle stuff), people usually resort to studs.
Just some thoughts.
You might consider buying brand-new hold down bolts, too, as I have had bolts on my tractor that simply were worn to where they would not stay tight no matter what. I don't think your star washer idea is great, but it's not the worst idea, either.
How about installing studs in the heads and then using two nuts (jammed against each other) to hold it tight? (There may not be room for this, and you risk damage if you lose a nut off the end...) When bolts don't cut it in the 4x4 world (suspension/axle stuff), people usually resort to studs.
Just some thoughts.
Thread Starter
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Hotshot
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 18,849
Likes: 179
From: Puget Sound
The thread locker package implies that Red is the superhuman version of thread lockers. But, Blue sometimes doesn't cut it. I doubt you'd have any issues with Red in those holes. I've had Red be really tight, but I've never had to use heat to remove a Red-held bolt.
You might consider buying brand-new hold down bolts, too, as I have had bolts on my tractor that simply were worn to where they would not stay tight no matter what. I don't think your star washer idea is great, but it's not the worst idea, either.
How about installing studs in the heads and then using two nuts (jammed against each other) to hold it tight? (There may not be room for this, and you risk damage if you lose a nut off the end...) When bolts don't cut it in the 4x4 world (suspension/axle stuff), people usually resort to studs.
Just some thoughts.
You might consider buying brand-new hold down bolts, too, as I have had bolts on my tractor that simply were worn to where they would not stay tight no matter what. I don't think your star washer idea is great, but it's not the worst idea, either.
How about installing studs in the heads and then using two nuts (jammed against each other) to hold it tight? (There may not be room for this, and you risk damage if you lose a nut off the end...) When bolts don't cut it in the 4x4 world (suspension/axle stuff), people usually resort to studs.
Just some thoughts.
- Red has five times the holding power of the blue. This could feasibly spin the 6mm-diameter bolt right off. I'm not brave enough to go there. The beauty of the tack-weld is breaking the tack is by way of force on the head, not the threads.
- That's a great suggestion... but I'm on my third set of bolts now.
- I can go one better - lock-nut under the hold-down bracket (it's only the lower bolts with the problem). I need to look at photos again to see if a metric wiz-nut can fit under the bracket. Very cool concept that frustration level prevented me from thinking of that before.
Cargo Master
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,800
Likes: 31
From: OKC, OK
Rich I had to pop the VCs quite a few times dealing with my new injectors, but it does not come close to what you have had to do. I know I was very frustrated with my situation but cannot imagine what I would be thinking or doing if I was in your shoes.
Anyhow I am not a Mech Engineer, but I was also thinking studs. The nut under the hold down bracket is not a bad idea eaither. I think I would have to agree that the threads have to be damaged eventhough they have been tested. You would have to be pretty brave to tap them bigger, but then you have to find bigger bolts and hope they fit through the bracket. Good luck.
Anyhow I am not a Mech Engineer, but I was also thinking studs. The nut under the hold down bracket is not a bad idea eaither. I think I would have to agree that the threads have to be damaged eventhough they have been tested. You would have to be pretty brave to tap them bigger, but then you have to find bigger bolts and hope they fit through the bracket. Good luck.
Elder User
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 797
Likes: 1
From: UT
- Red has five times the holding power of the blue. This could feasibly spin the 6mm-diameter bolt right off. I'm not brave enough to go there. The beauty of the tack-weld is breaking the tack is by way of force on the head, not the threads.
- That's a great suggestion... but I'm on my third set of bolts now.
- I can go one better - lock-nut under the hold-down bracket (it's only the lower bolts with the problem). I need to look at photos again to see if a metric wiz-nut can fit under the bracket. Very cool concept that frustration level prevented me from thinking of that before.
I've never had my VC's off before, so I don't know exactly what it looks like under there, but the stud idea with a nylock or lock nut sounds like the better option.
Posting Guru
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,037
Likes: 0
From: Albuquerque
Tugly, I didn't read the whole thread but was thinking that drilled head bolts would work to put safety wire through. That would stop any backing out and not interfere with operation. Now the question is, where to get those type bolts with the heads drilled and would it be worth the price.
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Thread Starter
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Hotshot
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 18,849
Likes: 179
From: Puget Sound
Anyhow I am not a Mech Engineer, but I was also thinking studs. The nut under the hold down bracket is not a bad idea eaither. I think I would have to agree that the threads have to be damaged eventhough they have been tested. You would have to be pretty brave to tap them bigger, but then you have to find bigger bolts and hope they fit through the bracket. Good luck.
Honestly, I think you a little crazy to consider a tack weld instead of Red Loctite. 1) I wouldn't want spatter anywhere under my VC's!! 2) The amount of heat needed for a tack can change the bolt grade. It maybe slight but there.
I've never had my VC's off before, so I don't know exactly what it looks like under there, but the stud idea with a nylock or lock nut sounds like the better option.
I've never had my VC's off before, so I don't know exactly what it looks like under there, but the stud idea with a nylock or lock nut sounds like the better option.
You think me a little crazy? Apparently you missed my comment on how spending a lot of time, money, and effort to lift the VCs over a dozen times has triggered a monkey poopfest between my ears... and I no longer trust my thinking. I'm not shooting any ideas down, I'm just thinking each one through - pros and possible cons.
- If I TIG it, there shouldn't be any splatter or slag (allegedly)
- Changing the grade of the bolt might be a more attractive option than changing the grade of the whole vehicle... but you make a valid point.
Tugly, I didn't read the whole thread but was thinking that drilled head bolts would work to put safety wire through. That would stop any backing out and not interfere with operation. Now the question is, where to get those type bolts with the heads drilled and would it be worth the price.
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Elder User
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 797
Likes: 1
From: UT
Yes your correct. TIG weld theoretically no spatter, BUT you will put more heat in the bolt trying to get it up to melting temp vs a MIG to just stick the two metals together.
Honestly, you have me a little worried about trying SS injectors and being in the same boat...lol.
Honestly, you have me a little worried about trying SS injectors and being in the same boat...lol.
Post Fiend
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 6,096
Likes: 27
From: Mesa AZ
Thread Starter
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Hotshot
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 18,849
Likes: 179
From: Puget Sound
Looks like a perfect shot to me. Straight across...forward injector to the rear injector. Because of the way the injector clamp works...as long as the lower bolts remain tight, the upper bolts will always be in tension and shouldn't work loose. You could even use the red loctite on the upper bolts since they bottom out in the blind hole and in theory you don't need to remove those hardly ever.
- Possibly spring rub.
- Rocker arms for sure. They rock down on to push the valve springs.
Post Fiend
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 6,096
Likes: 27
From: Mesa AZ
Good point. I didn't think of that. 
If you are adventurous....then you can have the injector clamps machined for a set screw. A sharp point set screw might dig into the tapered portion of the screw...
Just throwing out suggestions...
If you are adventurous....then you can have the injector clamps machined for a set screw. A sharp point set screw might dig into the tapered portion of the screw...
Just throwing out suggestions...