Emulsifier or Demulsifier?
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More Turbo
Joined: May 2008
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From: Ontario, Canada
Emulsifier or Demulsifier?
OK... I've been reading all the HPFP threads and there is always discussion about which additive to use. Could someone please list (or point me to the appropriate thread) the popular additives and whether they contain a water emulsifier or demulsifier 
Postmaster
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As more is being learned, the additive in regards to the CP4 series pump situation is becoming more muddled by the day. The recent discovery that the popular practice currently being used by Bosch to improve pump durability is susceptible to chemical attack by relatively common components of petroleum distillates makes all bets off. Tests, done at room temperature and 1 BAR pressure have shown the destruction. These pumps operate at much higher temperatures and 2000 Bar pressure. Research on the effect of these pressures and temperatures have not been released. It may be that they have not even started these tests.
Good luck on getting any information on the additives beyond the usual sales blurb stuff. As much as I dislike putting any more dollars in FOMOCO pockets, I will continue to run their PM22A stuff. I do not know why though...HPFP warranty is a phantom at Ford...
Regards
Good luck on getting any information on the additives beyond the usual sales blurb stuff. As much as I dislike putting any more dollars in FOMOCO pockets, I will continue to run their PM22A stuff. I do not know why though...HPFP warranty is a phantom at Ford...
Regards
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From: Isanti, MN
Power Service confirmed to me via email that their Diesel Kleen and Diesel Fuel Supplement both contain demulsifiers.
Diesel 911 is an EMULSIFIER though. They bill it as an emergency use additive...to hell with that, lives would have to be on the line for me to ever put this stuff in the tank!
Diesel 911 is an EMULSIFIER though. They bill it as an emergency use additive...to hell with that, lives would have to be on the line for me to ever put this stuff in the tank!
Post Fiend
Joined: Apr 2004
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From: North of Salt Lake City
That's good to know. I wish their website would say as much. I've been draining the separator since I started using the additive and still have yet to see a micro-bubble of water.
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From: Ontario, Canada
Good info so far gang. Thanks. I have used PS Diesel Kleen in the past with my VW's and since it is readily available I will use it in the truck now that I know it is a demulsifier. Unless of course I can find one of the others locally at a better price :-)
Laughing Gas
Joined: Aug 2010
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From: Kentucky
Power Service confirmed to me via email that their Diesel Kleen and Diesel Fuel Supplement both contain demulsifiers.
Diesel 911 is an EMULSIFIER though. They bill it as an emergency use additive...to hell with that, lives would have to be on the line for me to ever put this stuff in the tank!
Diesel 911 is an EMULSIFIER though. They bill it as an emergency use additive...to hell with that, lives would have to be on the line for me to ever put this stuff in the tank!
There is a reason it has 911 on the bottle....... like you said lives on the line.
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Mountain Pass
Joined: Dec 2009
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From: Regina, Saskatchewan
Power Service confirmed to me via email that their Diesel Kleen and Diesel Fuel Supplement both contain demulsifiers.
Diesel 911 is an EMULSIFIER though. They bill it as an emergency use additive...to hell with that, lives would have to be on the line for me to ever put this stuff in the tank!
Diesel 911 is an EMULSIFIER though. They bill it as an emergency use additive...to hell with that, lives would have to be on the line for me to ever put this stuff in the tank!
thanks in advance
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From: Isanti, MN
Yup, see below. 
Originally Posted by Power Service
Mr. Bowen:
It was a pleasure speaking with you earlier today. I will briefly summarize what we discussed.
Diesel Kleen and Diesel Fuel Supplement are demulsifier/solubilizers. This means that they will not allow the fuel to carry any more water than it naturally would, and they will demulsify excess water. Neither of these products will emulsify free water droplets into the fuel. Diesel fuel typically carries 50-100 ppm water naturally. Biodiesel can carry 10x the amount of water as regular diesel fuel.
With the Spicer test, as we discussed, Power Service chose not to participate in this paid study for several reasons, one of which being that they would not allow us to supply our own additive. As a result, there is question as to whether or not they used our older formulations or the ones containing Slickdiesel lubricator. Furthermore, we have been testing the lubricity of fuels for years, and on the national average we see a 200 micron WSD improvement using Diesel Kleen or Diesel Fuel Supplement at a single treatment ratio. The fuel used in the Spicer test is also not close to indicative of what would be found at a retail pump, as it was a intentionally made to be an off-specification product. Remember that every fuel has slightly different characteristics, and responds differently to additives.
Please do not hesitate to ask if you have additional questions.
It was a pleasure speaking with you earlier today. I will briefly summarize what we discussed.
Diesel Kleen and Diesel Fuel Supplement are demulsifier/solubilizers. This means that they will not allow the fuel to carry any more water than it naturally would, and they will demulsify excess water. Neither of these products will emulsify free water droplets into the fuel. Diesel fuel typically carries 50-100 ppm water naturally. Biodiesel can carry 10x the amount of water as regular diesel fuel.
With the Spicer test, as we discussed, Power Service chose not to participate in this paid study for several reasons, one of which being that they would not allow us to supply our own additive. As a result, there is question as to whether or not they used our older formulations or the ones containing Slickdiesel lubricator. Furthermore, we have been testing the lubricity of fuels for years, and on the national average we see a 200 micron WSD improvement using Diesel Kleen or Diesel Fuel Supplement at a single treatment ratio. The fuel used in the Spicer test is also not close to indicative of what would be found at a retail pump, as it was a intentionally made to be an off-specification product. Remember that every fuel has slightly different characteristics, and responds differently to additives.
Please do not hesitate to ask if you have additional questions.
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