351w build ?s please read/help
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Brian,
So what your saying is that a roller cam will make torque with stockish ported heads the same as a flat tappet with good aluminum heads? I believe im starting to fully understand what you are sayings.
On your desktop dyno, what does a good lift cam and say ported e7s (i have a set on the shelf) put out.
Ive almost completed decided against doing a stroker. I just dont think the stroker can go say 100,000 miles without major work as easy as a cammed, good head windsor can. If im wrong please let me know, but i just dont see how it could last in a daily driver, weekend toy hauler.
With that said I guess I gotta make the best outta a stock windsor, haha. Altho if my thinking is wrong, please let me know.
Will
So what your saying is that a roller cam will make torque with stockish ported heads the same as a flat tappet with good aluminum heads? I believe im starting to fully understand what you are sayings.
On your desktop dyno, what does a good lift cam and say ported e7s (i have a set on the shelf) put out.
Ive almost completed decided against doing a stroker. I just dont think the stroker can go say 100,000 miles without major work as easy as a cammed, good head windsor can. If im wrong please let me know, but i just dont see how it could last in a daily driver, weekend toy hauler.
With that said I guess I gotta make the best outta a stock windsor, haha. Altho if my thinking is wrong, please let me know.
Will
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It is my understanding that a longer stroke will pull the piston out of the bore a slight bit, which i believe would cause piston slap. It is also my understanding that the piston gets pushed into the cylinder wall kinda sideways (i suck at trying to explain that).
But i also know that I can be totally wrong in my thinking. Let me know if im wrong.
Thanks again for all the help.
Will
But i also know that I can be totally wrong in my thinking. Let me know if im wrong.
Thanks again for all the help.
Will
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From: Beatrice, NE
Can it?......yes, possibly.
Will it?......that depends!
It depends on the actual heads being compared, the actual cam profiles, compression, intake and all the other factors. The heads that Conanski ran in his Dyno simulation are pretty good heads. The cam he used also matched everything. The results he got were pretty darn impressive. You have the general idea though. What I was saying was that all else being equal, a roller cam will outperform a flat tappet of similar profile. My thought was that a good roller cam and mild home-ported E7's or GT40's may give you what you want, given your application. I suspect it may also be comparable to aftermarket heads and a flat tappet, but that depends on a ton of factors.
I can run the Dyno program, but mine is pretty old (2000) and my camshaft files are out of date with current offerings. I can use the airflow files I have for stock GT40's, ported E7's or even stock '69 Windsors, but its using info I got off the internet and I have no way of knowing how accurate it is. Flow bench testing and good head porting is an art.
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From: Beatrice, NE
It is my understanding that a longer stroke will pull the piston out of the bore a slight bit, which i believe would cause piston slap. It is also my understanding that the piston gets pushed into the cylinder wall kinda sideways (i suck at trying to explain that).
But i also know that I can be totally wrong in my thinking. Let me know if im wrong.
Thanks again for all the help.
Will
But i also know that I can be totally wrong in my thinking. Let me know if im wrong.
Thanks again for all the help.
Will
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Which stroker kits out there can last up to 100k, i totally believe you im just curious which ones.
Also, if conanski is coming up with 400+ ft lbs without a stroke, does that mean a stroker will make 550?. I dont need 550, altho it would be cool to have those numbers for bragging rights.
I think i would be happy with 400-425 ftlbs at the flywheel. Im not trying to put this project into the high 10s im just tryin to get up a 9% grade towing 5k at a speed higher than 45mph and rpms lower than 5k. I can get a running start on a couple of those hills but if grandma pulls out in front of me (happens everytime) and i have to get out of the throttle i would like to be able to get back in the throttle and pick my speed back up.
Thanks again for all the help, im gettin closer and closer to pulling the trigger, keep the ideas coming.
Will
Also, if conanski is coming up with 400+ ft lbs without a stroke, does that mean a stroker will make 550?. I dont need 550, altho it would be cool to have those numbers for bragging rights.
I think i would be happy with 400-425 ftlbs at the flywheel. Im not trying to put this project into the high 10s im just tryin to get up a 9% grade towing 5k at a speed higher than 45mph and rpms lower than 5k. I can get a running start on a couple of those hills but if grandma pulls out in front of me (happens everytime) and i have to get out of the throttle i would like to be able to get back in the throttle and pick my speed back up.
Thanks again for all the help, im gettin closer and closer to pulling the trigger, keep the ideas coming.
Will
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From: Ottawa, Ontario
Here are a couple more graphs to put it all into perspective. Bottom line is there is no downside to better heads, you gain both TQ and HP across the board with matching components. This first graph demonstrates what can be achieved with slightly better heads, cam, and exhaust on a 351, that's impessive gains but check out the next graph.
This is what is possible with a stroker kit and heads, intake, and cam suitable to that displacement...
This is what is possible with a stroker kit and heads, intake, and cam suitable to that displacement...
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Conanski and others,
So its clear that the stroker will easily make 100 more lb ft and 75 more hp with pretty much the same heads and cam. Its also clear that a stroker costs 1000 more (maybe im wrong on this number) than a windsor with good heads and cam and long tubes.
With that said, in the real world where im gonna be using this engine to take camping trips unloaded, drive in the winter when it snows (haha, thatll be fun) and tow my 5k lb trailer up steep grades with my 6klb truck, do i need the stroker or will the non stroker be suffecient?
Thanks again for all the help.
Will
So its clear that the stroker will easily make 100 more lb ft and 75 more hp with pretty much the same heads and cam. Its also clear that a stroker costs 1000 more (maybe im wrong on this number) than a windsor with good heads and cam and long tubes.
With that said, in the real world where im gonna be using this engine to take camping trips unloaded, drive in the winter when it snows (haha, thatll be fun) and tow my 5k lb trailer up steep grades with my 6klb truck, do i need the stroker or will the non stroker be suffecient?
Thanks again for all the help.
Will
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Conanski,
Just for grins, could you run a dyno for me for what the engine currently is (its how the guy im getting the truck from built the motor)
1989 Speed density stock heads with some porting, long tubes, comp cams 35-255-5, if your program cant do this setup thats cool, just figured i would ask and see what im building from.
Thanks again
Will
Just for grins, could you run a dyno for me for what the engine currently is (its how the guy im getting the truck from built the motor)
1989 Speed density stock heads with some porting, long tubes, comp cams 35-255-5, if your program cant do this setup thats cool, just figured i would ask and see what im building from.
Thanks again
Will
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 235
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From: Beatrice, NE
Conanski,
Just for grins, could you run a dyno for me for what the engine currently is (its how the guy im getting the truck from built the motor)
1989 Speed density stock heads with some porting, long tubes, comp cams 35-255-5, if your program cant do this setup thats cool, just figured i would ask and see what im building from.
Thanks again
Will
Just for grins, could you run a dyno for me for what the engine currently is (its how the guy im getting the truck from built the motor)
1989 Speed density stock heads with some porting, long tubes, comp cams 35-255-5, if your program cant do this setup thats cool, just figured i would ask and see what im building from.
Thanks again
Will
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The torque on the current engine is ok, but the hp is kinda low, what would be the easiest way to bring it up to the 300ish hp and 400ish torque. The windsor i have as it sits only makes about 25 more hp than the engine its replacing.
Thanks again and keep the ideas coming.
Will
Thanks again and keep the ideas coming.
Will
Thread Starter
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Senior User
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 143
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Conanski and others,
So its clear that the stroker will easily make 100 more lb ft and 75 more hp with pretty much the same heads and cam. Its also clear that a stroker costs 1000 more (maybe im wrong on this number) than a windsor with good heads and cam and long tubes.
With that said, in the real world where im gonna be using this engine to take camping trips unloaded, drive in the winter when it snows (haha, thatll be fun) and tow my 5k lb trailer up steep grades with my 6klb truck, do i need the stroker or will the non stroker be suffecient?l
So its clear that the stroker will easily make 100 more lb ft and 75 more hp with pretty much the same heads and cam. Its also clear that a stroker costs 1000 more (maybe im wrong on this number) than a windsor with good heads and cam and long tubes.
With that said, in the real world where im gonna be using this engine to take camping trips unloaded, drive in the winter when it snows (haha, thatll be fun) and tow my 5k lb trailer up steep grades with my 6klb truck, do i need the stroker or will the non stroker be suffecient?l
Thanks again
Will
Thanks again for all the help.
Wil
