Hey all,

I am just wondering if it will hurt my truck to clutchless shift?

I have a 1992 F250 with the 351w. I am not sure if this transmission is synchronized or not. It doesn't feel like it is and most of the time I have to double clutch to get it to downshift. If it isn't synchronized then it wouldn't hurt anything to clutchless shift it would it?

Thanks.

 

I have heard its no good to flat shift a ZF. A T-18 trans I would say no problem, but I am not really sure about the ZF. But thats just me....

 

So I take it the ZF is the transmission in my truck? I have no idea. Where would it say?

 

It should'nt hurt anything, I've been doing it a long time...downshift should be done at a slower lever movement than the upshift, its all in the rpm, road speed, and proper selection as well

 

Yes, you have a ZF, and yes it is synchronized. With that said, no, its not a good idea to shift any trans w/o using the clutch. Even if you get it to shift w/o grinding, there is always torque being applied to the syncro teeth, and it will wear them out faster than if youre using the clutch.

 

Is it possible that my syncros are already worn out? When I upshift if I don't let the input of the transmission slow down a little the gears grind and I almost never can downshift without double clutching.

 

yeah they probably are, and from what i hear its an arm n a leg to rebuild these things

 

Where does your clutch engage just a hair off the floor?

Speed shifting if you know how and your reasonably good at it no won't hurt a thing, if not best to just use the clutch. But in a pinch you should at least know how.

Wife and all my kids have been taught how to do it so if they have a clutch failure so they can and will make it home, or at least where they where going at the time.
Rather then be stranded someplace with a car/truck is perfectly fine and drivable otherwise provided they just know how.

Speed shifting can tend to be easier on the trans or rather its syncros as they do less work each time you shift doing so. Your waiting to match the speeds input/output each time only then making the shift at the exact right moment. Sure they still function to an extent even speed shifting but your doing most the work for them by waiting, and yea feeling, for that exact right moment to move the lever.

Using the clutch your not waiting for the speeds to match up in anyway and making the syncro do it all for you. You simply shift once the clutch is fully disengaged regardless of rpm, gear selection and ground speeds, no real load on them no but they must line it up for you each time.

If your clutch isn't fully disengaging that's going to be harder on them too. Hench the grinding you hear, the syncros are trying just can't stop the load.


When speed shifting you gotta be on the job each shift, your attention fully on it, much more relaxed to shift using the clutch.

Same as riding a dirt bike for example yea but more load/weight involved.

 

I know how to clutchless shift I was just wondering if it will hurt anything. My clutch engages close to the floor but I wouldn't say just a hair off the floor. Maybe an inch or 2 off the floor.

Thanks for the help,

Derrick

 

I know how to clutchless shift I was just wondering.....

No wasn't trying to inply you didn't, just the way I worded some of my post IE;But in a pinch you should at least know how., comment was general in nature not intended to reflect directly on you.

If its grabbing 1 or 2inches off the floor it should be fully disengaging.

Might want to take a minute and double check that, also check fluid level, firewall flex, pedal and rod bushings and if pumping the pedal helps or not. Might have a little air in it?

Anyway sounds like the clutch system needs a good going over if for no other reason to eliminate it as the cause of the problem.

 

One thing with my clutch pedal is that it gets stuck about half way. When I release the clutch it pauses at about half and then will come up the rest of the way. if I push the clutch with the car in neutral nothing feels weird when pushing it down but if I just let my foot off of it it stops for a second half way down then springs back the full way up. The previous owner said it had done that since he got the truck used a few years back. Is this a problem?

 

One thing with my clutch pedal is that it gets stuck about half way. When I release the clutch it pauses at about half and then will come up the rest of the way. if I push the clutch with the car in neutral nothing feels weird when pushing it down but if I just let my foot off of it it stops for a second half way down then springs back the full way up. The previous owner said it had done that since he got the truck used a few years back. Is this a problem?

Its not normal so yea its probably adding some to the problem. The pedal should travel smooth top to bottom and back again.

Worn bushings might be causing that to happen. If caught soon enough the repair is fairly simple, just replace the bushings.
If goes on noticed to long the bushing no longer do anything and the pedal pivot rod digs in and elongates the holes in the pedal bracket.

 

So, how do I go about fixing this?

 

So, how do I go about fixing this?

Hard to answer that until you give it a good going over and let us know what you find.

Most of it you can check yourself with no help, to check for firewall flex have someone push the clutch pedal to the floor for you while you watch it from under the hood.

See if the area at/around the clutch master cylinder moves forward when the pedal is pushed down, look for any cracks if it does move forward to. It shouldn't move forward at all, if it flexes way out that's a problem but they offer a reinforcing plate to correct it.

It could be one of those things, could be a combination of all of them to varying degrees. Might not find a problem with it, other then just a bushing or two needs replaced.

 

Cool posts, Dan. :)
Fill out your information so it'll show where you are............................................... ........................................^^^^

http://www.panix.com/~alvinj/file12/pushrods.jpg
http://www.panix.com/~alvinj/file12/pushrod.jpg

I made a clutch push rod out of a brake push rod after I found that
worn-out-crap on my ZF-donor parts truck. LOL :)

But the firewall had no flex tho! :) None that we could see or feel.
It was a late enough model that the factory had installed the firewall
re-enforcement. I feel as tho the fact both those conditions were
together in the same "company truck" proves Ford's firewall fix works
great! LOL :)

Agree? :)

It's a '90 F250 >8500 351w +ZF

http://www.panix.com/~alvinj/file12/7A621.jpg
(I need to take a better picture, that's after I put it in my '91 Bronco)
(7A621 is Ford's base-part-number)

Like Dan sez: Ford makes two more levels of those things as "repair
items" the one shown is the lowest level or basic "prevention model"
of the "7A621" part.

---------------------------------------

The E4OD-Bronco had a studded cover in that spot so it was easy as
pie to swap that part over. Hmmm... heck, all of it was easy to swap
over. LOL :) Cleaning that dangged baked-on ATF off the E4OD and
ZF were by far the hardest part of the whole operation.

Alvin in AZ