Okay guys, I know this slides right in with some other threads here, but none have addressed the question I have (at least not in the bajillion I read), so I'm cracking out a new thread.

I'm having a crap load of issues with my 66 410 (factory) and my starter. All the starters I've had have failed in different ways, but this latest one has sent me searching the net. I actually found the first thread on FE starters (about shimming) through google.

My reading has lead me to this question.

Does anybody know which starter gear (bendix gear/starter drive) is appropriate for the 184 toothed flexplate, as opposed to the 164 toothed verson?

I rebuilt this motor and purchased a flexplate supposedly with 184 teeth (I didn't count them) to replace the original unit. The number of teeth matched so I knew it was the correct replacement. However I've had a slew of starter problems, the latest of which makes me question if I'm not getting starters with drive gears that are meant to match the 164 toothed flexplates/flywheels instead of the 184 teeth version. So does anybody know which goes with which? I'm sure there's got to be a part number difference, but is there any physical means to tell?

Thanks!

 

The two starter drives look nothing alike. The early drives stuck out, and when spun would pull in toward the starter motor.

Conversely, the later drives would push out away from the starter motor.

Since you have rebuilt a '66, I'm going to say tha you have the 184 tooth ring gear. Check to see if you have the spacer plate between the bell housing and the block.

If you have not read it yet, maybe you should: https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/s...3&postcount=24

 

1965/76 FE's have 184 tooth ring gears.

The same 3 mounting hole starter was used in all of them, as was the starter drive.

D6PZ11350B .. Starter Drive (Motorcraft SD302) / D6PZ11350B replaced C6VY11350A & C4OZ11350B.

Fits: 1965/76 FE engines and 1965 and later cars/trucks with: 200/240/250/300 I-6's / 260/289/302/351C/351M/351W/400/429/460 V8's!

But wait...there's more! Also fits: 1962/63 221 / 1962/64 260 / 1963/64 289 / 1964 200 I-6 / 1966/70 170 I-6 (Bronco/Maverick only).
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When you bought the flexplate did you tell the partsguy you have a 410?

The 184 tooth flexplate used on 1966/67 Merc 410's and 1966/70 428's is not the same as the 184 tooth flexplate used in 1965/76 352/360/390's!

C6AZ6375B: .. Flexplate / 15 17/32" O/A diameter / Fits 1966/67 410 & 1966/70 428.

C5AZ6375D .. Flexplate / 14" O/A diameter / Fits: 1965/67 352 / 1965/76 390 / 1968/76 360.

If you have the wrong flexplate...you will have a vibration. Sooner or later...usually sooner...the vibration will cause the flexplate's center to tear out.

 

EDIT inre to post #3.

C5AZ6375D .. the 352/360/390 flexplate is 14 1/2" O/A diameter, not 14"

 

Hypoid:
Thanks for the clarification. That explains why the vendor has two different starters listed for 66 410's. That also means that I have the correct starter for my app. Also, that's one of the first threads I read, good info in there. I DO have the rear engine plate installed, so I shouldn't need to shim.

NumberDummy:
Thanks for all the info. I know you know your stuff.

After removing the original flexplate I laid the new one over top of it and they lined up, teeth matching, though the old one had worn and chipped teeth. With a 1 1/32 inch difference between the two I'm sure I would have noticed. However, I sourced parts from multiple locations for that rebuild so I'll have to dig through receipts to double check whether or not it was specifically listed for the 410. The vendor I think I bought it from only has the C5AZ6375D listed in their online catalog. I'll have to dig out the paper one I ordered off of to see if there's anything different in there.


Another thought: maybe I'm reading your notations wrong. Because how could an inch + in diameter work with he same block/bell housing/starter? If the ring were smaller (or bigger) the starter couldn't mesh with it, unless they changed the size of the C6 bell. So help me out here, because it looks like I've gone stupid.

If I do have the wrong flexplate/need a new one (which I might even if I do have the right one) does anybody know of a source to find it at?

thx

 

I once had a thread talking about this very thing.

I had a starter ring from my 360 that I reused because it was in such good condition. Turned out to be the wrong pitch. My brother had mixed and matched parts when he rebuilt the 360.

I actually did get starters for the 360 from various parts stores over the years that HAD THE CORRECT PITCH for that wrong ring gear.

I would go back and double-check the starter gear on the starter.

I truly believe that either FT starters were being mixed in, or that a 429/460 or other 3-bolt ford starter gets mixed into the "ford starter" bin at the rebuilders'

 

Krewat: Can you tell us which flexplate is which in your pic? Is one the B and one the D or is one the 164 and one the 184?

THANKS

 

Hey Number Dummy, I just ran across this post where you list a different flywheel as being correct for the 66/67 410/428's

Is there a typo somewhere?

THX
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/8...ml#post7078009

 

Take a gander at that post again, you are confusing part number suffixes.

I listed both the: C6AZ6375B Flexplate = A/T

...and the C6AZ6375A Flywheel = M/T.

Since you have a 410.. the C6AZ6375B flexplate is correct for your application.

btw: Did you happen to see post #4 where I typed a 'mea culpa' correction inre to the 352/360/390 flexplate (C5AZ6375D)? It's 14 1/2" O/A diameter, not 14"

C6AZ6375B is 15 17/32" O/A diameter.

This flywheel/flexplate info was typed VERBATUM from the 1965/72 Ford Passenger Car Parts Catalog and the 1965/72 L/M Parts Catalog.

 

Talk about "mea culpa" my apologies-- I didn't catch the "Flywheel" vs. "Flexplate" deal there. It made me think (wrongly) that maybe the A was the correct part number, vs. the B, hence my errant question.

I haven't been able to find a dealer for the "B" plate, just the D plate. Napa might have one, but they don't list original part numbers. Their listing is specifically for the 428 and claim's it's 184 teeth and balanced, but I don't know if it's correct.

Anybody know of any sources?

 

I found TWO Gen-u-ine Ford NOS originals, sent you an email on who has them.

btw: How many ppl (outside of a few FTE members and a crabby old Ford partsman) have ever heard of the Merc 410?

It was used in 1966/67 Mercury's only.

Most autoparts stores haven't a clue.

 

I wish I could make that billboard size.

Got your e-mail. Thank you very much.

And you're right, very few people have even heard of the 410. It's one of those ultra rare engines, but even I didn't know anything about a different flexplate for it vs. the 390. Not that I'm an expert by any stroke of imagination, though I guess owning one gives me a leg up on everybody who's never heard of them.

Thanks again for all the help.