cam won't fit
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Junior User
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From: colorado
cam won't fit
So I've installed new cam bearings in my 360, and darned if I just can't get the cam to fit in nicely. It keeps hanging up on the #2 bearing. I tried straighting the bearing, and carefully reinstalling it - but fitting the cam from the front or the rear - it just won't go
I thought that the bore might be off, but a simpler answer might be I got the wrong bearings, or mixed up their order. Does anyone know the ODs of the cam bearings so I can measure it?
Thanks
I thought that the bore might be off, but a simpler answer might be I got the wrong bearings, or mixed up their order. Does anyone know the ODs of the cam bearings so I can measure it?
Thanks
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Joined: Jul 2002
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From: Long Island USA
I just checked my trusty Motor's Manual and there's nothing in there about cam journals.
What are you looking for? The INSIDE diameter of the cam bearings?
Measure the journals on the cam, and add a few .001"'s - that should get you close enough to tell if you got the wrong bearing in there.
What are you looking for? The INSIDE diameter of the cam bearings?
Measure the journals on the cam, and add a few .001"'s - that should get you close enough to tell if you got the wrong bearing in there.
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Junior User
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From: colorado
No, I was looking for OD of the bearings. The bearings slip onto the cam nicely when they are outside the block, but once installed, the cam hangs on #2.
Now I suspect that the #2 bore is out of whack because when I place a straight edge through the cam bores, #2 is high on one side, and low on the other. I was told that the bores get smaller from front to back?
I wanted to know the bore diameters make sure I wasn't crushing the wrong bearing in there.
Now I suspect that the #2 bore is out of whack because when I place a straight edge through the cam bores, #2 is high on one side, and low on the other. I was told that the bores get smaller from front to back?
I wanted to know the bore diameters make sure I wasn't crushing the wrong bearing in there.
FE "Freakin Expensive"
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 6,461
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From: Smith Mountain Lake, VA
Cam Bearing are larger Id from the front of the block to the back... If they were larger in the back the cam couldnt get passed the first bearing..
I hope you installed them with a cam install tool ? and god please dont nick a bearing..you'll never get the cam journal past that spot...alway use a come installation tool unless your real good with useing long bolts at the front of the cam...
You maybe out and buying a new set of bearings.. If you havent ever installed a cam before..Take it to the shop and have it done...Or if you have a buddy that has the toold to do it right go that way.. a Bad cam install will wreck your whole project ! JMO..And good luck..
I hope you installed them with a cam install tool ? and god please dont nick a bearing..you'll never get the cam journal past that spot...alway use a come installation tool unless your real good with useing long bolts at the front of the cam...
You maybe out and buying a new set of bearings.. If you havent ever installed a cam before..Take it to the shop and have it done...Or if you have a buddy that has the toold to do it right go that way.. a Bad cam install will wreck your whole project ! JMO..And good luck..
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From: colorado
I'm pretty sure that I didn't have bearing #1 cocked, but I am at the point where I will probably take it to the shop. We used a homemade cam installation tool made with threaded rod and some collets that fit o.k. Still had to occasionally tap it straight while pulling. Took our time doing it too. Also, redid the #2 once just to make sure.
Now, I *think* that the ID of all the bearings are the same - at least we were able to get the cam in through the back... just up to the #2 - which makes me think that that bore just isn't right.
Am I wrong on th IDs being all the same?
Now, I *think* that the ID of all the bearings are the same - at least we were able to get the cam in through the back... just up to the #2 - which makes me think that that bore just isn't right.
Am I wrong on th IDs being all the same?
FE "Freakin Expensive"
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 6,461
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From: Smith Mountain Lake, VA
Well I have seen to many can tunnel's distort or go out of round unless it spun a cam bearing...and if one cam came out another of the same should go back in..But nicking a cam bearing is very easy to do if you have never installed on before with new bearings..
But only making it up too the second cam journal, Obvisouly aint right.. Is it a new cam ? Did you mic the cam journals on the cam ?
But only making it up too the second cam journal, Obvisouly aint right.. Is it a new cam ? Did you mic the cam journals on the cam ?
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From: colorado
Yeah, I wouldn't expect the bore to be offset or out of round...
It is a new cam. I have not measured the journals yet. I will have to do that this evening and get back to you
You are right, the old cam came out of there. - so unless someone just really hammered it in there - the new one should go
It is a new cam. I have not measured the journals yet. I will have to do that this evening and get back to you
You are right, the old cam came out of there. - so unless someone just really hammered it in there - the new one should go
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Laughing Gas
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Maybe this will help:
Journal Diameter:
2.1238 - 2.1248
Journal to Bearing Clearance:
0.001 - 0.003 Wear Limit 0.006
Journal Max Out of Round:
0.001
Camshaft Journal Runout:
0.005 max
Camshaft Bearing Inside Diameter:
2.1258 - 2.1268
Camshaft End Play:
0.001 - 0.007 Wear Limit 0.012
Note: Front Bearing installed with 0.020 to 0.035 space between front of beraring and front of block
Journal Diameter:
2.1238 - 2.1248
Journal to Bearing Clearance:
0.001 - 0.003 Wear Limit 0.006
Journal Max Out of Round:
0.001
Camshaft Journal Runout:
0.005 max
Camshaft Bearing Inside Diameter:
2.1258 - 2.1268
Camshaft End Play:
0.001 - 0.007 Wear Limit 0.012
Note: Front Bearing installed with 0.020 to 0.035 space between front of beraring and front of block
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Junior User
Joined: Jan 2004
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From: colorado
Thanks guys. With my harbor freight calipers my bearing i/ds were 2.127 - 2.129 - the #1, however was a little tight 2.123...it felt tight on my old cam too.
so I'm ordering a cheapo set of bearings, and gonna try replacing the #1, and see if that gives the whole thing enough clearance to slide in. Like I said before, I still think the #2 bore is a little off, so hopefully that bit of clearance will loosen everything up - if not I plan to cut some grooves in the old cam and try out a homemade reamer! (also why I orderd some more bearings
I did find some more information online about the OD of the cam bearings. On a 460 build...
http://www.carcraft.com/techarticles...air/index.html (page 2)
Looks like they list the ODs as:
#1 2.310
#2 2.295
#3 2.280
#4 2.265
#5 2.250 - not listed in the article, but I'm guessing another .015 less
And this was really close to what my bores measured.
Also, here is a good (although chevy biased) mini article I found on my problem, and a quick description of how to make a reamer
www.stealth316.com/misc/clevite-eng-bearing-fund-p9.pdf
And with that said - enough of the boring subject of bearings... time to get ripping around in some mud!!
so I'm ordering a cheapo set of bearings, and gonna try replacing the #1, and see if that gives the whole thing enough clearance to slide in. Like I said before, I still think the #2 bore is a little off, so hopefully that bit of clearance will loosen everything up - if not I plan to cut some grooves in the old cam and try out a homemade reamer! (also why I orderd some more bearings
I did find some more information online about the OD of the cam bearings. On a 460 build...
http://www.carcraft.com/techarticles...air/index.html (page 2)
Looks like they list the ODs as:
#1 2.310
#2 2.295
#3 2.280
#4 2.265
#5 2.250 - not listed in the article, but I'm guessing another .015 less
And this was really close to what my bores measured.
Also, here is a good (although chevy biased) mini article I found on my problem, and a quick description of how to make a reamer
www.stealth316.com/misc/clevite-eng-bearing-fund-p9.pdf
And with that said - enough of the boring subject of bearings... time to get ripping around in some mud!!
FE "Freakin Expensive"
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 6,461
Likes: 4
From: Smith Mountain Lake, VA
Well I hope it all works out for you.... I'am not a firm believer in cheapo bearing tho.. Bearings and the oil pump are the only protection you have in the motor... For Street motors and street / Strip motors I like the Dura Bond Cam bearings..and there not all that much money.. BTW its hard to get a good reading with a set of calipers....A dail bore gage is really the way to go !
Good Luck and keep us posted !
~Russ
Good Luck and keep us posted !
~Russ
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Junior User
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From: colorado
Problem solved
I'm posting this because I saw a new post on having troubles fitting the cam into a rebuild. I wanted to follow up on my adventures with this.
I went ahead and made a reamer out of my old cam by cutting slits in it as described by the article I mentioned. I just used an angle grinder. FYI, make them at an angle, not straight across, or the chips will jam up your reamer. Just work really slowly, and I kept WD40 on it. You might have to back it out to clean up chips part way through the process. This is important, because the reamer will jam, and scratch up the bearings. The new cam fit perfectly after this.
I was waiting 'till I had some miles on my engine to say how it went. I now have 1400 miles on my rebuild, and checked the oil at 100/1000 miles for chips - and all seems good!
Keep in mind, this was my first rebuild and I'm an amateur at engine rebuilding, but this seems to have worked.
The problem for me was that the cam bores were not lined up in a straight line in my block. Whether it was warping or a factory defect - I don't know
I went ahead and made a reamer out of my old cam by cutting slits in it as described by the article I mentioned. I just used an angle grinder. FYI, make them at an angle, not straight across, or the chips will jam up your reamer. Just work really slowly, and I kept WD40 on it. You might have to back it out to clean up chips part way through the process. This is important, because the reamer will jam, and scratch up the bearings. The new cam fit perfectly after this.
I was waiting 'till I had some miles on my engine to say how it went. I now have 1400 miles on my rebuild, and checked the oil at 100/1000 miles for chips - and all seems good!
Keep in mind, this was my first rebuild and I'm an amateur at engine rebuilding, but this seems to have worked.
The problem for me was that the cam bores were not lined up in a straight line in my block. Whether it was warping or a factory defect - I don't know
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