Need help with codes
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Junior User
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Need help with codes
My 93 3.0L Aerostar is missing at 45-65 mph.
I have changed the plugs, rotor and cap.
Before I replace the wires (hoping I dont have to) I pulled the codes.
157- MAF sensor went below 0.4 volts during last 80 warmup cycles
(I have read in other posts that this indicates the MAF may need cleaning or replacment.)
But what does this mean?
212- Loss of IDM input to EEC or SPOUT cicuit grounded
thanks
I have changed the plugs, rotor and cap.
Before I replace the wires (hoping I dont have to) I pulled the codes.
157- MAF sensor went below 0.4 volts during last 80 warmup cycles
(I have read in other posts that this indicates the MAF may need cleaning or replacment.)
But what does this mean?
212- Loss of IDM input to EEC or SPOUT cicuit grounded
thanks
Postmaster
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 4,452
Likes: 1
From: Southern California
The MAF code is pretty self explanatory. You need to clean the MAF and if that code still persists, you need to change it.
The code about SPOUT being grounded means either one of you spark plugs has been shorted out, or one of your wires has worn through and is shorted to the block.
Just because your spark plugs are replaced recently really doesn't mean much if your O2 sensor is busted. I replaced my plugs and one of them was fouled up and gave me that code again within 2 weeks before I realized that my O2 sensor was gone and that made my engine run rich, resulting in fouled plugs. Beware that, on OBD-I systems, you usually do not get a code if your O2 sensor goes bad, at least I didn't.
The code about SPOUT being grounded means either one of you spark plugs has been shorted out, or one of your wires has worn through and is shorted to the block.
Just because your spark plugs are replaced recently really doesn't mean much if your O2 sensor is busted. I replaced my plugs and one of them was fouled up and gave me that code again within 2 weeks before I realized that my O2 sensor was gone and that made my engine run rich, resulting in fouled plugs. Beware that, on OBD-I systems, you usually do not get a code if your O2 sensor goes bad, at least I didn't.
Last edited by copper_90680; Jun 21, 2007 at 03:51 PM.
Post Fiend
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 5,720
Likes: 5
From: Washington state
other causes of C212 are:
from Ford Service CD
DTC 18/212 indicates a loss of IDM input to the PCM.
Possible Causes:
-- Open harness circuit.
-- Shorted harness circuit.
-- Damaged Ignition Control Module (ICM).
-- Damaged Powertrain Control Module (PCM).
To prevent the replacement of good components, be aware that the following non-EEC areas may be at fault:
l Ignition Control Module (ICM)
l Ignition coil
l Spark plugs and high tension cables
l Distributor
l Arcing of secondary ignition components
the dirty MAF is caused by plugged failed air filter or leak in air box seal or the tube to the MAF.
can also be caused by
oiled cloth type ?performance? air filters
failed PCV valve or excessive crankcase blowby....check and change the PCV if sticking or older than 30k miles
remove the MAF element and soak in TB cleaner for 30 minutes...examine with magnifying glass for spotless clean wire and glass element
from Ford Service CD
DTC 18/212 indicates a loss of IDM input to the PCM.
Possible Causes:
-- Open harness circuit.
-- Shorted harness circuit.
-- Damaged Ignition Control Module (ICM).
-- Damaged Powertrain Control Module (PCM).
To prevent the replacement of good components, be aware that the following non-EEC areas may be at fault:
l Ignition Control Module (ICM)
l Ignition coil
l Spark plugs and high tension cables
l Distributor
l Arcing of secondary ignition components
the dirty MAF is caused by plugged failed air filter or leak in air box seal or the tube to the MAF.
can also be caused by
oiled cloth type ?performance? air filters
failed PCV valve or excessive crankcase blowby....check and change the PCV if sticking or older than 30k miles
remove the MAF element and soak in TB cleaner for 30 minutes...examine with magnifying glass for spotless clean wire and glass element
Thread Starter
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Junior User
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About ready to throw in the towel and sell as is where is.
By the way I said it was a 93 it is actually a 94.
I had the van running pretty well except for the miss at 45-65.
Well I just cleaned the MAF with MAF spray cleaner. I know you said to soak it for 30 min. and in another post someone said to soak in a shot glass but the configuration of my sensor is such that I can take off a small plate in front and see through the sensor but its not that small to soak just the filament. Id have to immerse the whole casing in a pail.
I also sprayed the throttle body plate and changed the pcv. The upper pcv elbow hose was basically falling apart so I wrapped in electrical tape so I could get it together enough to see how it would run until I can find a new hose.
Anyway now it runs 10 times worse. Seems I should have left well enough alone and replaced the wires. Maybe I would have gotten lucky and thats all it needed.
Not a good day here...
By the way I said it was a 93 it is actually a 94.
I had the van running pretty well except for the miss at 45-65.
Well I just cleaned the MAF with MAF spray cleaner. I know you said to soak it for 30 min. and in another post someone said to soak in a shot glass but the configuration of my sensor is such that I can take off a small plate in front and see through the sensor but its not that small to soak just the filament. Id have to immerse the whole casing in a pail.
I also sprayed the throttle body plate and changed the pcv. The upper pcv elbow hose was basically falling apart so I wrapped in electrical tape so I could get it together enough to see how it would run until I can find a new hose.
Anyway now it runs 10 times worse. Seems I should have left well enough alone and replaced the wires. Maybe I would have gotten lucky and thats all it needed.
Not a good day here...
Last edited by ghenryl; Jun 21, 2007 at 07:49 PM.
Post Fiend
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 5,720
Likes: 5
From: Washington state
MAF cleaning is not Ford approved but then they like to sell parts.
removing the MAF element involves removing the 2 security torx screws on top holding it into the cast aluminum housing... can loosen the screws with a small set of pliers or small visegrips if no security torx bits
cleaning is not guarenteed to solve all MAF problems...the wire/glass elements are fragile and do get caked with grit grime that cooks on and cannot be remove or the wire element burns thru or breaks
i've replaced several on several rigs...Ford MAFs seem to be more fragile....elements break on rough logging roads
removing the MAF element involves removing the 2 security torx screws on top holding it into the cast aluminum housing... can loosen the screws with a small set of pliers or small visegrips if no security torx bits
cleaning is not guarenteed to solve all MAF problems...the wire/glass elements are fragile and do get caked with grit grime that cooks on and cannot be remove or the wire element burns thru or breaks
i've replaced several on several rigs...Ford MAFs seem to be more fragile....elements break on rough logging roads
Lead Driver
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 7,014
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From: SoCal
ghenryl,
Are you sure you you properly sealed the PCV hose? Leaking unmetered air into the engine will definitely make it run rough.
The MAF sensor elements on a Bosch system I saw once looked like strands of a spider's web. The Ford sensor elements seem positively studly in comparison.
Are you sure you you properly sealed the PCV hose? Leaking unmetered air into the engine will definitely make it run rough.
The MAF sensor elements on a Bosch system I saw once looked like strands of a spider's web. The Ford sensor elements seem positively studly in comparison.
Former ******
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 4,901
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From: Salt Lake City, Utah
If the problem got worse, you confirmed that the MAf sensor was in fact the cause. The code is very self explanatory. I just had my MAF replaced last week. If I were you, I would definitely repair the problem, especially when the computer tells you exactly what is wrong. Despite the fragile nature of Ford's part, I recommend the genuine deal if it can be obtained a competitive price.
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I have another issue that I failed to mention. The flex tube on my exhaust system is split. It has been for some time. How much would that effect the idle? Would it be as significant as the history below might indicate?
The van ran rough/missed all the time before I changed the plugs, rotor and cap...got better afterward and missed at 45-65 mph...then went back to missing all the time after cleaning MAF and TB plate.
BTW I have been having a hard time accessing the forum. Has there been an issue with website?
thanks
The van ran rough/missed all the time before I changed the plugs, rotor and cap...got better afterward and missed at 45-65 mph...then went back to missing all the time after cleaning MAF and TB plate.
BTW I have been having a hard time accessing the forum. Has there been an issue with website?
thanks
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Former ******
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 4,901
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From: Salt Lake City, Utah
Since touching the MAF actually made the mis worse, I would say that the MAF is involved for sure. Check the wiring and plug to make sure they are in good order, and if they are, replace the MAF sensor.
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Junior User
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Sorry I havent gotten back to everyone but I did get these issues resolved. I put in new wires and a MAF sensor. Now it runs great. I also found one of my wires was broken inside the boot on the spark plug side. Total cost $114.17 parts + $18.38 shipping = $132.55
Thanks for your input.
Thanks for your input.
Post Fiend
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 5,720
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From: Washington state
ghenryl
thanks for the feed back
all helps our data bank for new users just finding us and reminds the old timers who have fought the Aerostar wars before and will again
anin't no fun trying to to troubleshoot in that tight dark dungeon hole
the codes never lie, just they don't yell out clearly exactly what the problem is every time
thanks for the feed back
all helps our data bank for new users just finding us and reminds the old timers who have fought the Aerostar wars before and will again
anin't no fun trying to to troubleshoot in that tight dark dungeon hole
the codes never lie, just they don't yell out clearly exactly what the problem is every time
Last edited by 96_4wdr; Nov 17, 2007 at 11:21 PM.
Elder User
Joined: Dec 2006
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From: Kitchener,Ontario,Canada
Probably Broken Plug wire = Misfire at 45-65MPH
Still...... a new MAF sensor would likely improve performance of the engine anyhow! good idea to change your air filter every year & make sure no leaks into the airbox after the filter. Did your yellow CEL blink at you?
Nice to get the feedback,THanx
ATB Aeroman
Still...... a new MAF sensor would likely improve performance of the engine anyhow! good idea to change your air filter every year & make sure no leaks into the airbox after the filter. Did your yellow CEL blink at you?
Nice to get the feedback,THanx
ATB Aeroman
Post Fiend
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 5,242
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From: Kiev, Ukraine
Henry! Clear all codes and drive somewere around your suburb and read codes againe. I see often very old codes, that were not cleared after reparing. Unfortunatly OBD-II does not save time and date of storing codes, freeze frame only. Volvo truck saves time of every event. So to clean and run againe will show you what the code is really actual. When ECU stores code it usually turns CE light on.
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I never had a CEL show up. I do not have OBDII and had to do KOEO to read codes. Actually I had a KOEO code of 11 (system pass). The MAF (157) and 212 code were in continuous memory. Could they have been old codes? I have had the battery disconnected before so I would assume the codes would have been cleared from long ago.
The van was running rough. Initially I was just going to change the plugs, rotor and cap. After doing that the van ran worse and I noticed my wires arcing. Thats when I read the codes. I probably broke the wire when I changed the plugs and put everything back together the first time.
Anyway, when I went to change the wires I found the #2 plug wire broken at the spark plug connector. I changed the MAF based on the continous memory code and since it only cost $87.00 and it and the wires were original (128000 miles) I felt better knowing they were replaced.
Thanks
The van was running rough. Initially I was just going to change the plugs, rotor and cap. After doing that the van ran worse and I noticed my wires arcing. Thats when I read the codes. I probably broke the wire when I changed the plugs and put everything back together the first time.
Anyway, when I went to change the wires I found the #2 plug wire broken at the spark plug connector. I changed the MAF based on the continous memory code and since it only cost $87.00 and it and the wires were original (128000 miles) I felt better knowing they were replaced.
Thanks
Last edited by ghenryl; Nov 20, 2007 at 01:38 PM.
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