Best Surge Cure
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Tuned
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 453
Likes: 1
From: Montana
Best Surge Cure
I have done alot of research on here but have not found a ton of info on how to best cure turbo surge (I am assuming thats what I have after I did the 6637 mod I get a fluctuating woosh when pulling hard) Anyway I found some posts that says this is no problem and others that say it is a big deal and needs to be fixed ASAP. So the question is is this a big deal and if so what is the easiest way to cure it (Wicked Wheel, ATS Housing, ect...) I eventually plan on Getting the full run of mods (exhaust, guages, valve body, and dp tuner) so I am looking for a good fix.
Thanks
Thanks
Post Fiend
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 9,293
Likes: 10
From: Parker, CO
Are you getting the "woosh" on upshifts or the constant chatter under heavy load?
One is stall, the other is surge.
Stall is the woosh sound. It happens on all the PSD's, just that you can't hear it with the stock airbox.
Surge typically happens under load and with a chip, and goes away immediately when you let off the pedal or downshift. You can also watch surge happening on your boost gauge. The needle will bounce up and down rapidly. You have to really be heavy to get the stock turbo to surge without a chip or tuner. So I'm kinda doubting that you are experiencing surge at the moment.
However, if you are planning to get a chip soon, an ATS housing would be a great upgrade now if you want. Once it's on, you won't have to worry about surge when you do get a chip.
One is stall, the other is surge.
Stall is the woosh sound. It happens on all the PSD's, just that you can't hear it with the stock airbox.
Surge typically happens under load and with a chip, and goes away immediately when you let off the pedal or downshift. You can also watch surge happening on your boost gauge. The needle will bounce up and down rapidly. You have to really be heavy to get the stock turbo to surge without a chip or tuner. So I'm kinda doubting that you are experiencing surge at the moment.
However, if you are planning to get a chip soon, an ATS housing would be a great upgrade now if you want. Once it's on, you won't have to worry about surge when you do get a chip.
Thread Starter
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Tuned
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 453
Likes: 1
From: Montana
I'm getting the chatter when I'm pulling hills I run 10,000lbs of camper and four wheelers and we don't have a whole lot of flat land around here. I know that the back pressure release on the shift is normal and I love that but its the chatter when I'm pulling hard that I'm sure isn't good for the turbo. I'm leaning towards the ATS for the permanent fix and ease of install just got to find away to keep this purchase from the wife.
Thanks for the quick responses FTE ROCKS!!
Thanks for the quick responses FTE ROCKS!!
Post Fiend
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 14,582
Likes: 12
From: 21791
ATS would be the cheapest "permanent fix for it". However if you were planning on the slew of typical mods, i could just go straight to the Turbonetics replacement turbo, so you don't throw away that $425.
Fleet Owner
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 25,090
Likes: 1,112
From: Rio Rico, AZ.
Here's a cheaper alternative that you can pass in front of your wife with minimum hassle and will cure your surging if you don't try and tow on the 120HP tune:
Get a Wicked Wheel.
I tow with a GVW of 24,000lb and that's the only mod that I've done to the turbo.
When I had stock tuning I had the wastegate disabled so the turbo would boost 100% all the time and it never surged.
I can now MAKE it surge but the EGT's are at 1400 and climbing. So for all intents and purposes, my surging has been cured for less than $100.00.
For the record I have the Ford AIS severe duty air intake, extensive fuel supply mods, a 5" exhaust, and the Diablo Predator set to Tow/Haul. I have also reconnected the wastegate and adjusted the control rod so that it won't open before 10 psi of boost. That provides enough power to pull the rig up a 3% grade without downshifting. 4% and it goes down only one gear. I can still accelorate on a 6% grade with no surging.
Get a Wicked Wheel.
I tow with a GVW of 24,000lb and that's the only mod that I've done to the turbo.
When I had stock tuning I had the wastegate disabled so the turbo would boost 100% all the time and it never surged.
I can now MAKE it surge but the EGT's are at 1400 and climbing. So for all intents and purposes, my surging has been cured for less than $100.00.
For the record I have the Ford AIS severe duty air intake, extensive fuel supply mods, a 5" exhaust, and the Diablo Predator set to Tow/Haul. I have also reconnected the wastegate and adjusted the control rod so that it won't open before 10 psi of boost. That provides enough power to pull the rig up a 3% grade without downshifting. 4% and it goes down only one gear. I can still accelorate on a 6% grade with no surging.
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Thread Starter
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Tuned
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 453
Likes: 1
From: Montana
Alright Kwik so if I am reading you right if I go with the WW I won't have this come back up when I get the PCM flash? This truck only moves when its towing so I was just going to go with the flash and probably 40 or 60 hp tow tune so if the Wheel will take care of it that would be great. I would love to go with the new turbonetics but mama wants a new four wheeler this year and what makes mama happy makes me happy.
Thanks for the info.
Thanks for the info.
Fleet Owner
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 25,090
Likes: 1,112
From: Rio Rico, AZ.
With a stock turbo and the WW you won't get any surge until about 26 psi.
Like I said, you can get them to surge, but it takes some work to do so.
Your EGT's will be way over the safety limit.
I recommend the 40 HP tune, (trust me it will feel like 100 compared to stock)
Like I said, you can get them to surge, but it takes some work to do so.
Your EGT's will be way over the safety limit.
I recommend the 40 HP tune, (trust me it will feel like 100 compared to stock)
Thread Starter
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Tuned
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 453
Likes: 1
From: Montana
Sounds good I'm really looking forward to getting all of this stuff done and get the tune. One question though how was the install on the WW? from what I read its time consuming but not to bad. Would you recommend removing the turbo or leaving it in place?
Thanks again for all the help.
Thanks again for all the help.
Fleet Owner
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 25,090
Likes: 1,112
From: Rio Rico, AZ.
Originally Posted by hookd
Sounds good I'm really looking forward to getting all of this stuff done and get the tune. One question though how was the install on the WW? from what I read its time consuming but not to bad. Would you recommend removing the turbo or leaving it in place?
Thanks again for all the help.
Thanks again for all the help.
Do a search for "Johnny8" and look in his gallery. He has a good story in pictures on how it's done on the truck.
Others have removed the turbo. That's a good way to do it if you have any oil leaks that need to be fixed at the same time.
Fleet Owner
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 25,090
Likes: 1,112
From: Rio Rico, AZ.
One more thing. If you want a preview of how it sounds, click on my signature where it says "5"exhaust". I have a page of sound recordings. The one near the bottom was made with a 6637, stock exhaust with a Walker BTM muffler, stock fuel tuning and a disconnected wastegate pulling the trailer up a long hill in Utah.
All the rest of them were made a year later with the current setup of the 5" cannon exhaust and Diablo Predator set on 100 HP not towing anything.
All the rest of them were made a year later with the current setup of the 5" cannon exhaust and Diablo Predator set on 100 HP not towing anything.
Senior User
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 491
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From: Kingsland, GA
Originally Posted by Kwikkordead
I did mine on the truck. It was the quickest and easiest way for me to get it done.
Do a search for "Johnny8" and look in his gallery. He has a good story in pictures on how it's done on the truck.
Others have removed the turbo. That's a good way to do it if you have any oil leaks that need to be fixed at the same time.
Do a search for "Johnny8" and look in his gallery. He has a good story in pictures on how it's done on the truck.
Others have removed the turbo. That's a good way to do it if you have any oil leaks that need to be fixed at the same time.
What is a luggit, the only thing I can relate the sound to is a mack truck starting from a dead stop.