Trade In question:
Elder User
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 550
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From: anchorage, alaska
I got a few friends with them and they like them. I like the room of the ford and the exterior looks but besides that there is no reason to stay. Warranty...No. Fuel economy...NO Power..NO Price....NO
Ford is just out done, now people will probably post up and say dodge is junk, well maybe they are. My question is what so bad about dodge? I know they are kind of cheap and plastic in the interior but I'm talking meat and potatoes.
Ford is just out done, now people will probably post up and say dodge is junk, well maybe they are. My question is what so bad about dodge? I know they are kind of cheap and plastic in the interior but I'm talking meat and potatoes.
Lead Driver
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 6,951
Likes: 512
From: Foothills, CA
I won't say Dodge is junk -- I have several friends with them, and while years ago I personally experienced some of the crap they put out in trucks, I think it's a different story now quality-wise, since the've been bought out by Daimler (plus they've gotten their act together with the Mexican assembly and Mexican assembled Cummins engines). You do need to refresh yourself on the warranty side tho, Dodge is the least of the big three -- their 7/70 powertrain went away some time ago...
I myself, mainly wouldn't consider a Dodge because they don't have the capacity of Ford......
I myself, mainly wouldn't consider a Dodge because they don't have the capacity of Ford......
Senior User
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 217
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From: NH
depreciation
Is someone going to tell me that dodges dont depreciate as fast as fords ?
I know toyota's and honda's (cars) dont depreciate as fast but I would be
surprized if the dodges and GMC's didnt depreciate as fast or faster than fords..
Dodge has the best diesel motor, but from what I've seen the rest of the truck
falls appart.. Chevy I wouldnt even consider ..
I know toyota's and honda's (cars) dont depreciate as fast but I would be
surprized if the dodges and GMC's didnt depreciate as fast or faster than fords..
Dodge has the best diesel motor, but from what I've seen the rest of the truck
falls appart.. Chevy I wouldnt even consider ..
Postmaster
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 2,508
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From: Utopia
IMOP dodge's rattle and look ugly and cheap. and chevs are a 1/2 ton with a diesel and no ground clearence.
I would choose ford first for all around duty including heavy offroad and towing. Second choice for an offroad vehicle I would take a dodge and earplugs. For a freeway runner (unloaded) and mall cruiser I would choose chev.
I would choose ford first for all around duty including heavy offroad and towing. Second choice for an offroad vehicle I would take a dodge and earplugs. For a freeway runner (unloaded) and mall cruiser I would choose chev.
Elder User
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 550
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From: anchorage, alaska
Well looks are one thing, I didn't know they dropped there warranty down. I think dodges depreciation is worse but they are cheaper to start with, last time I checked chevy holds their value well.
Posting Guru
Joined: Mar 2005
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Originally Posted by Customz
IMOP dodge's rattle and look ugly and cheap. and chevs are a 1/2 ton with a diesel and no ground clearence.
I would choose ford first for all around duty including heavy offroad and towing. Second choice for an offroad vehicle I would take a dodge and earplugs. For a freeway runner (unloaded) and mall cruiser I would choose chev.
I would choose ford first for all around duty including heavy offroad and towing. Second choice for an offroad vehicle I would take a dodge and earplugs. For a freeway runner (unloaded) and mall cruiser I would choose chev.
To me, 360 hp pulls better than 325hp just about every day of the week, not to mention the ease of pulling with an allison. I would take that over a sweet built in brake controller any day.
Anyway, I read the autotrader frequently, and there seems to be a lot of low mileage fords for cheap in there. While some of the higher mileage old body style 01-02 duramax vehicles are still bring 18-20k. My dads mint 02 LS Loaded CCLB 4x4 with 80k is bringing 23-25k and he only payed 32k for it new. It lost 7k-9k in 5 years.
Senior User
Joined: Mar 2006
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Originally Posted by duramaximizer
I say this all the time when was the last time you were stuck in a truck? Were you stuck before you were setting on the frame rails? 99% of the time, the truck is stuck long before the truck is setting on the frame rails. So IMO that is irrelevent and GM with IFS would actually have less resistantance and more ground clearance in the front of the truck. Not to mention that GM's have a rear locker that works, vs the limited slips that works for a little while than then are junk.
To me, 360 hp pulls better than 325hp just about every day of the week, not to mention the ease of pulling with an allison. I would take that over a sweet built in brake controller any day.
Anyway, I read the autotrader frequently, and there seems to be a lot of low mileage fords for cheap in there. While some of the higher mileage old body style 01-02 duramax vehicles are still bring 18-20k. My dads mint 02 LS Loaded CCLB 4x4 with 80k is bringing 23-25k and he only payed 32k for it new. It lost 7k-9k in 5 years.
To me, 360 hp pulls better than 325hp just about every day of the week, not to mention the ease of pulling with an allison. I would take that over a sweet built in brake controller any day.
Anyway, I read the autotrader frequently, and there seems to be a lot of low mileage fords for cheap in there. While some of the higher mileage old body style 01-02 duramax vehicles are still bring 18-20k. My dads mint 02 LS Loaded CCLB 4x4 with 80k is bringing 23-25k and he only payed 32k for it new. It lost 7k-9k in 5 years.
Last edited by moldman7n; Nov 6, 2006 at 02:27 PM.
Lead Driver
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 6,951
Likes: 512
From: Foothills, CA
duramaximizer: I know you have an LB7, and frankly, if I'd have had one of those or an LBZ I'm sure I wouldn't have shuch a sour taste in my mouth for the brand. But I've had a series of Chevy trucks and all of them were just not built as strong as the Fords are, comparing year to year and model to model. I lost $9k on my one year old Dmax, I wouldn't sell it myself because I just couldn't misrepresent it to someone (sure, it runs fine, just don't run it on a hot day or it'll 
...).
Local dealers in my area (where it's hot) were onto the reputation of LLYs and even on my flawless truck, would only offer $25k. So I traded it in up north where folks still think they're fine.
And I won't even go into how poorly GM/Chevy options a 3500 truck or that crappy front IFS suspension (it sits on it's bump stops at rest and when empty), thankfully GM is following Ford and Dodge and going to a coil spring finally...
I know you love yours, and I have a number of friends that love theirs (all LB7 and LBZ owners, but they don't do HD work with theirs like I do with my trucks). But GM wouldn't live up to (or stand behind) what they under-designed into the poor LLY, so those trucks just don't cut it at all IMHO.
To each his own, but I've had one too many light duty Chevys to go back to the brand ever again...
...).Local dealers in my area (where it's hot) were onto the reputation of LLYs and even on my flawless truck, would only offer $25k. So I traded it in up north where folks still think they're fine.
And I won't even go into how poorly GM/Chevy options a 3500 truck or that crappy front IFS suspension (it sits on it's bump stops at rest and when empty), thankfully GM is following Ford and Dodge and going to a coil spring finally...
I know you love yours, and I have a number of friends that love theirs (all LB7 and LBZ owners, but they don't do HD work with theirs like I do with my trucks). But GM wouldn't live up to (or stand behind) what they under-designed into the poor LLY, so those trucks just don't cut it at all IMHO.
To each his own, but I've had one too many light duty Chevys to go back to the brand ever again...
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Postmaster
Joined: Sep 2004
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From: Utopia
There is a lot more to ground clearance than getting stuck. Have you ever punctured a fuel tank? Cracked a transfer case? Tweaked a driveshaft or dented the exhaust?
Ever heard of approach/departure/and breakover angles?
I chose the ford for power, reliability, crew cab size, dana 60, appearance, reputation and personal preference.
My truck operates in an open pit hard rock copper mine and I have largely different needs than you. Guess which trucks have the least downtime and operating cost? The Ford SD 4x4. They are also less expensive and admittedly not as cushy.
I also hope you aren't referring to the Gov-lock G80. I exploded one of those in a 2000 and when it fails the truck won't move...when ford's LS wears out it simply becomes an open diff.
So fyi, I tow with a little more than 325 and could really care less about your exposed framerails.
Ever heard of approach/departure/and breakover angles?
I chose the ford for power, reliability, crew cab size, dana 60, appearance, reputation and personal preference.
My truck operates in an open pit hard rock copper mine and I have largely different needs than you. Guess which trucks have the least downtime and operating cost? The Ford SD 4x4. They are also less expensive and admittedly not as cushy.
I also hope you aren't referring to the Gov-lock G80. I exploded one of those in a 2000 and when it fails the truck won't move...when ford's LS wears out it simply becomes an open diff.
So fyi, I tow with a little more than 325 and could really care less about your exposed framerails.
Elder User
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 853
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From: Oregon
duramaximizer: 360 hp yes if it acctually gets to the rear wheels. Your allison has a limp mode that if you push it hard enough you will see what I mean. Great trucks other than no room inside, I'm 6'5", and again no ground clearance. You have to adjust your torsion arms just to fit 285 75 r16 (32.8") tall. Yours stock came with 265 75 r16 (31.6") My F250 came with 285 65 r20 (34.6") so yes there is a ground clearance issue: Try towing a 13,000 lb trailer and have it go into limp mode, I'm sorry but that trany isn't all its supposed to be.....
Lead Driver
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 6,951
Likes: 512
From: Foothills, CA
besides the taco wrappers stuffing the seats?? 
I'm just kidding.... Their auto trans, while more bullet proof than a couple of years ago, still is a standard 4 speed with no tow/haul mode that gives engine breaking. They don't have the weight or towing capacity of the Fords either...
Those are two off the top of my head. I've driven and ridden in my friends '05 a fair bit and it's not bad at all. Funny thing is: he wanted to get a factory exhaust brake added on and for some reason, only the '05s they won't do -- '04s or earlier, fine, '06 fine -- they said if he went aftermarket and something else went wrong with the motor it'd not be warranteed (pissed him off!)....
I'm just kidding.... Their auto trans, while more bullet proof than a couple of years ago, still is a standard 4 speed with no tow/haul mode that gives engine breaking. They don't have the weight or towing capacity of the Fords either...
Those are two off the top of my head. I've driven and ridden in my friends '05 a fair bit and it's not bad at all. Funny thing is: he wanted to get a factory exhaust brake added on and for some reason, only the '05s they won't do -- '04s or earlier, fine, '06 fine -- they said if he went aftermarket and something else went wrong with the motor it'd not be warranteed (pissed him off!)....
Posting Guru
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Originally Posted by Customz
There is a lot more to ground clearance than getting stuck. Have you ever punctured a fuel tank? Cracked a transfer case? Tweaked a driveshaft or dented the exhaust? None of the above.
Ever heard of approach/departure/and breakover angles? Yes
I chose the ford for power, reliability, crew cab size, dana 60, appearance, reputation and personal preference. I don't agree with power or reliablity (ex:6.0)
My truck operates in an open pit hard rock copper mine and I have largely different needs than you. Guess which trucks have the least downtime and operating cost? The Ford SD 4x4. They are also less expensive and admittedly not as cushy. BTW If I was looking to go off roading regularly, I wouldn't own own a CCLB, nor would I own a diesel due to the weight esp in the mud.
I also hope you aren't referring to the Gov-lock G80. I exploded one of those in a 2000 and when it fails the truck won't move...when ford's LS wears out it simply becomes an open diff. You broke one, so that makes them all bad. I have seen tons of unlimited slip diffs.
So fyi, I tow with a little more than 325 and could really care less about your exposed framerails. So do I. I very rarely shift from overdrive with a 29.5' Jayco fiver not including the truck weight of 8600 pounds.
Ever heard of approach/departure/and breakover angles? Yes
I chose the ford for power, reliability, crew cab size, dana 60, appearance, reputation and personal preference. I don't agree with power or reliablity (ex:6.0)
My truck operates in an open pit hard rock copper mine and I have largely different needs than you. Guess which trucks have the least downtime and operating cost? The Ford SD 4x4. They are also less expensive and admittedly not as cushy. BTW If I was looking to go off roading regularly, I wouldn't own own a CCLB, nor would I own a diesel due to the weight esp in the mud.
I also hope you aren't referring to the Gov-lock G80. I exploded one of those in a 2000 and when it fails the truck won't move...when ford's LS wears out it simply becomes an open diff. You broke one, so that makes them all bad. I have seen tons of unlimited slip diffs.
So fyi, I tow with a little more than 325 and could really care less about your exposed framerails. So do I. I very rarely shift from overdrive with a 29.5' Jayco fiver not including the truck weight of 8600 pounds.
What is wrong with cranking torsion bars, it is cheap and have proved to have no reliablity issue with doing it.
As far as I know, the torsion bars remain on the GM900 series unless you can prove the coil springs???????????????
Moldman "The truck is about 3 years away from being worth jack." Well as soon as the new PSD is out, what will your 6.0 be worth, considering I have seen 05's 350's 4x4 CCLB DRW with 40k sell for $20K around here. So how is that for resale, considering what duramax's bring here in NW Ohio.
Elder User
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 853
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From: Oregon
duramaximizer: Wow take a breath. I'm sure your truck is a great truck. But it has its limitations, as does ours. My buds Dmax has gone into limp mode when towing a 9K trailer over the Cascade range and we almost got into an accident because it fell on its face. And yes it was stock...... He now has the new LBZ and he loves it to death as I'm sure you do. Cranking your torsions will cause you problems down the road, and is not reccomended by the factory alignment issues. I am glad you love your truck and I even think they are great. But in my oppinion they are not as HD as the Fords. Good luck with yours
Senior User
Joined: Mar 2006
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Originally Posted by duramaximizer
Moldman "The truck is about 3 years away from being worth jack." Well as soon as the new PSD is out, what will your 6.0 be worth, considering I have seen 05's 350's 4x4 CCLB DRW with 40k sell for $20K around here. So how is that for resale, considering what duramax's bring here in NW Ohio.