Arp or grade 8
Post Fiend
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 14,947
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From: Topsfield, MA
You don't have to buy ARP bolts - ARP bolts would make a stock 5.0 bottom end run to 6500 rpm...but IMO you do need bolts that are ment to be rod bolts. I wouldn't be just going to the hardware store.
Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,279
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From: savannah,ga
think about when the most pressure is on the rod
which direction is the pressure pushing on the crank
intake, crank pulls on rod, min. pressure on bolts
comp., crank pushes on rod no pressure on bolts
power, piston pushes on rod no pressure on bolts
exh., crank pushes on rod no pressure on bolts
there is always min. side pressure on the bolts
unless building a race motor theres no need for special
rod bolts
engineers have already made sure the factory bolts work
which direction is the pressure pushing on the crank
intake, crank pulls on rod, min. pressure on bolts
comp., crank pushes on rod no pressure on bolts
power, piston pushes on rod no pressure on bolts
exh., crank pushes on rod no pressure on bolts
there is always min. side pressure on the bolts
unless building a race motor theres no need for special
rod bolts
engineers have already made sure the factory bolts work
Post Fiend
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 14,947
Likes: 6
From: Topsfield, MA
Well that is just plain untrue (it would have to be scientifically tested to analyse the load on the bolts, ask ARP).
I agree that there is no need for special bolts (like ARP bolts) for a non-race type application...but all I'm saying is don't just go to the hardware store and pick out a bolt.
Buy a bolt specifically made to be a Ford Rod bolt! Whether it's a Ford bolt, or a joe-shmo aftermarket bolt....buy a ROD bolt...
I agree that there is no need for special bolts (like ARP bolts) for a non-race type application...but all I'm saying is don't just go to the hardware store and pick out a bolt.
Buy a bolt specifically made to be a Ford Rod bolt! Whether it's a Ford bolt, or a joe-shmo aftermarket bolt....buy a ROD bolt...
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Fleet Mechanic
Joined: May 2004
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From: Montana
LOL they are ford rod bolts....but you can tell the mains are grade 8 hardware(not from hardware store). I just thought that arp would have there bolts identified with a head marking, most hardware has something on it to identify.
I believe the cam will produce its peak power at 5500 rpm....that might be alittle high, that would put red line just past that. Thats encroaching on 6k.....speaking of 5.0 blocks, I spun my stock 88 5.0 mustang to 6500 rpm several times.
I believe the cam will produce its peak power at 5500 rpm....that might be alittle high, that would put red line just past that. Thats encroaching on 6k.....speaking of 5.0 blocks, I spun my stock 88 5.0 mustang to 6500 rpm several times.
Post Fiend
Joined: Nov 2001
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Likes: 6
From: Topsfield, MA
Originally Posted by EgoMan
LOL they are ford rod bolts....but you can tell the mains are grade 8 hardware(not from hardware store). I just thought that arp would have there bolts identified with a head marking, most hardware has something on it to identify.
I believe the cam will produce its peak power at 5500 rpm....that might be alittle high, that would put red line just past that. Thats encroaching on 6k.....speaking of 5.0 blocks, I spun my stock 88 5.0 mustang to 6500 rpm several times.
I believe the cam will produce its peak power at 5500 rpm....that might be alittle high, that would put red line just past that. Thats encroaching on 6k.....speaking of 5.0 blocks, I spun my stock 88 5.0 mustang to 6500 rpm several times.
Grade 5/Grade 8 all have basic specs like torque to yield strength, peak torque strength, etc.
A bolt such as an ARP rod bolt, does not have the same specs as a standard grade 8 bolt so it doesn't have a marking. It's it's own spec.
Post Fiend
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 14,947
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From: Topsfield, MA
Originally Posted by EgoMan
speaking of 5.0 blocks, I spun my stock 88 5.0 mustang to 6500 rpm several times.
The pistons are rated for it, the rods are able to take it, but the rod bolts are the weakest leak of the assembly there. It'll take 6500, but for how long....
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Fleet Mechanic
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From: Montana
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Post Fiend
Joined: Nov 2001
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From: Topsfield, MA
Redline is redline - redline is not necessarily the engine's highest safe running RPM level.
An engine that redlines at 6000 could very well go much higher and handle it just fine for a long period of time.
With engines, as other similar things, just because it held once or a bunch of times - it doesn't mean it'll hold it over the long run.
The 5.0HO was redline rated at 6250. The truck 5.0 and other normal 5.0's were redline rated at 5500. Their bottom ends would still take the RPM but their design restricts airflow at those RPM where the HO version is different.
Also know that the stock tach can be off by 200+- RPM...
An engine that redlines at 6000 could very well go much higher and handle it just fine for a long period of time.
With engines, as other similar things, just because it held once or a bunch of times - it doesn't mean it'll hold it over the long run.
The 5.0HO was redline rated at 6250. The truck 5.0 and other normal 5.0's were redline rated at 5500. Their bottom ends would still take the RPM but their design restricts airflow at those RPM where the HO version is different.
Also know that the stock tach can be off by 200+- RPM...
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Fleet Mechanic
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From: Montana
no...no... nothing at hardware store, just looking for identifieing marks on the head. I know theres other fastner makers out there that make arp quality racing fasteners so im wondering if you can tell if they are arp's or not just by looking.
Post Fiend
Joined: Nov 2001
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From: Topsfield, MA
ARP bolts have "ARP" stamped in the head. Nobody makes a bolt to ARP specs...they're the best you can buy. My engine has mostly ARP fasteners throughout.
IMO, ARP rod bolts are a no brainer no matter what you're building for a SBF.
IMO, ARP rod bolts are a no brainer no matter what you're building for a SBF.
Last edited by MustangGT221; May 3, 2006 at 11:08 AM.
Post Fiend
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 14,947
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From: Topsfield, MA
But who knows if they're really up to spec of ARP bolts....
Please supply the documentation if you have it but ARP bolts have a long standing reputation and we're not talking big bucks here...to me it's not worth even thinking about. Time is money
I personally would use them in any engine builds I do. You never know when you're plans for the shortblock might change. Say I may have built an engine to stock specs or had it intended to not be pushed over 6000 rpm...but what if 5+ years from now my situation changes and I want to put some bigger H/C/I parts on it and change it's use. If I had the ARP rod bolts in it I'd be just a little better off (and feel more comfortable raising the RPM to 6200-6500). If I had regular bolts in it I'd be screwed. So thats why I personally prefer doing it that way as it's not worth the $$ savings to me.
I wouldn't even hesitate...I'd order up the bolts and move on to the next part of the project.
Please supply the documentation if you have it but ARP bolts have a long standing reputation and we're not talking big bucks here...to me it's not worth even thinking about. Time is money
I personally would use them in any engine builds I do. You never know when you're plans for the shortblock might change. Say I may have built an engine to stock specs or had it intended to not be pushed over 6000 rpm...but what if 5+ years from now my situation changes and I want to put some bigger H/C/I parts on it and change it's use. If I had the ARP rod bolts in it I'd be just a little better off (and feel more comfortable raising the RPM to 6200-6500). If I had regular bolts in it I'd be screwed. So thats why I personally prefer doing it that way as it's not worth the $$ savings to me.
I wouldn't even hesitate...I'd order up the bolts and move on to the next part of the project.
Last edited by MustangGT221; May 4, 2006 at 08:29 AM.
Posting Guru
Joined: Mar 2005
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From: western montana
I AGREE. Some folks are just looking to rebuild and get by and others might just look for the beef later on...it would help put a build out of budget for many though...it's not a lot for some and when yu add it all up it's the 'straw' for others.
I'll buy them and just happened to run on the others lately- so will gather the specs when available w/o a ton of work.
I'll buy them and just happened to run on the others lately- so will gather the specs when available w/o a ton of work.
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