Please read before you bash me on this. I have searched and read, here and a few other boards as well, but mostly found topics on hydro assist.

Ok, the Cardone ford replacement pump, is it as good as the canned ham GM saginaw pumps? I want to use it to build a full hydro steering system for my rockwells. Maybe in the future also use it for a hydro winch. Comments and concerns on this welcome.

Now the part I am having trouble with is what steering valve do I need to do this, there are so many on the market I dont know where to start. Load reactive or no load reactive, then there is the open and closed center valves.
Which one is the closest type to what stock steering is? How much displacement would I need in one to run a double acting cylinder with a 2"-2 1/2" bore properly? The stroke will be between 8 & 9 inches according to my measurements on the steering (front) rockwell.

I fully understand how to hook the parts up, I just dont understand what steering valve I need. I thought about hydro assist but it cost the same amount and Id still have to use the stock gear box and buy pretty much everything I would for a full hydro system, plus all of the steering linkage to mate up to the rockwell and the hydro stuff anyway.

This will only be used off road, I know someone will post saying, full hydro is not legal on the street. This truck will only go to play on the back of a trailer.

Thanks fellers, Dave

 

You want a load reactive valve but you also have to be careful how it's set up so you have an appropriate turn to turn combo for a truck. I think it's 2 turns lock to lock that you want but don't remember for sure. If you want to double check just hop in a stock truck and turn it full left to full right . . . that's the same lock to lock you'll want for your hydro valve. The guy you really want to contact about this is Sean with Performance Offroad Systems (POS). You can reach him by phone at 334-567-7229. He also sells the rams and all that mess if you need them. He's really helpful and his prices are excellent too. I'm going to be using his parts when I do a rear steer axle.

The Sag pump is WAY better than the Ford pump. Talk to Sean and he can help you out here too but most of the guys I've seen with full hydro use Sag pumps with an extra resevior.

Btw, we've argued this a hundred times. I still don't believe and have yet to be shown proof that it is illegal to run full hydro on the street.

 

Thanks for the info Ivan, thats what I needed to know. Man that stuff can be confusing, I was gettin p.o.ed with doin all the searching and reading only to find it was for hydro assist.
Tomorrow morning I going to take my cores in and order 2 of those Cardone saginaw replacement pump an keep one for later. Thanks Dave

 

But but but... they said it on TV!

 

ive seen proof that you must have mechanical linkage to steering parts for TX, but i dont know about WV or WA or OR

 

Yeah in WV its in the code that a street vehicle must have a mechanical link for steering. In WV it also says there must be a brake mounted at each wheeled corner of a vehicle(some crap along that line) incase there is a break in the drivetrain, and at least one drive axle must have a brake with mechanical link(parking brake), and.....ah, thats enough, this is why i'm using a trailer.
Around here you can ask 20 cops on whats legal and get 25 different answers, the best thing to do is get a state and any local codebooks for wherever you live and readem yourself, public libraries usually keep them updated and on hand. If you ever set down and read one for a while it becomes clear why there is so much confusion and debate on these topics.

One in our codes is for modified vehicle stickers, the code says if the factory height is modified from stock (lifted) it must have a modified vehicle state inspection sticker(it cost $45 to get one), but you can lower a vehicle and not have to have one, the cops dont even mess with the people with lowered vehicles.
Anyway, Politicians suck. See ya, Dave

 

Thanks for the tip on the billa write up, its long but very helpful. One thing that caught my eye is the open center with power beyond. I wonder if it could power a MM hydro winch? The article says the 5th port can just be plugged until needed and when used it will always give the priority flow to the steering circuit, but how often do ya have to turn your wheels when winching, esp. in mud.

I've looked at the kits like the ones from AGR and a couple other places, fairly expensive. Fishman if you built yours so cheap, where did you get yours? Everywhere I looked the char-lynn valve alone was a few dollars under $400

Thanks again, Dave

 

no no.... hydro assist does not use a char-lyn valve. i only have assit, not full hydro!

i bought all the components piece by piece from local suppliers.

-cutts-

 

sorry fishman, i misread your post, i thought you meant you built a full hydro for that amount. I want to go full hydro for the ease and power it offers.
And im still reading the billa article, good info . Dave

 

I am running the performance off road systems full hydro setup, it cost me around 1,200 bones, minus the reservoure & lines, well worth it, this system works great, so far, when bleeding the system I used a 1/2" drill to turn the pump, & the G.F. could turn the 44" tires with full weight using a couple fingers, (I understand the jokes that could be made from this comment)
One thing I think should be noted is fishy said 2" max cylinder dia. but the bigger the rod the bigger the cylinder needs to be, the P.O.S. unit has a 1.5" rod so the 2.5" cylinder is not out of line for size,

 

when and if i ever go the full hydro route, im going down to the local scrapyard Fineburgs, and taking all the parts off of one of the 10 or so junk forklifs, theres the valves and whatnot.

 

Be aware that most forklifts do not have a load sensing orbitrol valve, therefore you will have to return the steering back to center after making the turn, whereas with the load sensing valve & correct steering geometry it will return like reagular power steering,

 

never thought about that, but dont think that would bug me to much.