All propane storage tanks have both vapor and liquid present. Vapor phase systems draw from the top of the tankand liquid phase draw from the bottom. Vapor phase is more controllable because it is easy to control the amont of propane injected by regulating the out put pressure of the regulator; thus vapor pase systems like my Powershot 2000 are constantly variable systems as boost increases propane increases. Liquid phase systems attempt to control the amount of propane by regulating the flow of liquid propane and converting it to vapor in an expansion chamber at the point of injection. Most liquid phase systems increase propane in stages by opening additional jets at preset boost trigger points each jet flows propane at a constant rate. Basically Vapor phase systems increase flow like walking up a ramp and liquid phase systems increase flow like walking up stairs.

Vapor phase systems are safer than liquid phase.
You should actually say "No system intentionally injects liquid propane" In the event of a liquid system regulator malfunction under the right circumstances, like shortly after start up, it's conceivable that liquid propane could be introduced into the engine where a vapor phase system regulator malfunction would only result an excess of propane vapor. One drop of liquid propane will destroy your engine.

 

I think you just answered your own question.

say no to drugs Jake.

Diesel Rod

 

yeah, thats what im back to just need more good ole #2, i was liking the propane on the fact that i can just turn it off. not quite that easy with my right foot. ive had this truck 9 years and i still cant fix that throttle sticking problem.

 

I dont see how I answered my own question. In fact I don't believe I asked a question.
I disagree completely with your characterization of propane as "drugs" that would apply to nitrous which is an oxidizer and promotes more rapid almost explosive burns. Propane is simply another fuel it can be and often is run as the only fuel, if your engine is set up to do so.
I maintain that vapor phase systems are very safe if properly adjusted. Liquid phase systems are safe with a couple of drawbacks. If you want towing power you can get it when you need it because you can turn propane on and off at will.
Can you turn injectors off so you dont waste so much fuel at $3+ per gallon?

 

Hey, why not both? I run propane and love it and I'm planning on adding mild injector upgrades in a couple of months (more than likely just some ("Babies"). There are pros and cons to both ways of making HP. For moderate gains I truly believe that propane is safer, very cost effective, and more efficient. If you want to make large amounts of HP, are not worried about efficiency, and are willing to Intercool or use a water/meth injection then large injectors are the way to go. Just had to throw my 2 cents in.

Max

 

Jake lets talk basics. Your goal is to get more fuel into the combustion chamber.

You can do that by installing larger injectors. Depending on the injectors you choose you may also have to install a new HPOP and a new fuel system to get the injectors to work at their designed flow rate. Adding more fuel is going to increase EGT, thats a fact, so you may have to add water injection and reconnect that intercooler.

A simpler less expensive way of increasing available fuel is adding propane. First propane is simply another hydrocarbon chain albeit a short one. It burns like any other hydrocarbon fuel. Propane flashes at a slightly lower temp than diesel. Because propane is brought into the combustion chamber with the air supply it gets compressed and starts to burn just before the diesel is injected. Since the diesel is injected into a burning environment more of it is burned. A typical diesel engine burns about 70% of the injected fuel by injecting propane the same engine burns 90 t0 95% of the fuel.

According to several sites I have visited the OBS truck injectors flow at 95 cubic millimeters (CMMs) and the NBS trucks flow 120 CMMs thats why they added the intercooler.

By adding propane to an OBS truck you increase the amount of fuel used from 65 CMMs (95 CMMs flowed X 70% used) to 90 CMMs (95 CMMs flowed X 95% used). Lets assume your going to get some Baby Swamps. They flow 150 CMMs which means you are going to actually burn 105 CMMs of diesel (150 CMMs X 70% used) a net increase of 15 CMMs burned fuel.

Now do the math you can buy a propane system with a tank and get it installed for about the cost of the Baby Swamps. You still have to pay for installation and all the other stuff you may need to support it, not to mention the new tranny or clutch you are likely to need.

 

Well said!

Max

 

why cant this be easy....well if i go propane its gonna be the msd system. all the extra technology in that gear makes me a little more comfortable. i rode in quadzillas truck and it hauls butt. and its got 35's on it. and not running 100% right now. (mystery fuel leak) we cant seem to nail down. give that another go this weekend.

i can get it to burn at a higher effecency with more boost and timing advance. but i still like how i can flip a switch and get back to normal. gene over at socaps turned 380rwhp in a early 99 with propane....i dont want to go back to that.....too many headaches. oil seems to stay cleaner longer with a little propane in the mix too.....


hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

 

In reading this whole tread, there is one thing that bothers me. Its the statement by Diesel Rod about 'odd cylinder pressure spikes'. I run the PS2000 on about 50% of max and love what is does for my towing. Am I slowly ruining my engine???

 

im not sure about the cylinder pressure spikes. i havent heard about that one. like every one has said in moderation.....i dont think you have to worry bout it.

 

As long as you have your system tuned properly, no "ping" under very hard acceleration, you should be fine.


BarebackJake
If you have access to Quadzilla you have access to the best. BTW tell him we miss him here.

 

I was reading what you guys said here, and I have some questions about a system that came on my truck. I have a 96 CC f-350 auto. I bought it with a bullydog system on it. Now I think it must be a older version cause it dosen't have any computer or monitor sensors. Its a simple switch and pump. I know that it dosen't even have the coolant hooked up to it for vaporizing the propane. Is that bad? My system dosen't have the ability or hook ups for the coolant hoses. Is my system dangerous? I have used it a couple of times. I just have a toggle switch that I turn on to activate the pump. Can any one tell more on this subject? Thanks

 

Bullydog propane systems are liquid phase systems and as such are inherently more troublesome than vapor phase systems.

There is a risk, slight but real, that a drop of liquid propane could enter the motor and that would be disasterous.

The system you describe seems to be a single step system , one that dumps a measured amount of propane in a specific period of time, they tend to oversupply propane at low boost and under supply at high boost. The systems with sensors to monitor boost usually have more than one smaller jets and activate them as demand (indicated by boost) increases, they are called multi step systems. Single step systems are fairly inefficient.

If it were my truck I would not use it until I could get it checked out. Turn off the propane valve at the tank and dont turn the swithch on.
If you want propane injection consider changing to a vapor phase system, they are safer and some, like the PowerShot 2000, have a constantly variable rate of flow.

Last points you won't realize the full potential of propane injection without an appropriate chip and your playing with fire if you dont have an EGT gauge hooked up.

 

What did you mean by checked out? I'm not so sure that I can resist not using it especialy since I know that it does work. Is there some safety feature I can add to it. I have other plans for my savings in upgrades right now, but I sure would like to be able to use the system.

 

The main thing is the regulator. Be sure it is working properly.
I would also be concerned about the lack of a vaporization chamber.
Try to contact Bullydog they may have some sort of evaluation protocol