Hey all, wonderful September day here in Mass. I have a question for anyone who can help or give ideas/suggestions. First the intro. I have a 1986 F-250 HD 4x4. It has a 351W with an Edelbrock 351 Performer aluminum intake, a Holley 750 4bbl carb, an Extreme 4x4 camshaft (for that rough idle sound), some sort of custom long headers, and Flowmaster mufflers. I recently replaced the radiator, hoses, thermostat, starter (even put a starter shim on to maybe extend the life of it). Ever since I bought the truck this past February, it's been running really strong with no major problems, however there has always been a sort of "clicking" sound. I had the Flowmasters put on and replaced all the exhaust pipe from the collection pipe at the headers, thinking maybe this "clicking" was actually a rapid putting sound of an exhaust leak. Well, it was still there, I figured it would be. There were two bolts missing from the front drivers side header, which I thought maybe this was where the clicking or putting sound was coming from. I replaced those two bolts. No difference. After a bit, I began to think maybe the timing was off some, cause it wouldn't make the sound when i was idling or stopped at a light. So I played with my distributor, turning it a bit. I even did the trick where you put the truck in drive and rev the engine while someone turns the distributor till a clicking sound starts and then go from there to find the optimum range where it should be. Still, no diff! Now the truck makes a loud, pretty obscene, obvious clicking, coming from the drivers side of the engine, but it does it all the time, and gets faster as the rpms go up. SO I'm kinda sure it's the lifters. Does this seem to be the case from my story? Am I accurate in my self diagnostic? What could I expect to pay for new lifters and to have them installed? $50 for lifters and maybe $100 for labor? How long of a job is it? and could I do it myself? I am pretty inclined at working on my truck, but mostly just fine tuning stuff and replacing parts like alternator, starter, fuel pump, carb, stuff like that. I've never actually touched the guts of the truck, and I'm kind of weary to start doing that. Oh, by the way, another problem I'm experiencing...When I lay on the gas and get up around 3500-4000 rpms and then lay off the gas, I get a distinct odor of fuel that sticks around for maybe 10 seconds and then is gone. Do I have a fuel leak somewhere that I don't know about? amI flooding the engine when I do this and then smelling the "spillage"? I would think I'd stall out of I was flooding the engine....ok, I'm done. Sorry about the length of this, but I wanted to get every detail in. Please, anyone with any similar problems or ideas help me, any advice at all would be appreciated. I'm planning on going to a shop to get some ideas later today at lunch, but I just wanted to see if any fellow Ford guys out there knew anything of this or had the same situation. Thanks alot, guys.

Ryan
1986 F-250 HD 4x4
351W, Edelbrock 351 Performer aluminum intake
Holley 750 4bbl carb
Extreme 4x4 Camshaft
Flowmaster true dual exhaust w/ custom long headers
3" body lift by Warn

 

You say you put an extreme 4x4 cam in the engine. Did you change or check the valve springs for clearanc on the rocker arms. Some times the extra lift will cause the under side of the rocker arm to contact the edge of the valve spring retainer and cause a noise such as you describe. Just something to check before you spend money on a set of lifters.

 

Well that's just the thing...the extreme 4x4 cam was already in there when I bought the truck off the guy, so I've never seen under the covers so to speak. When I first bought the truck, it made A clicking sound, not the same as this. I took care of that clicking/pinging by running 93 octane rather than your normal 87, and rotating my distributor a bit...that sound went away. Just the other day this sound started, and I'm almost positive it's the lifters, problem is the sound was never there, or maybe it was there but not as bad and I never noticed it cause of my exhaust...it's real loud the exhaust. So I don't think it's a case of the rocker arms not having enough clearance, I would think they always would have sounded like that after the guy installed it, yet this just started the other day....

Ryan
1986 F-250 HD 4x4
351W, Edelbrock 351 Performer aluminum intake
Holley 750 4bbl carb
Flowmaster true dual exhaust w/ custom long headers
3" body lift by Warn

 

I would go ahead and replace the header gaskets just to make sure. When you have loose bolts, that's when the gaskets blow out. This would also explain the gas smell, if it's an exhaust leak in the engine compartment. If it ends up being the lifters, have you run any engine treatment in the engine? I have had good luck with Rislone. It's a very high detergent oil additive that can knock loose any gum that might be causing your lifters to be noisy.

 

Wow, I'm glad I have people to talk to who know there stuff! I am ok when it comes to knowledge of my truck, but this was stumping me, whether it was lifters or timing or gaskets...and thanks to you, I'm now 90% sure it's gaskets. I went to see a mech during lunch and told him my story. I told him I found a few websites selling lifters and cam sets for $150 to $200, and he said no way, cause my truck probably uses "roller lifters" or somehing to that effect, which could set me back $80 for each of the 16 lifters, and as much of a total as $1000. I said no thanks, as much as I love this truck, I'm not sinking $1000 into that, as embarassing as the sound is. SO he said let me take a look at it. I showed him, started it up. First thing he said was, "that's more of a putting sound, not metallic tinging sound like lifters make...sounds like an exhaust leak." So we look at my headers...he sees the two bolts missing from the front of the drivers side header, along with one missing in the back that I never noticed, as well as a missing bolt mid-header on the pass side. He says "before you even go thinking it's another problem, fix that up...replace the header gaskets and use new header bolts, and tighten them (get what he says now...) Gorilla Ape $#!^ tight!" I laughed pretty hard at that but he said "no, really, get them as tight as you possibly can to squish that gasket tight." So I guess that's my next step, if it doesn't pour rain here after work! I'm really hoping this is it, and it would make sense, because 4 bolts total are missing from the headers, so the gaskets very well may have blown out, and there is that distinct smell of gas, not so much exhaust, though, that is more than likely filling the engine compartment and then whisping away fast. God, I can't thank you guys enough, I really hope this is all there is to my probl;em, cause it's such a strong running, good sounding truck, except for the embarrasing leaking putting sound. Now the only question is where do I get a gasket to fit these custom headers? I don't know what brand they are, only that they appear to be 1 1/2" round tubing. I went to Autozone and found close to ten diff kinds of gaskets, but all there were for the Chevy engines. I think they're biased over there! They didn't have any bolts, either...so my next step is to try Indy Auto Parts on Rt. 1 in Danvers or PV Performance Parts in Malden, Mass. Who knows, I really hope this works, I want my truck to sound as bad-@$$ as it did before!!!

Ryan
1986 F-250 HD 4x4
351W, Edelbrock 351 Performer aluminum intake
Holley 750 4bbl carb
Flowmaster true dual exhaust w/ custom long headers
3" body lift by Warn

 

Well,
No matter what he says I would not over tighten the header bolts. Take them to the correct torque and leave it at that. Trying to tighten like a you no what usually only breaks things. This is why they have a torque spec.

Do it right and you may never have to do it again.

Mark

 

this is true for most applications, but isn't that why they actually make special header bolts from hardened grade 8 or higher heated steel? and they have a smaller head to fit clost to the header tubes...I dunno...I think I will take that advice though and tighten them to torque spec...anyone know what that spec is? or would it be in my Haynes manual? I'm pretty sure the header bolts would have the same specs as exhaust manifold bolts...

Ryan
1986 F-250 HD 4x4
351W, Edelbrock 351 Performer aluminum intake
Holley 750 4bbl carb
Flowmaster true dual exhaust w/ custom long headers
3" body lift by Warn

 

Jist redid my 351W I can tell you it was not that high of a torque. Make sure you double check with the Haynes book and I would also contact the make of the headers.

Nothing worse than having to drill a grade 8 bolt due to breakage. Had one that had snaped the head off due to manifold warpage....

Mark

 

The gasket needs to match the head. The headers use the same gasket as the stock manifolds. However, I would first get a good set of gaskets like ROL or Bison. I've got the Bison gaskets on my 351W with the Thorley headers. They are fairly thick and the Thorleys' have a thick header flange, so it takes a longer header bolt. If you use the standard cardboard type gaskets, at least double the gaskets up. Put in some good new bolts and torque them to spec. Then....this is important.....re-tighten them after the first hour of use, re-tighten them everyday for 5 days, re-tighten them once a week for 1 month, and check them once a month until they do not back out. Then check them with each oil change.

Ask at the counter for header gaskets and bolts for your 351W at any parts store and they should have them in stock.

'82 F150 2WD w/351W (orig 300 I6)
Slik

 

I hope this is all it will take. I really have no clue what brand headers they are. I just know they are long headers that are custom bent...the guy I bought it off of might have done it himself, he was a mechanic. How can I tell what brand? I know I can't find it on the tubing cause they are pretty rusted with surface rust, and I don't wanna spend a week cleaning them off. Would it be right on the plate of the header? I may in a few months just go get some new ones, I've heard Pacesetters are pretty god, so isn't Gibson

Ryan
1986 F-250 HD 4x4
351W, Edelbrock 351 Performer aluminum intake
Holley 750 4bbl carb
Flowmaster tue dual exhaust w/ custom long headers
3" body lift by Warn

 

Well guys, I can't thank you all enough. After work yesterday I went to Indy Auto Parts on Rt. 1 in Peabody, great place by the way, check em out onthe web. I told the guy my situation. I knew right when I walked in he was the guy I wanted to talk to cause he was talking all about his 460 big block! So I told him the sound she made, the click, and he said right away it's the exhaust. He told me he had a tiny pinhole leak in his exhaust that drove him nuts...and the fact that I was missing three bolts from one side was a sure thing. So I bought the Mr. Gasket grade 5 steel header bolts and lock washers, and Mr. Gasket copper header gaskets. $40 for the gaskets, but they're supposed to be really good because the copper won't blow out or rip apart like the fiber ones, and the copper as it is tightened basically makes an airtight mold to the header. So I get home, hoping to god I'm not gonna break off a bolt on the header...and well, the bolts were all a bit loose actually, came out with no problems. The only major problems I had were pulling the header far enough away from the block to remove the old gasket and put in the new one. It only pulled away about an inch, not much play in them at all. I probably coulda wedged it away, but I've don't plenty of puling on my pass side header when I put in my starter...it was conveniently placed right in the way!!! The other problem was actually getting the bolts started, that's quite a pain, once they were started there were no real problems, bt for 3 of them which were so close to the header tubing I couldn't get a socket around them, so I had to use an open faced wrench and make 1/8 turns about 100 times!!! In anycase, that solved my problem, no more annoying tick, not sheepish to pull up to a chevy or dodge and rock em off the line anymore. She's back to her big loud beatiful rumbling self again! Tonight it's the passenger side header hasket, hopefully I won't run into anymore trouble. Thanks again guys!

Ryan
1986 F-250 HD 4x4
351W, Edelbrock 351 Performer aluminum intake
Holley 750 4bbl carb
Extreme 4x4 camshaft
Flowmaster true dual exhaust w/ custom long headers
3" body lift by Warn