Why does it cost less to install, build, or buy a cheby engine (in particular a 350)? Since Ford has been the best selling truck for 20 something years I thought it would cost less than Cheby. I am not looking for responses like Chevy sucks, or Ford rules, but a logical answer because I cannot figure this out myself!

 

It's really since the most amount of aftermarket $$ that has gone into producing parts for the SBC. The SBC has been around since the mid 50's in some form or another. Ford has only been producing the Windsor style motors since about '62. When the SBC came out there was a good, easily modified engine that was modern, unlike the flatheads and Y-Blocks, which just didn't respond as well to the mods that the Chevy could. As much as I hate to admit the Chevy is a good motor that can take a lot of modifications. I personally always run FoMoCo motors in any of my Ford cars and trucks. But if I had a Chevy, I'd probably build up a SBC...even though they are like bellybuttons, everybody's got one.

Gary
==============================
46 truck-6cyl now, 302/C4 soon
46 truck-flathead 8, 4spd
47 truck-getting a 429/C6
57 Ford FL 500-4 dr-312/AT
70 Mustang fastback-351W/FMX
72 Olds Vista Cruiser-350/AT
88 Bronco II, 500,000+ mi.

 

Ahh the good old days when Flat Heads were king!!
Mind you,I'm not that old so I can only go on info that was told to me. It's kind of like the IBM - MAC deal. Companies produce the parts for the majority before they get to the minorities.

For the business I'm in, 99% is chebby, cost efficient, when your sinking 30k to 40k in a race motor, it hurts bad enough, not many people want to go the extra 5k to 10k, just so they can say they run a ford. Parts are in abundence for chebbies and there proven, seems nobody has the time or money for the R&D involved in running a Ford. Nobody wants to get to the track to give something a try when there's money to be won, and every dollar you win goes back into your race opperation.

This is based on "real world" racing and not Nascar, where a seasons worth of money spent could feed a thrid world nation for a year.

***** A.

 

in a few years people will be switching to ford motor because they want to be different. Oh btw, you can build a 351c that around 320hp and near 400ft/torque for around $2500 Canadian, the you can add nitrous(150 hp shot) for about 600$(i think correct me if I'm wrong). Chebys sb crate motors aren't even that cheap. (I'm sick of seeing those)


82' Flareside with 400 horse under the hood

 

>in a few years people will be switching to ford motor
>because they want to be different. Oh btw, you can build a
>351c that around 320hp and near 400ft/torque for around
>$2500 Canadian, the you can add nitrous(150 hp shot) for
>about 600$(i think correct me if I'm wrong). Chebys sb
>crate motors aren't even that cheap. (I'm sick of seeing
>those)
>



Im sure you could build a nice little street motor for $2500, and with the shot of nitrous, you would probably be one of the fastest guys on your block. But for the applications my customers need, there are rules, cam rules, head rules, piston rules, valve rules, intake rules, etc. In the world of sanctioned racing, run what you brung, doesnt apply.
$2500 wouldnt even cover the dyno time involved in building one of their race motors.

Im not sure of the exchange rate for Canadian vs. American money but I thought it was around 38%, so here in NY your $2500 = around $1550.
That isn't going far in either country, when it comes to a profesional rebuild for a regular commuter motor let alone a "prefomance" motor build up.

As far as people switching to ford to be different, I don't see it that way. The generation of kids today are building up their 4 cylinders, in their mitubishies, toyotas and hondas, the "next generation" won't even know what a 8 cylinder is unless they heard about it from people like us. We are a dying breed , when it comes to street preformance type build ups. Most people seem to have a bond with the cars of their times, my dad loved 30's and 40's, me being born in the 60's have a love for the muscle cars of the 60's era.
A typical 16 year old kid now a days wants something that he saw in the fast and the furious movie. I get at least 3 kids a week stop by my shop because they want a roll cage, of course when I tell them how much it will cost them, they get depressed and leave but just about all of them have some little 4 cylinder with a huge stereo and neon lights underneath their cars. The majority of "kids" today have no idea what 351w is or a 351c, heck they don't even know where Cleveland is.

I have a 39 Ford coupe, 68 Pontiac GTO and a 71 Olds 442, all street cars and all show winners, I think the only motor I have less than 5k in is the olds. When you do things the correct way with top shelf parts it cost a LOT of money, the days of The Dukes of Hazzard advancing their timming with a fishing sinker is gone.


I went off on such a rant, I forgot what my point is...Oh ya.
It's easy to see there are more after market parts available for a chebby than a ford and 99% of the time they are a lot cheaper.
Just by walking in a performance parts store and looking at what they have hanging on their walls is proof enough.
How many times have you looked in a aftermarket parts catalog and seen a ton of listings for a Chebby and when you look for ford it list 1 part or tells you to call for your application.

I'm all for being "different", heck my new project is a 69 AMX but as for the majority, they will always take the easiest , cheapest way out, and do what they think will let them "fit in", and the parts manufactures will listen to the majority before they listen to the minority.

I'm sure a lot of people will disagree, this is just from what I see and observe in my business dealings, at car shows and at the race tracks of the east coast.

***** A.

 

*****,
Loved that reply, man. Especially about the Dukes of Hazzard.LOL. You're right on the money though. When I raced, you had to wait in the staging lane for an hour because of honda's, toyota's, nissan's, and the like who wanted to make their 14-16 second runs. I would sit in line with maybe 2-3 mustangs and 5 or so camaros and the odd chevelle or mopar and 30-40 imports with the Huge exhaust tip. What's up with that? We are indeed on our way out. The kids who did have the later model musclecars all believe the ads and can qoute you that they have "around 550 HP" because they added up all their bolt-ons. Then they don't understand when They're whipped by a beat-up '79 capri with an "almost-stock" looking engine. If you're like me there is a wealth of satisfaction in that. But I'm sentimental. If you lament the fact of your generations passing, I only caught the tail-end of it. That's like a tease for a car-lover. Whoever said life was fair......

 

WE ARE A DIEING BREED
I get kids all the time into my shop wanting this and that for these little import cars. I'm not sure why they bring them to me when the name of the business says it all Off-road & Accessories well my name also goes around for fabricating and such. But I like the kid that asked me how fast does your truck go ??? I give him a serious look and say at 3000 RPM I am going 62 MPH. They look at me and say I thought it was a performance truck ??? I tell them it is. They get that confused look and go HUH !!! I tell them line your imports up in front of my truck broad side and you'll see what I mean.
kids today have no idea about what performance is all they see is NOS and low profile tires and a coffee can with a couple bum bull bees in it. I told a guy that just moved down here to AZ and told him we don't have mosquitos down here he asked why not ?? I sad all the teenagers caught them and put them in a coffee can on their cars.
Anyway it is up to us old timers to keep the next generation informed about what performance really is and keep true performance alive.
Don't turn away the ignorant educate them.

 

I did see a show awhile back about classic cars. They were interviewing car owners at some big show. They were interviewing the owner of a beautiful Model A. When the owner opened the hood, the interviewer got a very puzzled look on his face and asked what engine is that. The owner said it's a 390, mated to a toploader, and backed by a 9" rearend. Then the owner added "I prefer to keep my Fords all Ford."
I had a tear in my eye after that.

Roger Lane

 

[updated:LAST EDITED ON 21-Mar-02 AT 10:50 AM (EST)]Damn right! Keep a Ford a FORD!

Makes me sick to see a nice old hotrod ford with a corvette engine in it!

But I always laugh when a guy is describing his ford or chevy car with a chevy engine and a 9 inch ford rearend!

 

I think it went all down hill when companies like summit and others offer "direct bolt in kits" like nitrous, etc for the masses. Remeber when you actually had to do research and talk to peolpe about what cam - carb- manifold, etc, combinations would work for your application? They make it to easy for people with no knowledge to bolt parts in there cars that they dont even know what the parts do. Another thing thats gets me is, do we really care if our 4 by's are fast? Not me, I have other toys to do that with and wouldn't expect them to crawl throught mud or over rocks or pull my trailers, so whats the deal with that?
I only say this because I saw a post like " fast 4x4" or something.

All in all, I think it's too easy for some poser with money to bolt performance parts in their rides and not know the first thing about how the part actually works or how it will effect the rest of the setup. A real race motor is built for a lot of things, longevity being one of the most important. When you bolt NOS on a stock motor it's going to gernade, I dont care what the "tech" guys at summit tell you or your buddies friends brother's uncle.
Too many people with no knowledge doing things that they shouldn't!!
Remeber the weakest link therory.

As for the kids and their little buzz boxes, to each his own I guess, just not for me. If they got the money, Ill do what I can to take it from them!!

As for adding up the advertisers hp gains if you buy our parts, If that was the case , I would be racing the space shuttle by now!!
It takes $$$ to make HP and a lot more than $2500 Canadian.
Iv'e seen people spend thousands just for 10 more...It's like a crack habbit only legal!!

I could go on for hours but, I'll save you from my ramblings!!

 

[updated:LAST EDITED ON 21-Mar-02 AT 03:49 PM (EST)]I'm reading this and it seems as if a lot of the previous posts talk about how today's younger generation don't know what a V8 is or don't care. This simply is not true. I am 21, I have been wrenching on classic American cars since I was 15. All I know is V8's, I won't know where the hell to find part 'X' on a Honda 4 cyl, but I know my way around V8's. I know of lots of younger kids that know classic muscle. My fiancee's friend drives a '70 Monte Carlo with a 350 4Bbl. The town she grew up in was full of kids driving Chevelles, Mustangs, El Caminos, '70's 4x4 trucks, and all kinds of other classic cars. Very few kids in the area drove any of those little rice cars. A lot of kids don't know muscle cars as well as new cars, but a lot would like to have an old car. So many high schoolers want a classic Mustang, wether for performance or for looks, they want one. You'll get more girls driving a nice '65 Mustang than you will driving a bright yellow Honda Civic. The age of people not knowing what a V8 is is not going to come any time soon.

Gary
==============================
46 truck-6cyl now, 302/C4 soon
46 truck-flathead 8, 4spd
47 truck-getting a 429/C6
57 Ford FL 500-4 dr-312/AT
70 Mustang fastback-351W/FMX
72 Olds Vista Cruiser-350/AT
88 Bronco II, 500,000+ mi.

 

This might ramble a bit...but:
I have a 10 year old nephew, he is absolutely
nutty about cars, and not new cars either, his
dad, my brother, has had a couple of really cool
rides in the stable, a 66 Mustang, a 70 Nova,
a 77 chub low rider. He wants my 73 Capri when
he turns 16, I told him if he wants it, he's got
to buy it. We have agreed on a price...The point
of this here post, I have no idea, but I'm just
saying, kids follow in their parents tracks, and
if those tracks lead them to old cars, the hobby
will never die...

Steve & the Rockette
'63 F100
'68 F100
'72 Capri 2L
'73 Capri 2.6L V6
'73 MG B GT 2.6L V6(Ford)
'98 Contour SVT 2.5L V6 (Mods)
'01 ZX2 (No Mods yet)

 

Kids today look to their 4-banger street machines because they are CHEAP and they are EVERYWHERE! When's the last time you found a nice looking, nice running musclecar for under $6k? They're out there but they are rare! Prices for classic cars are skyrocketing because the musclecar generation is finally realizing that everything that represented Detroit power and *class* doesn't exist anymore (except for a handful). Classic muscle is in high demand and if you don't have the $$ to pony up then there's always a $2000 Honda around the corner that you can make scream for under $1000, will not rattle when you put 8 subwoofers in the trunk (they're made of plastic), and get 40mpg (important when you're on an allowance). I've been looking for a decent '65 Fastback for 3 years and haven't come across one that wasn't either junk or $20k. Ricers are here to stay whether we like it or not... just as snowboarding in the early 90's.

 

I agree, it's up to us to keep the "kids" of today on the "right" track. Like you said, I aquired my love for older cars and racing from my father. My dad always told me muscle cars were junk and real cars had fenders, reffering to the cars of the 30's and 40's, which I liked but not as much as the musce cars. Now ,I know my dad didn't mean it cause I caught him once bragging to the niehbors about my 70 road runner, but he wouldn't tell me it was cool. Im sure there are tons of kids who love the old cars and v8's, but the burners are an up and comming thing no denying it.

 

[updated:LAST EDITED ON 21-Mar-02 AT 07:15 PM (EST)]Sturzinator, I take offense to your last comment.....I SNOWBOARD!!