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1995 460 Running Poorly

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Old Jul 14, 2024 | 04:06 PM
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1995 460 Running Poorly

I just bought a 1995 F-350 Centurion with a 460 and an E4OD, guy sold it to me for next to nothing because it needs a lot of work. It has like an intermittent misfire, it will happen at idle and then after a few seconds the it goes away and the truck idles fine, it does this over and over again. It also has little to no power, takes forever to accelerate and smells very rich when you get on it. I ran both a KOEO and a KOER test, didn’t throw any codes and the truck didn’t have a check engine light either prior to this. It had two codes stored in memory, 212 C which was thrown during the KOEO test, (code is listed as “loss of ignition diagnostic monitor signal/SPOUT circuit grounded”) I figured this was most definitely the problem, I don’t know what that means though or how to fix it and/or what to look for. The truck has had the distributor, plug wires, coil, and I believe plugs as well all replaced before I bought it in an effort to fix the problem I think, which clearly didn’t work. It also threw a code which was listed as something about a thermactor during the KOER test, I don’t remember which code I didn’t get a chance to write it down, but I’m not sure if that has anything to do with it either. I’m just looking for some advice if anyone knows what might be wrong with the motor, the truck is absolutely spotless and only has 133k on it, I’d hate to have to sell it if it’s going to cost too much or be too hard to fix it.
 
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Old Jul 14, 2024 | 04:25 PM
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That 212 code points at a possible ignition module failure or even an incorrect module. There were 2 slightly different types of ignition systems on these trucks, the early models had something called push start and the later trucks like yours used CCD(computer controlled dwell). Originally the modules for these system were identified by color.. grey for PS and black for CCD but the aftermarket has confounded that by making both available in either color. In any event you might try installing a new CCD module, it will come with dielectric grease which they say to apply on the mating surfaces between the module and heatsink but this isn't the correct material.. you need heat sink grease which is a thermal conductor as opposed to dielectric grease which is an insulator. The whole reason this module was moved from the distributor to a heatsink on the fender was because of overheating failures so you really do want the heatsink doing the job it was intended for.

Something else that is always a possibility with these first gen EFI trucks is a PCM failure, so it would be a good idea to disconnect and remove it for closer inspection. Water intrusion is a possibility if the windshield seal fails and even without that the electrolytic capacitors on the circuit board would be past thier due date, and when they leak they can damage traces and other components. Damage form this often manifests as a partial loss of functionality such as the problem you are having, but the ignition module and even the PIP module inside the distributor are other potential candidates.
 
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Old Jul 14, 2024 | 05:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Conanski
That 212 code points at a possible ignition module failure or even an incorrect module. There were 2 slightly different types of ignition systems on these trucks, the early models had something called push start and the later trucks like yours used CCD(computer controlled dwell). Originally the modules for these system were identified by color.. grey for PS and black for CCD but the aftermarket has confounded that by making both available in either color. In any event you might try installing a new CCD module, it will come with dielectric grease which they say to apply on the mating surfaces between the module and heatsink but this isn't the correct material.. you need heat sink grease which is a thermal conductor as opposed to dielectric grease which is an insulator. The whole reason this module was moved from the distributor to a heatsink on the fender was because of overheating failures so you really do want the heatsink doing the job it was intended for.

Something else that is always a possibility with these first gen EFI trucks is a PCM failure, so it would be a good idea to disconnect and remove it for closer inspection. Water intrusion is a possibility if the windshield seal fails and even without that the electrolytic capacitors on the circuit board would be past thier due date, and when they leak they can damage traces and other components. Damage form this often manifests as a partial loss of functionality such as the problem you are having, but the ignition module and even the PIP module inside the distributor are other potential candidates.
I will definitely have to take a look at that, I have a couple spare Motorcraft ignition modules that are black like you described, I’ll plug one in and see if that makes a difference. I’ll also see if I can take a look at the PCM, I’ve heard of them going bad before.
 
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Old Jul 14, 2024 | 06:49 PM
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I replaced the ICM with a black plug, didn’t see much of a change. What I noticed is it misfires at idle and very very light throttle, but it’s not one cylinder. It misfires cylinders on both sides of the engine, it sounds like only one side at a time though. I tried taking a video but it was super hard to tell.
 
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Old Jul 14, 2024 | 08:26 PM
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Can you verify that the plug wires are routed like this. The firing order is 15426378 and the distributor rotates counter clockwise.

 
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Old Jul 15, 2024 | 12:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Conanski
Can you verify that the plug wires are routed like this. The firing order is 15426378 and the distributor rotates counter clockwise.

just went and looked, firing order is correct
 
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Old Jul 15, 2024 | 07:51 PM
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I checked the firing order, everything looks fine and correct, I’m still trying to find a fix.
 
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Old Jul 16, 2024 | 10:27 PM
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OK what fuel pressure do you have at the engine when idling with vacuum applied and removed from the pressure regulator?
 
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Old Jul 16, 2024 | 10:30 PM
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In that video it sounds like there is an exhaust leak, is there?
 
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Old Jul 17, 2024 | 07:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Conanski
In that video it sounds like there is an exhaust leak, is there?
Yes, the manifolds are leaking super badly to the point where it’s almost open headers.
 
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Old Jul 17, 2024 | 12:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Conanski
OK what fuel pressure do you have at the engine when idling with vacuum applied and removed from the pressure regulator?
as far as fuel pressure goes, I’ll have to check I don’t currently have a pressure gauge to test it with.
 
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Old Jul 17, 2024 | 08:12 PM
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Originally Posted by GasGuzler
Yes, the manifolds are leaking super badly to the point where it’s almost open headers.
Leaking headers/exhaust manifolds will cause fresh air and oxygen to enter the exhaust system, and confuse the O2 sensors. The ECU will detect excess O2 and dump in extra fuel to compensate. It may also trigger a lean code.
 
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