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I had the steering gearbox rebuilt and installed a couple months ago. When I got it back, the steering was SO smooth and tight... just awesome. However, now it's got a good 4-5 inches of play in it. Is this common? Is it just a matter of adjusting it, or is something else going on?
Unfortunately a 390 wasn't available in 1978 so unless a difficult conversion has been done you have something else, either a 335 or 385 series V8.
No that's not normal , it's dangerous. something is serious wrong don't drive it until you figure out what it is. start by having someone turn the steering wheel back and forth until they feel resistance and see if you can locate the slack.
If it turns out the slack is in the box you can bring it to dead center straight ahead and adjust it some to see if it helps. but if it slopped out that much that fast you need to take care of it.
Yep, it came stock with a 400. When I bought it, it had a 428 in it. I put the 390 in it several years ago, after blowing the 428.
I'll get in there and poke around tomorrow..... I really just wanted to know if this is because it's newly rebuilt, but apparently not. And I must say, if the shop that did the work did something wrong, I'll probably blow a gasket myself! Tried a shop with awesome reviews, and it's been nothing but a nightmare! An expensive one.
Wow an FE in a later model is so much more work than a 385 series I've never seen anyone do it.
Make sure it is the box , something could be lose or really worn also. good shops can successfully rebuild steering boxed but outfits like Redhead have made it an art. I'm surprised you found a local shop to do it, if for no other reason the liability keeps most shops scared off.
If they did drop the ball I'm sure they'll be more than willing to correct it. steering isn't something you let slide.
Just a thought,, sounds like they might not have torqued down the lock nut on the adjustment screw on top of the box and it is backing out.
Like others have said, I would definitely find the problem before I drove it.
I would really question just what we "rebuilt" on that steering box. Sounds like you might have a sector shaft or worm gear that is worn out. What does the receipt on the rebuild sheet say they did to it? I would NOT touch it (poke around in there), in fact if you do, that shop can and probably will say YOU voided the warranty by doing that. I would tell the shop THE PROBLEM and give them have the opportunity to stand behind their work/warranty. I would not drive it, I would get the shop to get it flatbed/roll back towed to get the repair done.
Then I would contact a good lawyer. It's the world we live in. X2 on Red Head or Blue Top both upgrade the box internally when they rebuild them.
As mentioned above, make sure what you’re feeling is actually play in the steering box. Doesn’t sound like it. If your 78 has a tilt column, suspect the internal U-joint at the top of the column. Inspecting in the engine compartment while someone moves the steering wheel should tell you where the problem is.
4" to 5" worth of play, you have something seriously wrong/broken. Check:
1. Steering wheel splines to steering column shaft. Grab steering shaft in the eng compartment and hold, easy to put a flat tip thru the shaft u joint to help hold, still have play in wheel? Add in another part to ck (steering column/steering shaft u joint) that can go bad if you have a tilt column.)
2. Steering column shaft is splined on other side of firewall. Output point of it to steering shaft connection point upstream of shaft u joint. U joint good?
3. Steering shaft in the engine compartment has splines on each end connection point AND a u joint in there. It good? Also a T type fitting in a bell shaped fitting, right before the steering shaft connects to the steering box input shaft. Ch that for play. And that connection to the input shaft.
4. Input shaft of steering box has splines. Same input should = same output .
5. 2 main meshing "gears so to speak" in the box. if the input is turning and the output it not, or that is you 4 " to 5" worth of play BAD BOX.
6. Output shaft (stub shaft) of steering box has splines that the pitman arm connect to. Ck that for play.
If the shop that rebuilt the GB says not their problem....yes you need someone to help you track down the issue. Without truck running get a person to turn the steering wheel easily back and forth, while you are under truck looking for same amount of steering wheel movement to find the broken or stripped connection point. Then check engine compartment steering shaft. Same about of movement in the cab, should equal same amount of movement of part/connection point you are checking.
Yes the PDF is for a 73-75, but the diagram shows the steering gear box/steering shaft (bell) and all upstream connections points. You do NOT have a RAG/flex joint in the set up. And yes your out put on the 78 box is out the bottom.
I will contact the shop tomorrow and see what I can find out about the rebuild on the steering gearbox. They sent it to a local shop, and I don't have any info on it.
I will check things out today and see if there is anything obviously wrong, but I won't touch the gearbox.
The motor swap: the 428 was an FE, so apparently the hard part was done. Dropping in the 390 was easy (and my first motor swap).
Warning: Long post ahead!
I'm kinda stuck as to what to do about the "shop nightmare". When I first took the truck to them, I had a pretty good idea as to what needed to be done. The gas tank (an aftermarket 44 gallon monster under the bed) needed to be pulled, and all new hoses. The left rear wheel needed to be checked out... I'd have problems with gear oil leaking, thought I'd fixed it, but wanted to be sure there was nothing going on in there.
I had bent a push rod last summer. Replaced it and had an ex-mechanic look at it to see if anything else was screwy. He said everything looked great. (we also pulled the oil pan to check from the bottom too. He was impressed by the bottom end) So, I asked the shop to check out the heads.
I was also having a brake issue and I thought it was the proportioning valve. I asked them to check out the brakes, and fix anything that needed fixing. They checked, said everything was fine. And since the truck was in there twice I asked them repeatedly about the brakes, and was assured every time that all was well.
And of course, the steering, which I figured was the gearbox.
So, the gas tank was pulled and the hoses replaced. The right rear wheel had everything replaced except the spindle. The head with the previous bent rod turned out to have two more bent rods, and they discovered that whoever had rebuilt the motor (no one I know... I bought it on craigslist) had apparently used random valves... not one matched another! So yes, both heads were rebuilt. The steering gearbox was sent out and rebuilt.
All this ended up being $3800. I picked up the truck, and drove it 22 miles on the highway. The steering was awesome, and it ran better than it ever has... way smoother and quieter. It seemed to be drifting left periodically, but I thought that was just me getting used to the new, tight steering.
I was wrong. As soon as I got off the highway(and going about 25 mph) the rear wheel would periodically lock up! Weeeee! Got to my son's place, and we started checking things out. Discovered chunks of metal between the backplate and the brake drum. We fished them all out, and I took it back to the shop.
They discovered the inner bearing had completely fallen apart, and they replaced it with another, better quality bearing. There hasn't been anymore problems with that. So far.
However, I got new tires a couple weeks ago. I bought them online, so needed to find someone to install them, and went to a small local shop. When he pulled the front right wheel off, he said that I needed new brake pads and rotors! And sure enough, the outer pad was about 1/4 inch thick, but the inner one was GONE, metal to metal.
I was understandabley pissed as hell. And I asked him to give me a 'worst case scenario" bid for the front brakes. Basically assuming that everything except the spindles would need replaced. $1600
I haven't had that work done yet, and now I've got this steering issue. I'm not sure I want the original shop touching my truck again, but damn! I paid a lot of money to have all that stuff fixed. In addition to my truck, they worked on my 97 astro van at the same time, and made some stupid mistakes with the a/c which resulted in my having to take it back three times! So you can see why I am reluctant.
1. You need to get a bad A$$ lawyer on speed dial.
2. You need to get that shop to fix that stuff and not charge you! Did you read the receipt for the $3800 and see just what they did? Might serve you better to do that next time. Like Insp brake...brakes ok....evidently not. Or maybe they charged you and did NOT change the brakes?
3. You need to ask for an ITEMIZED receipt for parts and labor, to see just what was insp/repaired, replaced.
4. You should of NEVER even touched the truck when the rear end locked up. Stop on the spot and call the shop make them cover the tow bill. You got lucky they did not sat "well you worked on us after you drove it off the lot, so not on us."
5. One you get the truck fixed by them on their dime. I would find another shop.
6. Sorry I do not mean to come off so harsh, but damn man stand up for you hard earned dollar. They are screwing you HARD.
I hate shops that are doing shaky stuff like this. It just aggravates me to no end that a place can to that and still be in business. You need to join your FTE state chapter and ask around for chapter for a lead on a reputable and maybe local shop. Then once you get your truck fixed for real, get the word out about that shifty place.
I had a place like that screw my mom over (on a brake and supposide rotor job) while I was deployed. When I got back and seen the bill and the lack of work actually done. I sueded them, won the case, bought out the business, made the place a living hell for 2 weeks, fired everyone one on the spot on a friday and burned the place to the ground.....Lol Just kidding, I did not burn it down....I turned it into 2000 service centers. Ever hear of Jiffy Lube? Kidding, but I hate a crooked auto shop.
First, no worries, I am not offended in the slightest. I come here to learn, and I usually do!
Looking at the invoice, there is no mention of brakes. My bad for not noticing that, their bad for either not checking, OR not knowing what they were seeing.
The right rear wheel locking fiasco: Yeah, I know. But I am wired to fix what's busted. And up until several years ago, I would not have dreamed of having a shop do anything that I absolutely couldn't do myself. Age/back surgery finally made me go to a shop.
Did some looking around at the beast and found a couple things that concern me. I will try (again) to get the pictures loaded. They are of the steering arm, steering damper and where the arm attaches to the gearbox. Please have a look and tell me what you think.
I will have someone do a back and forth with the steering while I look around later today or tomorrow. No one around right now.
The pic with no label is where the steering arm attaches below the gearbox. It doesn't look right to me. I can take more pictures if you need them
Thanks!
arm end Steering damper end. obviously this needs to be addressed! Steering arms Just cuz it's nice to look at. My grandson decorated it with mug handprints *grin* Steering damper steering arm end
That is why I suggested to check out your state FTE chapter forum and see it you might recruit a helping hand. You know how the stuff works and they can physically do it so. Maybe link up and buddy with some FTE members and work out a maint plan to keep your truck out of that shop.
1st pic. Bottom end of the pitman arm to adjustable link, look ok, just dry from NO grease. Can you grab it and do the tie rod twist ck? Tight?
2nd pic common steering stabilizer, worn rubber end bushing, just need a shock absorber ring end rubber bushing.
3rd pic is steering box output shaft (spud shaft) and the pitman arm connection. Looks seated, lock washer and nut and some threads showing. Good.
4th pic Adjustable steering link looks ok the other end is like the front one dry of grease, get a hand on it give it a twist.
5th pic AWESOME paint pattern by the grandson.
6th pic same steering stabilizer worn bushing.
7th pic a better shot of the far end of the adjustable steering link and its connection point to the steering knuckle arm. Looks wet, how does it feel? Twist ck.
Also noticed that you have 7 leafs on the passenger side and 6 on the dvrs side. In stock form it should have 2 on each side at let alone an even amount added. Does it have a lean? Top of tire to bottom of fender tape measure ck time. Could be that is why.
