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I'm getting ready (Friday) to send my truck in to have the transmission upgraded...in advance I've went through the old service records from the PO at my local ford dealer and found that the TSB's 00-24-4 and 00-23-10, addition of a Oil-to-water radiator for extra cooling, and inline filter were installed back in 2001 under warranty. I've been monitoring the TFT via forscan for about the last 2 months and have always noticed the transmission runs cool...on the last trip with our 10,000 lb TT in tow (and 2 adults, 3 kids, and a dog) on relatively flat grades it maxed at 162F with ambient temps in the mid 60's. Unloaded I can barely crack 130F no matter what I do in terms of how hard I drive it...temps have been mostly in the mid 70's - low 40's since I've been logging data...He also commented that they "updated the transmission programming" but couldn't detail what exactly that meant...what I have noticed that TC lockup is radically different when I have the trailer on vs when I'm running around unloaded...
1. How cool is too cool? I've read in a few places that the 4r100 doesn't even hit optimal efficiency until 165F, and that 250F for more than 30 minutes is the critical failure point....I already own the 6.0 cooler, so putting it in vs. not has nothing to do with the $$, but with that much more OTA cooling capacity, unloaded, I'll probably struggle to even push 100F in the winter...is that too cold? I live in the mid-atlantic, so I'm not pulling massive grade's very often, but we do get up into the mountains from time to time....
2. I've read with the valve body upgrades, that if you have tunes, you need to have the tune remove/take out the extra line pressures...since I have no idea what was done by ford is this a mistake? Already have the part, but given the fact i'll also be having my rear rebuilt (see other thread) I don't really have the extra money to deal with reprogramming the transmission or buying a chip+tunes right now to match my setup...should I just shelf the valve body until later?
I remember reading that you want the transmission to get to at least 175* to get hot enough to cook off the condensation in the transmission. I installed a Derale fluid thermostat before the 6.0 cooler, unloaded I see temps about 175-180*, loaded around 190* towing 8K through mountain passes. I recently cracked thermostat redoing the plumbing. Initially I wasn’t going to replace it but after speaking with Mark he said it was a good thing to have, so a new one got installed.
It could have been 175 and not 165...it was definitely Mark's posts I was referencing...I've tried to read up as much as I can.
That might be a workable idea, though I guess it would need to be plumbed in front of the oil to water cooler inlet...I will definitely look in to it...longevity out of the tranny is a must as this rear has kicked my rainy day fund's *** .
off topic: I am going with the truetrac based on I believe yours and several other recomendations! Thanks!
I don’t know squat about the converter you posted but since you are in the market for one you owe it to yourself to call D&P Torque Converters in Sacramento, a small family owned manufacture that hand builds custom converters at a competive price.
I have run them on all my race cars and have one in My excursion.
Give them a call, I think you will be glad you did. (916) 921-6600)
"though I guess it would need to be plumbed in front of the oil to water cooler inlet."
I have my thermostat plumbed between the radiator and the 6.0 cooler I installed and it works very well. I believe that this configuration allows the thermostat to be in a better position to do it's job properly. I would think that placing it in line ahead of the radiator inlet that it will only see hot fluid from that trans and run full open all of the time defeating it's purpose.
"though I guess it would need to be plumbed in front of the oil to water cooler inlet."
I have my thermostat plumbed between the radiator and the 6.0 cooler I installed and it works very well. I believe that this configuration allows the thermostat to be in a better position to do it's job properly. I would think that placing it in line ahead of the radiator inlet that it will only see hot fluid from that trans and run full open all of the time defeating it's purpose.
I'm not sure I'm with you here on the location of the thermostat...don't thermostats always go on the hot side?
What I am saying is that if the thermostat is on hot side, in line before the radiator or cooling "device" that the thermostat will be full open all of time defeating it's purpose. IE: the thermostat on the engine is just ahead of the radiator and after the hot fluid leaves the engine. But that is a once through in-line design. The Derale has four ports that regulate how the direction fluid is routed. Either full flow or partially bypassed back to the trans depending on the fluid temp. I hope this makes some kind of sense the way I described it .
What I am saying is that if the thermostat is on hot side, in line before the radiator or cooling "device" that the thermostat will be full open all of time defeating it's purpose. IE: the thermostat on the engine is just ahead of the radiator and after the hot fluid leaves the engine. But that is a once through in-line design. The Derale has four ports that regulate how the direction fluid is routed. Either full flow or partially bypassed back to the trans depending on the fluid temp. I hope this makes some kind of sense the way I described it .
‘Either I’m not following your discription or you’re miss understanding how the Derale Thermostat works. You do want the thermostat mounted BEFORE the cooler. Below 180*, the Derale stays OPEN, flowing 90% of the ATF in the case back to the transmission, which causes it to warm up faster, but it allows 10% to flow to the cooler to maintain system pressure. Once the fluid reaches 180*, the thermostat CLOSES which allows 100% of the fluid to flow to the cooler then back to the transmission.
Like I said I did't think that I was explaining my point very well. My Derale is plumbed between the radiator cooler and the main 6.0 cooler. It also makes the plumbing easier and cleaner as you can make the transitions between the 3/8 and 1/2 lines at the thermostat rather than fittings/splices in the soft lines.
Like I said I did't think that I was explaining my point very well. My Derale is plumbed between the radiator cooler and the main 6.0 cooler. It also makes the plumbing easier and cleaner as you can make the transitions between the 3/8 and 1/2 lines at the thermostat rather than fittings/splices in the soft lines.
‘I plumbed mine the same in that I used 3/8 on one side and 1/2” on the other. Here’s a video that’s directly from Derale, it shows exactly how it works...in case someone is still not understanding our discription.
Yes, I understand how the Derale thermostat works. I would plumb it before the radiator cooler. The thermostat won't be open all of the time. It will stay closed until the transmission warms up, then it opens. If it's between the radiator cooler and the aux cooler the radiator cooler is going to keep the transmission cooler for a much longer time. In fact, I expect that in cold weather the thermostat mounted between the cooler is never going to open because the trans will never warm up. With the thermostat before both coolers there is very little flow to the coolers, allowing the transmission to warm up.
I don't see any advantage to putting the thermostat between the coolers, except that it's easier to install. It certainly won't work well there.
I don't see any advantage to putting the thermostat between the coolers, except that it's easier to install. It certainly won't work well there.
Thanks Mark, this confirms my thinking...seems perhaps adding the thermostat is the right move with or without the larger cooler as I'm already running cool...is there any worries having run cool for so long?
Originally Posted by '88 E-350
As for the valve body and a chip; the Ford upgrade might be a 'standard' thing that the tuner knows about and can work with.
I don't have a chip (nor the budget to add one right now given rebuilding my rear was not expected) so what I was asking is if anyone had knowledge of what ford may have done with regards to the TSB's / complaints of overheating transmissions as all I have in the service record is "updated transmission programming" ... my question is based on the fact that I have read in many places that the performance valve-bodies perform best when any tuning done leaves the transmission line pressures alone...so hoping someone around here can chime in as to if they likely just updated the transmission strategy to what was present in '01 compared to '99, of if there was something specific they did with regards to these TSB's back in the day
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4r100 questions
