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How to waterproof ignition system?

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Old Oct 13, 2018 | 05:52 PM
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How to waterproof ignition system?

Long story short, it never rains in AZ. And when it does, my '71 just runs like crap until it gets warmed up and drys off. But if it gets splashed, such as when driving through a large puddle, it will run like crap again.

I'm talking about misfiring. Maybe cross firing, or arcing out and not firing at all.

I pulled the distributor cap when I got home. It was dry inside.

I just put a new cap/rotor and new plugs/wires in a couple months ago. It's a pertronix billet 3 flame thrower distributor. I used the pertronix "stock" style 7mm wires.

Being a dry desert rat, I really don't have much knowledge on this wet stuff...
 
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Old Oct 13, 2018 | 08:11 PM
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As OEM, most vehicles have some kind of flexible panels that "seal off" the engine compartment at least on the sides where control arms are beside the engine. Your '71 isn't built that way, and I bet you can see right down to the ground on both sides of the engine, including a clear view of suspension and tires. You might be able to install some splash panels that would keep some water out of the engine compartment, at least partially. It's hard to visualize what kind of room you would have to do that.

We had a Lexus with the full "belly pan" type of shielding under it. A pita in some circumstances, and always subject to damage or careless handling by oil changers, but it kept stuff off the motor. That was a clean looking motor under there, and things like wiring harnesses looked nearly new despite being 17/170,000 years/miles old.

You can't really seal up a pickup like that but I bet you could improve things dramatically with a little artistry and something like this to work with:

RAD Rubber Designs Engine Splash Shields 2005-2018 2nd and 3rd Gen [2NDGEN-TACOMA-SPLASH-GUARDS] - $49.95 : Pure Tacoma Accessories, Parts and Accessories for your Toyota Tacoma

Tons of cars have all kinds of shields, so you could find lots of material that was at least designed for that environment and fit it in strategic places on your truck.

Serving suggestion, ymmv
 
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Old Oct 14, 2018 | 05:31 AM
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My old mustang started doing that, to the point it would not start if it was raining. I finally found the socket in the center of the coil where the high tension wire goes was all green and corroded down inside. I know you just changed the wires, but I would pull the coil wire off and take a good look down inside the hole and see if it is clean.
 
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Old Oct 14, 2018 | 06:20 AM
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Dielectric grease is your friend. Put a thin layer around the inside of the boots at the distributor cap, and at the coil too.
 
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Old Oct 14, 2018 | 10:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Tedster9
Dielectric grease is your friend. Put a thin layer around the inside of the boots at the distributor cap, and at the coil too.
I'll pop them off and do that. I used dielectric grease on the cap/rotor when I installed them. But when I took it off yesterday, the grease had hardened and was burnt from arcing. I thought it was supposed to prevent that? Maybe I misunderstood.

It is supposed to turn the water/moisture away and keep the boots sealed to the plugs and the cap. It also helps to keep them from getting stuck so you don't tear up the rope and the crimp connection inside the wire. If it's been arcing, I bet that was your problem. What gap are you using? Is your setup stock? If for some reason the spark does not want to jump across the plug, it will look for other easier places to jump to ground.
 
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Old Oct 14, 2018 | 10:53 AM
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From: On the Edge of the Desert
Originally Posted by Franklin2
My old mustang started doing that, to the point it would not start if it was raining. I finally found the socket in the center of the coil where the high tension wire goes was all green and corroded down inside. I know you just changed the wires, but I would pull the coil wire off and take a good look down inside the hole and see if it is clean.
That was how it was before I changed everything. And the reason why I changed it. I was almost late for work a couple times because the damn thing wouldn't start.

I'll check it out. Thanks
 
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Old Oct 14, 2018 | 12:06 PM
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Are you running points & condenser? A points distributor w/ say, Pertronix Ignitor? High output ignition coil?

Couple things I ran into with my slick fwiw. One is the plug wires have to be high quality. I didn't cheap out on them, but I had less than stellar results with "roll yer own" plug wires. Maybe I didn't crimp them well enough. Using a high output ignition coil like the Flamethrower with direct full time battery voltage puts the old school points distributors under the test. Notice how much bigger in diameter the distributor caps are when HEI/Duraspark came along. This summer we had several weeks of very high humidity, and the garage was like a sauna. The distributor #6 boot wire was arcing to ground through the distributor cap straps, that secure the cap. The terminals at the coil both + and - were arcing as well. It wasn't stumbling, but it was a light show in all that humidity. I had a similar problem with old plug wires.

A new distributor cap actually made things worse, a better spark, sure, but still arcing outside. Dielectric grease helps but really shouldn't be necessary.

OEM Motorcraft wires really helped eliminate that. I bought an old school ignition analyzer that displays both primary and secondary waveforms, superimposed & parade etc, to check it out and really dial everything in. Another thing "they" did, the earlier black pre-smog distributor rotors have a longer tip than the later blue ones. The rotor - terminal gap inside the cap is almost a 1/4" in later years. This increases the coil firing voltage quite a bit but it isn't really what the earlier engines want. Everything in the ignition works together and is cumulative. Resistor plugs versus non-resistor plugs. Resistor wires versus non-resistor wires. Resistor coil wire versus non-resistor coil wire. Rotor gap. Plug gap. Different combinations really affect how it runs, and how susceptible it will be to crossfire & arcing both inside and outside the cap, etc. Today I took a pretty long drive in a heavy mist light rain, just enough where windshield wipers needed to be on constantly. It ran great, but it was a real pain to get it there! Ended up using non-resistor NGK plugs gapped to factory spec of 030", genuine Motorcraft resistor wires, and a close rotor gap w/ Pertronix Ignitor and Flamethrower w/ no ballast.

If you can find someone with an ignition analyzer to borrow it will show what's what right away, and whether coil firing voltage is spiking, defective plugs, excessive plug gap, or defective wires, etc.
 
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Old Oct 14, 2018 | 02:23 PM
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Thanks for the reply ted. I grabbed some of what you said but I'm going to have to read it a few more times to try to grasp more of it.

I'm running the full pertronix distributor with their igniter 3 technology inside. The cap is pretty small diameter. I want to say it's smaller than the old points cap, but I've never actually compared them.

The coil is the flamethrower 3 coil. Low-resistance to match the distributor. And I used their "stock" style flamethrower plug wires. The plugs are regular autolite copper. Non-resistor.
 
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Old Oct 14, 2018 | 04:05 PM
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If you have a lot of arcing at different spots along the way to the plugs, that is a sign the spark does not want to jump across the plug, it is finding it easier to jump somewhere else. Is this engine stock and are you using the stock plugs with the stock gaps? Higher compression makes it harder for the spark to jump, and wider gaps give you a bigger spark, but it also makes it harder for the spark to jump and puts a higher demand on your wires and boots.
 
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Old Oct 14, 2018 | 05:49 PM
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Pretty much stock, yes. Not high-compression by any stretch. I'm not even sure it's 9:1. Probably less than that in reality.
 
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Old Oct 15, 2018 | 06:05 AM
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Try a spray bottle filled with water and a darkened garage at night and spray down wires and cap &c at idle and see if the stumbling or misfire can be reproduced. Look for arcing to ground. A lot of people jack up the plug gap too much, this increases the coil firing voltage, and increases wear of ignition components, especially rotor. I noticed on my slick a half moon carbon track etching or arcing through the rotor itself, voltage was blasting through the rotor to the distributor shaft. High voltage is wacky stuff, and, if it can find an easier path to ground than the plug gap it will take it.
 
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