Exactly ND where are you!!

 

re the 'not this **** again' - instead of starting at page 1, try starting at page 501. Or 1001. It's all the same topics. Not to say folks post before they do a search, but...

 

I use 10W30, it's fine year round, in the climate here in North Carolina, and that's what I use back home in Missouri too.
I'm also a "Lucas" fan, so I'll put a bottle of Lucas oil additive in there too. And I'm not a fan of additives. But I like all of the Lucas products.

 

Could not have said it better!!!!
And, thanks for the chuckle or two!

 

Whoever that feller is, Google ain't much help. ND, expert on all things LA-LA land, who is it? Maybe Dick Clark

 

According to cam shaft manufacturers, a zinc additive is recommended, as well as doing away with the high detergent oils. Like rotella, Valvoline high mileage, or john deere torque guard, or delo, these oils have high detergents, these detergents are present to keep diesel engines alive for hundreds of thousands of miles, they clean, they don't care what they clean, they just clean. I would recommend a conventional oil. even if rotella has the zinc, the high detergent will clean the film of oil from the components, it doesn't care what is being cleaned, it just cleans. this leads to failures. that is why a conventional oil is good, because the cleaning properties are significantly less. this leaves a film of oil on the parts inside your engine, allowing for start up to be less invasive while oil is pumping in.

 

I personally like/think the 15w-40 diesel spec oils (Delvac, Delo, Rotella) are ideal for these old flat tappet (non-roller) lifter engines. Those 3 oils are all conventional in the 15w-40 weight, and all 3 also are rated for use in gasoline engines also. Look at the specs. Now, if cold starts in the 15-20 degree range are common, I would probably use a 10w-30 (any of those 3), just make sure they show the gasoline spec as the others do. If still not comfortable with that, Brad Penn (old green Kendall) makes a great product - Penn Grade 1 in various weights that is used by many old school race engine builders, also high in zinc/phosphorus aka ZDDP.

 

Forgot to add only drawback to Brad Penn is sometimes difficult to find locally, although Amazon, Summit etc. are options. I have a distributor here that carries it. And, as mentioned earlier I think, in a cold enough climate a diesel-spec 5w-40 would be great also (Delvac, Delo, Rotella) all have this in full synthetic. More costly, probably overkill but certainly quality stuff that would work well.

 

I go by the camshaft and component manufacturer recommendations. If comp cams, howards cams, lunati, crower, and isky all recommend NOT using the diesel engine oils, I feel that it is not a good recommendation to use diesel or HIGH DETERGENT oil. Reason for this is the film of oil NOT left behind. Diesels do not breakdown the oil like a gasoline engine does. therefore the oil quality is different. Use what you want, but remember this, if diesel oils were better, please, please answer as to how come the component manufacturers advise against these types of oils? I am listening, I would like to see. they build the parts, they warranty the parts, they engineer the parts, and they recommend a certain protocols, and advise against certain methods, WHY?

 

...Because they specialize in performance engine components with today's better metallurgy and closer tolerances. Plus computer controlled engine management systems and 02 sensors keep the dialed in with spot-on AF mixtures... that is unlike us carbed guys who tune with a vacuum gauge, screwdriver, and Kentucky windage... setting it rich is safe albeit dirty and inefficient with sucky gas mileage.

In general, if an engine has been rebuilt then ZDDP and phosphorus content is not an issue.... even synthetics are okay. Old engines with their 40 year old lifters and cams deserve a lil extra to keep them alive.

$0.02.

 

I'd say its more of an issue as critical pieces like the lifter faces and camshaft lobes haven't been bedded to each other and surface hardened through use.

An engine is still an engine, with multiple wear interfaces. ZDDP / Phosphorus / molybdenum content will play a role in longevity no matter what design, but yes it is more critical in our older flat-tappet camshaft engines.

- boingk

 

I am probably not smart enough to be chipping in, but it seems counterintuitive to say that the high-detergent oils essentially cut the oil film leaving surfaces unprotected - typical diesels have a far higher amount of particulate contamination from blowby yet the engines last multiple times as long as gas engines. Not sure why they would be dissed by the part makers, but I don't use those parts.

 

I use VR1 in a (foreign��) race engine that revs to 8000 rpm.
I've never had an oil related failure and on tear down the rings and bearings can be reused.
That's good enough for me, I recommend VR1 but I did just notice the local Autozone stopped carrying it.

 

OK, Not even close to why the part manufacturers advise against using HD oils. The reason is simple. Every camshaft I am aware of today being ground has exponentially more "slope" incorporated into the lobe, Comp, Melling, crower, lunati, edelbrock, isky, crane, howards, SUMMIT, trickflow, All grind extra slope, WHY? I bet no one even took the time to make a phone call and log the conversation to each and everyone. the reason is simple, to stimulate consistent rotationof the lifter, in the lifter bore, this enables the cam and lifter contact pattern to act as a bearing surface, complimenting the convex lifter surface, but only when a film of oil is present to "float" the lifter. now, the other reasoning for this is because these manufacturer are aware that we are installing new components in worn lifter bores, many many miles have generated wear in the lifter bores, and if the lifters rotate every time, the lifter bore wear will be less significant and the lifter wear will increase, unless of course when you build your old 1970s block you have all 16 lifter bores reconditioned to spec, then this no longer factors in. The HD oil is not good for our old engines, it can be made to work properly however to say that it is a more expensive option that is way more prone to cause damage makes it a bad recommendation, conventional 10w-30 should work very well and add a zddp additive.
As for lucas, anyone ever tore a diesel engine down that had lucas ran for any large amount of time? that stuff just collects in the oil galleries, slowly restricting from the inside, until the oil passage can't hardly flow anylonger. It is a nice product and I believe it does everything it says it does, but after hundreds of thousands of miles, that stuff is doing more harm than good. I promise that.

 

Sorry that you couldn't figure out how NOT to read this post based on its obvious title, and the declaration that I did search and found nothing useful.

That being said, I do appreciate the helpful answers.