Battery problems anyone?
Thread Starter
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Posting Guru
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,490
Likes: 16
From: Arizona/Texas
My vote is the battery that went completely dead while on the lot.
Not to insult anyone, but a short lesson.
Almost all car batteries are comprised of Six 2 Volt cells on a common buss. The voltages applied to the car battery via the alternator or charger are for the entire buss.
In other words, a 12v battery that is at a 13.8v charge cycle is under optimal (and theoretical) conditions has 2.3 volt charge applied to all of the cells
If you have a dead or weak set of cells the voltage applied to the system gets absorbed by the other "good" cells. So a dead cell would cause the other cells to be charged at roughly 2.76 volts. That voltage is enough to destroy a good cell in short order.
Testing with a multimeter only gives you buss output voltage.
Since you have no way of isolating the cells with a meter, a total battery voltage can only give a sort of insight as to what might be happening.
A strong cell compensating for a weak or dead cell will easily mask a problem via a voltage check.
However, its capacity will be drastically reduced.
More over, the cells that a now being overcharged to compensate for the weak cells will rapidly deteriorate with each charging cycle.
So again, the symptoms as described above easily fit with why I think that battery went dead at one point before you even bought it. If you EVER see a Dealer jumping a car to get it started (not that you did in this instance) demand a new battery.
I'm glad to see they made it right.
Not to insult anyone, but a short lesson.
Almost all car batteries are comprised of Six 2 Volt cells on a common buss. The voltages applied to the car battery via the alternator or charger are for the entire buss.
In other words, a 12v battery that is at a 13.8v charge cycle is under optimal (and theoretical) conditions has 2.3 volt charge applied to all of the cells
If you have a dead or weak set of cells the voltage applied to the system gets absorbed by the other "good" cells. So a dead cell would cause the other cells to be charged at roughly 2.76 volts. That voltage is enough to destroy a good cell in short order.
Testing with a multimeter only gives you buss output voltage.
Since you have no way of isolating the cells with a meter, a total battery voltage can only give a sort of insight as to what might be happening.
A strong cell compensating for a weak or dead cell will easily mask a problem via a voltage check.
However, its capacity will be drastically reduced.
More over, the cells that a now being overcharged to compensate for the weak cells will rapidly deteriorate with each charging cycle.
So again, the symptoms as described above easily fit with why I think that battery went dead at one point before you even bought it. If you EVER see a Dealer jumping a car to get it started (not that you did in this instance) demand a new battery.
I'm glad to see they made it right.
So a 610 amp should be plenty if it's new? Or should I put in a higher amperage battery? I tend to go for the overkill! You know if 610 amp is ok, I tend to sleep better if I go with a 800 amp. ☺ Can you have to many amps?
Lead Driver
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 5,844
Likes: 5
From: Albuquerque
Had to jump it again this morning after playing the stereo for one cycle. I put the charger on it and will see how it does after a good charge.
I did do some research and realized my truck was built in Nov 15. It set on the lot until I bought it in Oct 16. That's the longest a vehicle has set at the dealer that I have ever purchased.
I did do some research and realized my truck was built in Nov 15. It set on the lot until I bought it in Oct 16. That's the longest a vehicle has set at the dealer that I have ever purchased.
After two or three or more tows to the dealership, then I would believe they'd change out the battery. Or...at the very least owe you a detailed explanation.
YES...it is a total inconvenience, but these issues need to be documented by FORD service. Helps you in the long run.
Good luck with it!!
biz
Thread Starter
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Posting Guru
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,490
Likes: 16
From: Arizona/Texas
IMHO...if this happens again, then I recommend calling FORD service for a tow to your local dealer. These instances should be documented...and YOU should NOT allow a jump start if offered.
After two or three or more tows to the dealership, then I would believe they'd change out the battery. Or...at the very least owe you a detailed explanation.
YES...it is a total inconvenience, but these issues need to be documented by FORD service. Helps you in the long run.
Good luck with it!!
biz
After two or three or more tows to the dealership, then I would believe they'd change out the battery. Or...at the very least owe you a detailed explanation.
YES...it is a total inconvenience, but these issues need to be documented by FORD service. Helps you in the long run.
Good luck with it!!
biz
Super Moderator
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 25,479
Likes: 738
From: Isanti, MN
They owe you road service because the truck is under warranty and that's their stated coverage. They don't owe your truck a ride on a rollback when it can safely get there on its own.
Originally Posted by msgtord
So a 610 amp should be plenty if it's new? Or should I put in a higher amperage battery? I tend to go for the overkill! You know if 610 amp is ok, I tend to sleep better if I go with a 800 amp. ☺ Can you have to many amps?
Post Fiend
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 19,311
Likes: 97
From: Waterloo, Iowa
High CCA batteries are a good plan if you live in North Dakota or Saskatoon, places like that. Arizona and Texas, from your profile, it's not necessary. Can't have "too many" amps, but high CCAs come at the expense of reserve capacity and are more easily damaged and may not last as long.
Super Moderator
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 25,479
Likes: 738
From: Isanti, MN
Nope, she was a working-class XLT 301a with the factory battery. Seriously, this thing cranked over much better than our '12 Honda Odyssey did.
Thread Starter
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Posting Guru
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,490
Likes: 16
From: Arizona/Texas
Thank you sir.
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Super Moderator
Joined: Aug 2003
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From: Isanti, MN
Come to think of it...the worst cold start I've ever had was in December at -27°, and I didn't have a power outlet I could plug the block heater into. Cranked slower than usual, but fired off after less than three seconds. The Odyssey wouldn't have started at all in those temps.
I really can't imagine any reason why the factory battery capacity is inadequate.
I really can't imagine any reason why the factory battery capacity is inadequate.
Thread Starter
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Posting Guru
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,490
Likes: 16
From: Arizona/Texas
Well, we are at the end of the odyssey. I took the truck to the dealer and this time left with a new battery.
I did observe that my volt meter read 14.5 volts at start up. It's never read higher than 14.1, even after a 300 mile trip. Normally it was 13.5 to 13.8 around town.
I did observe that my volt meter read 14.5 volts at start up. It's never read higher than 14.1, even after a 300 mile trip. Normally it was 13.5 to 13.8 around town.
Post Fiend
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 19,311
Likes: 97
From: Waterloo, Iowa
13.8 - 14.3 is right in the ballpark at 70F Nobody measures when it's Zero out for some reason but the proper charging voltage goes up in cold weather to overcome internal battery resistance. 15+ is typical below zero.
Lead Driver
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 5,872
Likes: 357
From: Mts. S. of San Francisco
As stated previously, the only sure way to check out a battery is to take it out of the vehicle and put it into a tester. Because each of the cells in the battery (there are 6 cells in a 12 volt battery) is independent, and you do not have test points on each one, you have to extrapolate the condition of the cells by putting it through a charge/discharge test.
By the sounds of it, you had a battery with at least one bad cell. Glad you got it fixed.
By the sounds of it, you had a battery with at least one bad cell. Glad you got it fixed.
