Are Duraspark Modules rebuildable?
Moderator
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 22,415
Likes: 92
From: Denver Metro Area, CO
That schematic (not very detailed, doesn't give us specs on the transistor nor the IC(s)) looks to be SMC's implementation of the Ford DuraSpark module and uses IC-controlled voltage instead of Ford's original ceramic resistor.
Tuned
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 300
Likes: 5
From: Apex, NC
Mine only has 2 also and, for the record, I'm not saying that the schematic is correct. It is simply the only one that I've ever found.
Still hoping to learn more about the internals on these magic boxes.
Still hoping to learn more about the internals on these magic boxes.
Cargo Master
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 2,935
Likes: 34
From: Arcadia, Fla
These are not the ones I had, but very informative still. Too bad the IC's numbers were not listed. What web site you find them on?
I did look through the wayback machine but no luck.
As for removing the potting, do not go any higher than 250F as 350F will cause capacitors to fail from heat. I use a good heat gun when removing that mess.
EDIT! found this at the Patent office:US3831570 breaker-less ignition
https://www.google.com/patents/US3831570
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Logistics Pro
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 3,789
Likes: 26
From: Connecticut
If we find out "what fails" such as resistor in the upper right, or the capacitor located at XXX, in theory it's repairable, I guess every thing in there is "store-byable" other that the programmed IC chip?
If the Chip is messed up the module is beyond repair?
Just want to "dig into one" and see if it's fixable.....
If the Chip is messed up the module is beyond repair?
Just want to "dig into one" and see if it's fixable.....
Cargo Master
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 2,935
Likes: 34
From: Arcadia, Fla
Here's another patent https://www.google.com/patents/US3937193
This one also lists part numbers of the components!
Most likely a dead modual is a bad connection/bad solder joint. Heat makes things expand and opens up the circuit. Cools off and the joint contracts making the circuit again. Over many cycles the joint/connection will stay open. This is the most common issue I have found with electronics in heavy current applications.
Now if something is burnt inside, then you would smell it.
This one also lists part numbers of the components!
Most likely a dead modual is a bad connection/bad solder joint. Heat makes things expand and opens up the circuit. Cools off and the joint contracts making the circuit again. Over many cycles the joint/connection will stay open. This is the most common issue I have found with electronics in heavy current applications.
Now if something is burnt inside, then you would smell it.
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pedant
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 23,576
Likes: 39
From: EXTREME southwest CT
If the potting is no longer there...
The modules are really pretty well sealed.
Unlike a computer or home stereo component which rely on airflow over the circuit for cooling, the ceramic resistors and honking big transistor are on a heatsink attached to a bigger heatsink (the case)
Reverse engineering 40 year old electronics to fix something that is readily available new for $50 with a lifetime warranty is a fools errand.
The modules are really pretty well sealed.
Unlike a computer or home stereo component which rely on airflow over the circuit for cooling, the ceramic resistors and honking big transistor are on a heatsink attached to a bigger heatsink (the case)
Reverse engineering 40 year old electronics to fix something that is readily available new for $50 with a lifetime warranty is a fools errand.
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Logistics Pro
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 3,789
Likes: 26
From: Connecticut
Yea, I guess so, but an educational challenge, because "I can"
Lifetime warranty on electrical equipment? on what planet?
Once it touches your hand, it's "no Returns on Electrical Parts"
Lifetime warranty on electrical equipment? on what planet?
Once it touches your hand, it's "no Returns on Electrical Parts"
Lead Driver
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 6,477
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From: Sheffield, AL
Fleet Mechanic
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,926
Likes: 116
From: Saskatchewan Canada
Hate to say anything nice about GM, but the HEI module is just about the best and most reliable option for ignition module replacement into just about any make.
There was a fellow named Daniel Stern, (slantsixdan) who frequented the Mopar boards. He did some excellent work on using the HEI module in Mopar applications, a lot of it would apply to Ford as well.
Slant Six Forum, :: View topic - HEI Electronic Ignition Retrofit How-To
Those Mopar guys really lose their minds if they see anything other than Maw Mopar's box on the firewall. I've seen a few GM HEI modules stuffed into a Mopar case as well.
There was a fellow named Daniel Stern, (slantsixdan) who frequented the Mopar boards. He did some excellent work on using the HEI module in Mopar applications, a lot of it would apply to Ford as well.
Slant Six Forum, :: View topic - HEI Electronic Ignition Retrofit How-To
Those Mopar guys really lose their minds if they see anything other than Maw Mopar's box on the firewall. I've seen a few GM HEI modules stuffed into a Mopar case as well.
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Logistics Pro
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 3,789
Likes: 26
From: Connecticut
So on the 6-hour ride home from York, PA today, my twisted mind starts contemplating the Module overheat-killing syndrome.
Now is the "engine compartment" heat being conducted into the module doing damage? or is there heat being generated BY the electronics killing it.
So I'm thinking why not modify the Module?
Say the Plugs come out of side "A" and to the left is side "B" the rear is "C" and the right is "D" (fire dept terms for describing side of a house)
Drill a few holes along the upper "D" side and drill holes on the upper "B" side. Now apply a small 12v fan, being fed by an air duct from the grill area.
Theory is if the module is generating heat and the aluminum case is made airtight by the potting, Air circulation by the fan must dissipate ant heat.
Now is the "engine compartment" heat being conducted into the module doing damage? or is there heat being generated BY the electronics killing it.
So I'm thinking why not modify the Module?
Say the Plugs come out of side "A" and to the left is side "B" the rear is "C" and the right is "D" (fire dept terms for describing side of a house)
Drill a few holes along the upper "D" side and drill holes on the upper "B" side. Now apply a small 12v fan, being fed by an air duct from the grill area.
Theory is if the module is generating heat and the aluminum case is made airtight by the potting, Air circulation by the fan must dissipate ant heat.
pedant
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 23,576
Likes: 39
From: EXTREME southwest CT
No returns on electrical parts because stores dont want idiots using them for diagnosis.
Failed modules are definitely warranteed (if you can find the receipt six years later)
The transistor and both power resistors get hot.
removing the potting to blow warm moist air through electronic components is probably not a great idea.
milling the top *flat* and adding a vaned heatsink with conductive paste might help
But basically, the circuit components are antiquated and didn't have good life cycle times even when new.
Failed modules are definitely warranteed (if you can find the receipt six years later)
The transistor and both power resistors get hot.
removing the potting to blow warm moist air through electronic components is probably not a great idea.
milling the top *flat* and adding a vaned heatsink with conductive paste might help
But basically, the circuit components are antiquated and didn't have good life cycle times even when new.