Not another question about EOT vs ECT, exactly...

But for both, what are acceptable temps (or ranges) while towing, and what actually happens when they get too high? Like which one is a bigger concern?

Say I'm towing 10k. EGR is deleted and I have head studs. Explain it like you're talking to a 12 year old, please.

 

Once the EGR cooler is deleted, the spread between oil and coolant temperature (EGR and oil cooler) is not as critical. The reason to watch the temperature spread was to warn of a plugged oil cooler, the cause of restricted water flow to the EGR cooler. Less coolant flowing into the EGR cooler and at a higher temperature is the cause of EGR cooler rupture. The hot exhaust gasses passing through the EGR cooler boils the coolant, turns to steam inside the coolant passages and cracks the passage channel/tube.

If your EGR cooler is gone, the spread no longer applies... however, oil temperature still is something to watch. As coolant flow inside the oil cooler is reduced, oil temps increase which effect the ability for the coolant to cool the oil passing through the oil cooler. It's not passing the coolant to the EGR any longer, but it still needs to cool the oil.

Your now watching for oil cooler efficiency to prevent overheating and to prevent catastrophic failure. At 253*, the engine will go into a de-fueling mode to prevent further heat build-up and will set the wrench (limp mode). At higher temps, plastic parts will melt, like the oil stand pipe and spread that melted plastic through the motor and once cooled, harden in place....it's yukky for the motor.

Obviously, towing will make temps climb more rapidly, hill climbing and so forth. You may still need to replace the oil cooler if it becomes clogged and exhibits reduced efficiency.

 

ECT 210-220*f, Oh-S%&# point is 230*f.
EOT 215-225*f, might bounce higher but sustained shouldn't be drastically higher than ECT even when towing, Oh-S%&# point is 253*f.

When coolant gets too hot the engine overheats (), but the main issue is if you aren't hearing the fan by 220*f the fan clutch is having a problem.

When oil overheats (short of the defuel point) it increases the risk of the oil cooler rupturing because of the difference in temps of the fluids inside.

When oil overheats (past defueling point) the oil filter standpipe melts and plastic can destory the engine. Don't get to this point:
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...rom-fddts.html

Neither if they're in range. Short term - ECT because it can spike faster and vent coolant but you can pull over and cool it down. Long term - EOT because it touches more more-expensive parts and is all internal to the engine.

High ECT actually exhibits a symptom (constant fan or no fan) plus dummy dash gauge, but EOT doesn't until the truck defuels and power goes down. So EOT is more likely to sneak up on you absent gauges.

 

I read through your post Randy and found myself scratching my chin... While the high differential would say you might be toasting your EGR cooler due to lack of flow, I don't think it becomes that irrelevant just because the EGR is deleted.

Isn't it Still telling us the Oil Cooler is not doing its job? If the spread is large between EOT and ECT (don't ask me what that number is), it is still an indication of (perhaps) a clogging oil cooler, no?

This is a good question and good discussion -- it could be the recovery rate becomes more of an indicator (how quickly the oil cools after a tough pull)...

Just thinking out of my box here, which is dangerous...

 

This is the root behind the newest chop manual procedure for oil cooler testing. Basically over 10*f difference over ECT means the oil cooler isn't running at full capacity. Over that point, we can argue what's fine to us but it's apparent something isn't optimal anymore.

Almost like using 400*f as an EGT target for shutting down, I'm sure an engineer could do the math as to what optimal heat transfer it, but I'm not sure anyone has enough live data to put together a target time-frame, and I don't really want to have to buy a stopwatch for the truck. Although I'm sure Isspro or Edge would sell one of $200+

 

Can you elaborate on the 1st part, as in what else would we (you) would be looking at to help determine oil cooler health? I know if I'm towing a healthy load on a warm day the spread can get larger, as I say climb a hill; fan kicks in and coolant drops or stays about the same, but it takes a while (that would be the recovery ) for the EOT to reflect a change...

 

I edited my post several times... maybe my wording is off. I'm a little tired, long day, to many beers from the other post.

what I tried to say;
Once the EGR cooler is deleted, we're not worried of it's rupture... however we are worried of the oil coolers rupture and its efficiency.

 

Bryan,

By saying "full capacity", do you mean efficiency?
Reduced flow or reduced cooling or the ability to transfer heat from oil to water.

 

you're good, dude -- maybe more beers are in order. I didn't quote that post and all it did was start me to thinking...

So how do we determine our oil coolers are fine, since the "test" has changed over time, and for various reasons as you've pointed out.

Bryan is hinting at some new thinking along these lines and I'm starting to wonder if I should incorporate the engine "load" as Torque calc's it, into a better delta temp ("warning Will Robinson, your oil cooler is clogging!"), kind of gauge....?

ok, it is too many beers (or their equivalent in gin) for me too...

 

Thanks for the input and the Oh-S%&# points. I had been reading a thread the other day and couldn't find it again, where it was being discussed/debated and it left me a little confused.


I do get more than a 15* spread when towing but I haven't seen catastrophic numbers on the scangauge. (Or even really approaching catastrophic).


I'm just trying to prevent an on-the-road disaster, which I've become sort of famous for around here.


I guess I'll start saving up the cash, huh? How much does a cooler cost for a shop to do for me? I have zero ability to DIY.

 

Depends on the shop.. were talking in the $2000-3000 range for an oil cooler job. Doing an EGR delete with a coolant system flush and conversion to ELC would be a wise choice and a few upgrades at the same time to avoid having to go back in would also prevent future repairs.

Blue spring fuel upgrade
turbo oil drain tube
STC fitting
stand pipes/ dummy plugs
EGR delete

To name a few that ensure longevity and system performance.

 

Even though there isn't a load put on your cooling system from an EGR cooler, I would think doing the standard test for Oil cooler health would be good enough to tell you it is working: Truck (UNLOADED) at full operating temperature, drive pretty steady at 65 mph on flat road for 15 - 20 minutes or longer until EOT and ECT are stable; what is the difference between EOT and ECT? ECT should get stable at 192 - 194 with a good stock thermostat and EOT 10 degrees or less higher, however up to 15 is (or was) acceptable (we'll let Bryan weigh in if this is where the change is).

 

As long as oil temp stays below 240 when towing up a grade and once back to flat land at cruising speed it comes back down in the 200 range I call it good. This shows me the oil cooler is still effecient enough to not be concerned.
But if I observed the temps hit 240+ and it takes a long time to drop down it's time for a new oil cooler. This shows the cooler lost its ability to effectively dissipate heat do to lack of coolant flow from blockage.