So I probably gave someone their "worst experience ever" today. They came in, said they worked with the other truck guy, but since he wasn't here (didn't bother to remember his name). So right off the bat, they made the mistake because I knew if a deal happened I'd have to split it with him. Then they said they wanted an F450 "King Rancher". I said, "Sure, sounds like something we'll want to order for you". They say "yeah, the truck we wan't isn't out there and we've been to several dealers already, we're just trying to get the best deal. We aren't ordering today, but will be within the week". Okay... so, you're just shopping, and to earn your business I'm going to have to cut it down to a "mini" deal, so $50 for me and $50 for the other guy. Still not a problem, make it easy for me, I'll make it easy for you. "Sounds like you've done your research, we should be able to iron out some great numbers here in 20 minutes and get the order, just tell me what numbers I have to beat and you'll be all set". "No, we don't play those games, we just want you to appraise our truck and tell us the sale price of the new one." That is rather outdated, but plenty of folks do it, the problem is, their trade is also a "King Rancher" from 08.... Talk about a truck I really don't want! So I tell them, if they aren't interested in working out their best deal right now then I really couldn't help them. "we all get the new trucks for the same amount and our trade has an actual cash value". They claim they've had $5k variance. So I just told them I wasn't interested in their trade, so it was unlikely we'd be able to come to terms. Their assumption is that I was desperate to sell them an $82k truck, and it was my privilege to work with them. What they completely missed: First, their trade really does suck. I don't care how many times people have told them it's nice. I've had a total of zero request for new or used "King Rancher" F450s. There is a market for em, but not enough in PA to have me want one... especially with a 6.4. They also could back out of the deal at any time, and people like that are prone to keep shopping after the order. So I'd be suck with the darn $82k truck no one ever asks me about. So at the very best case I get a half sale, and $50 for all the work, and the dealership gets a full sale and a gamble on a very risky truck we would probably have to own for far more than we want to have the honor to sell them a truck. There unwillingness to build a relationship with their sales person and unwillingness to strike up a deal with someone is foolish and I considered it rude. So out the door they went!

To make up for it, I had a F350 guy come in later, he was really swell, wanted a new truck soon. DRW Lariat with 6 seats. Not many in the colors he wanted, and he already found one. I didn't have one, so I just told him the one he found was actually the least expensive out there. I told him what invoice was and that 0% was the way to go from there. Sent him to my competitor with a solid number they can beat by a few bucks if needed, or help him with his trade (I didn't appraise it, but it was a ratty old van). Sure I'd love to sell him, but I think he'll remember we treated him right at least.

Reasonable folks are such a joy to work with. Be reasonable and nice and let the salesperson work for you. Go in smart enough to keep him honest, but the rest should be pretty quick and easy.

 

I went through the internet manager at my dealership and we agreed on price over the phone and then went in to order it and give the down payment to order it. Got his cell phone # and have called him twice since the deal and always get an answer.
After reading the stories on this thread, I am feeling lucky.

 

I was looking for a certain car to do a build on and I found one in Denver. I called, we agreed on a price and I said I will send you money, how much do you want? Don't worry will see you tomorrow. I catch the am flight to Denver and a guy picks me up and I say glad to me you John. I'm not John, I am Bill John is off today...WTH you say, just talked to him 2 hrs ago. Huma Huma guess something come up Boss told me to pick you up at the airport.

Turns out they were way the hell out of Denver. I get the dealer and I am talk to a new guy and he sez wha kind of a car are you looking for???? YOU DON'T KNOW???

Long story short...

I generally "carry" and since I was flying I decided not to, had I been carrying I would have stuffed it in someones mouth.

I bought the car and got ripped off: Paid more than the ad said (ad was wrong they said) Taxi's don't come 30 mi outside the city, asked of someone could take me back to the airport, NO EVERYONE is too busy, yea, why am I the only customer in the store, they raped my on stupid charges, then told me I had to pay Sales tax as they laughed, at that point and the POURING rain and I mean pouring when I arrived and not let up I just stroked a check...then I got the BS, well we have to put the car thru make ready and it will be ready tomorrow. At this point my thought is where is my gun when I need it. I looked the GM and Finance guy in the eyes and I own this car, you have my check, you have called the my bank and if you touch the car now, I will call the police, now where is MY CAR!

Payback is SO SWEET: I went to register my car and I had a sales tax receipt, so they honored it and I owned nothing...3 mo later I get a check from the state of Co, refunding my money as it was not registered or licensed in Co, but in Texas.

Then Chrysler was having some problems and they closed underperforming dealerships...and that dealer was the only one they closed in Denver...

Rare you say.

3 times this has happened to me, guess I am a slow learner. Word to wise. DO NOT under ANY circumstances do a deal over the fone that they do not take money from you, that should be a red flag, because you arrive the guy you talked to is off that day which has happened all 3 times. This was the only time out of 3 that I flew in, usually its a dealer in another city and just turn around and head back home and chalk it off to a crooked dealer, but I found a great place to eat next time I am in that city...

Which is WHY almost every single car I have bought since '77 was an ordered car. That way I hold the Ace cards and if they try to keep my deposit, I threaten to take them to small claims court, in Tx you can sue for up to $5000. I have never had to do it or even threaten because If ind when you order a car you are treated very well...

 

What goes around comes around..glad it worked out for you Don.

 

Thanks and in spite of Denver it was a GREAT build for my shop, wish I had never sold it, but I not a collector I am a driver. My cars are not garage queens...should not sold my '67 L88 one of 26 made, but it was just a driver far as I was concerned.

 

I had to basically BEG the dealer to take my money.

By the time another dealer's "guy that can order trucks" got back to me, I had begged my money in to the hands of the first dealer.

And I pulled up in my Lambo....What a world.

 

That will probably fit in the bed of the truck

 

With all due respect, I think the vast majority who carry would be grateful that you didn't that day.

That kind of statement feeds right into the anti-gun narrative that we are all lunatics just itching to shoot anyone who pisses us off.

However, I doubt that is who you really are.

 

Bowler304 Great write up.. I was curious when you say cheap (Rams) Can You give me a Model You are Referring to? I have a Laramie Longhorn.. And Interior is anything but cheap.. I see this comment a lot..More curious than anything. I am a Fan I of the New Super duties as well..Cheers

 

Nice Car!! If you've got...show it ! But I think it's just a little ghetto that you don't have a black leather car seat in there...what's up with that?? I kid...I kid..

 

I've enjoyed reading this thread. I'm curious, Frantz, if I'm one of those good buyers or bad buyers?


Here's my story:


I had a 2010 F350 6.4 that I bought new, and it had about 71000 miles on it. Black, crew, Lariat Ultimate, leveling kit, almost brand new (less than 2000 miles) 35" Toyo MT tires on black BMF wheels. I knew for about a year prior that around the 5 year mark that I would be wanting to trade. Some coworkers and friends kept asking me why I had the big 1-ton diesel truck when I don't really do any heavy hauling. So I kept thinking about that and convinced myself that I didn't need a big truck anymore and that a F150 would work for me. A friend had a 2014 F150, 5.0V8, crew cab and I did like how it rode and that it had so much more room in it than the dated Super Duty did. It was fall, and I knew from looking at the edges of the pinch welds on the rocker panels and looking under the truck that I didn't want to put it thru another northern NY salty winter because I figured it would really hurt the resale unless I had it fixed up.


So about this time last year I started looking at dealer inventories of the local dealers and saw what I thought I'd like. A black, crew 2015 F150 XLT, FX4, Sport Appearance Package, 5.0V8 (Ecoboost is cool but I'm still old school thinking a truck needs to be a V8 or a diesel). It's located at the dealer that I had taken the F350 to for all the warranty work from when it was 3 days old with 400 miles on it (EGR valve stuck open). The original dealer where I bought the F350 is about 40 miles away so when it broke down I was able to limp it to the closer dealer.


Off I go to the dealer with the 2015 XLT showing in their inventory. I'm out at the line of trucks and don't see one that matches. Sales guy walks out and I told him what I was looking for and he said "I believe we sold that one a few days ago, but whatever you want, we can get it for you." Ok, that's not a big deal, so we sit down and start talking about what the one I was looking for, and I had the detail sheet from the inventory locator to show him. He took it in to his sales manager and came back out and said that it was still in transit and would be there in a few days. Now I feel better since that was the only truck within a 100 mile radius that I wanted.


So at this point, I tell him that I get X plan thru work, and he said that makes everything a lot easier so there's no haggling. Then he tells me how much the rebates are ($4000 I think they were) and then him and the sales manager go out to look at my trade. I already had a range in my head that I would accept for the trade and they actually came in at the top of that range, and about $2400 more than what a couple people had offered me to buy the truck directly.


I told them what I could get for financing at my local credit union, and it was a good rate and they promised they could beat it, and they did by .5% so we shook hands and when the truck showed up about a week and a half later we signed all the paper work. It came on the transporter at about 8:00am on 9/25/15, they had the Rough Country 2.5" leveling kit that I dropped off to them a few days prior installed, and I picked it up at 4:30pm that afternoon. All sounds good right?


Almost every single person I know never has had anything good to say about that dealer that I had dealt with!! Well, someone must like them because they would be out of business otherwise right?


So fast forward a little bit, I smacked a deer with the F150 about 2 months into owning it which bent the bumper, and put a couple small dents in passenger door. At that point I didn't want the truck anymore. I had also towed my snowmobile trailer with it a couple times and after having the big bad diesel I didn't like how the little gasser had to downshift 2-3 gears when going up hills. It has a payload of 1900 pounds so technically I can't go pick up a ton of wood pellets with it to run my pellet stove when it's cold outside (half the year in northern NY) and the biggest kicker is that I had a BOSS V plow on the F350, sold that to a friend, was going to put a BOSS HTX (light duty plow designed specifically for the F150 and other half tons) but since it has electric steering and wasn't equipped with the plow package the Boss dealer wouldn't install it. So now I have to pay someone to plow my driveway. Luckily we had the mildest winter since 1982 last year and I only had to farm out the plow job a handful of times.


I knew that I didn't want a 2016 Super Duty because I already had the 2010 which is basically the same other than the better 6.7 engine and it's dated and the 2017 was just around the corner so I have waited it out until these fine beasts were available.


On July 8th I go back to the dealer where I bought the F150, which I had already been chatting with the salesman online about what I wanted to do. Him and the sales manager (different one than last year, hmmm) look my trade over and tell me what they will give me for it. They already know I get X plan so that part is non negotiable. I'm OK with the trade allowance, and we sit down and the sales manager looks over my build sheet. I'm assuming at this point that it was going to go the way it did when I ordered my 2010 that he would bring stuff up on his computer, and I would walk out of there with my new gem on order. Well, I was wrong.


He goes on to tell me that they have 2 new 2017 Super Duties on order. One is for the General Manager of the dealership because he gets a new one every year, and the other is for dealer stock. He says they don't have any more allocation to order another truck, and that he would talk to the owners and see if they could get the regional rep involved to see if the "dealer stock" order could be changed and that he would get back to me within a few days. A week goes by and I hear nothing so I see the sales guy on Facebook chat and ask him, he says Ford can't change the order they have, and nothing back about getting more allocation. Ok, fair enough, I give them another week. Then I was in the area of the dealer so I stopped in there, still the same song and dance. We were a little over a month into that fiasco when I was at a memorial event for a friend that died 2 years ago. I was chatting with several Ford fans and same thing, nothing but bad things to say about my dealer, and also all but one of them all buy their Fords from another dealer that's about 60 miles away and they suggest I try them. I gave the other dealer one last chance, until they told me that Ford wasn't even going to build any Super Duties until at least September, I knew that was a lie since I had seen pics here of the trucks showing up at dealers. I don't like flat out lies like that.


So I called this other dealer, and spoke to the salesman they all deal with, and he said he'd be glad to try and get my business. We agreed that I'd come on Saturday 8/20. I showed up to the dealer and they couldn't find him. Finally about 20 minutes later he comes out and said he had fallen asleep in his truck because he races go-karts and was at races late the night before. I chuckled at that. We chatted and he told me that a new 2017 was delivered the day before so I would get to actually see one. We went out and looked at it, black crew F250, 6.2 gas XLT. Then he went and got the keys and we took it for about a 10 mile spin. He was as excited to see how the new truck drove and rode as I was. We got back, him and another guy that I'm assuming was his father (he's the owner's son) went out and looked my F150 over, and gave me a price that was $1000 less than the other dealer gave me, but I had taken the custom wheels off that were going to stay on it at the other dealer. I'm thinking that I'm in good shape. Then he takes my build sheet that I had faxed him the day we made the appointment and goes to a computer behind another counter with the other guy that appraised my trade. Comes back, and they had messed up the running boards (put the whole chrome package on that I didn't want) so he went back and they fixed that, and said that all I have to do is give the $500 deposit and they would transmit the order to Ford. I think there was smoke coming off my pen as I wrote the check. I checked with Ford Chat on Monday 8/22 and they had no record of the order. I checked again the next day and they could see the order and it was in processing. Now on 9/15 I have a VIN.


Saturday 9/10 I sold the custom wheels to a friend for $1500 so I'm already $500 to the good on this deal and I still have the MBRP exhaust off the F150 to sell which I figure I can get $300 out of.


I had sent an email to the sales guy from the original dealership telling him that since they couldn't order me a truck that I went to another dealer that could. He messaged me a few days ago asking "did you get your new truck yet?" I almost bet that they knew they had a F350 XLT crew black 6.7 in transit when I was there trying to order and they wanted to force that on me instead of getting me what I wanted (F350 Lariat Ultimate, Black). Oh well. BTW, that same dealer also sells Polaris ATV's and side by sides, or lets say the DID. Turns out once their inventory is gone, they will no longer be a Polaris dealer. Maybe they drove too many customers away with those too?


I hope I didn't put too many of you to sleep. Probably one of the easiest sales of the year that one dealer completely screwed up, and that another dealer got right in just an hour and a half's time or so. Plus that friend that had the 2014 F150 I talked about above just traded recently for a 2016 F150 at this dealer which they have bought several trucks, and I got her $100 since she referred me.

 

Maybe it's luck of the draw, but my last 2 truck buying experiences went very well.

On one, I was eyeing a slightly used vehicle. The salesman came over and introduced himself. I asked if we could take the F-150 out for a test drive. After the drive I explained to the salesman that I was interested, but didn't want to play the games. My Dad was a car salesman and used car manager for decades while I was growing up, I knew most of the games and didn't want to play them. He pulled out a blank sheet of paper, drew a cross on it and asked what I wanted to make for monthly payments. I replied I didn't want to play "4 square". He stared at me and blinked.

I went on to explain that I knew he knew how much he had to get for that truck. They probably discussed it at the last sales meeting. It had been on the lot for over 3 months. If he didn't know, go talk to his manager. Give me a fair price. Not a huge discount, but one where I will be happy and where the dealership will make a profit and he would make some commission.

He then asked about my trade. I told him that we should set a price on the vehicle, then we can discuss my trade.

What about financing? I have my own.

He stared at me and blinked again.

He then went off to find the manager, who came over and greeted me. I explained it all again. The manager gave me a fair price. I accepted it. They drove my trade in and offered me $3000. I accepted it. We all walked away happy.

 

There are always plenty of factors. The two above stores seem quite reasonable to me for customers. Allocation can be tight on the small dealerships, I really can't speak for their pain. I work at a medium dealership and it's part of a regionally large network so I can generally get what I want.

For your traditional sales experience you have a sales manager, a salesman, and yourself. The salesman is your key. He can either try and sell you a truck, or try and sell his manager a sale. A good salesman will do both, and it ends up with a fair deal all around with everyone happy with the transaction.

If you deal direct with a truck department it may be different. I don't have anyone to bounce pricing off of. I know what they sell for on the internet and I try to make pricing the easy part. If someone ever comes back to me thinking they can save thousands off my first offer then we are simply looking at too much truck. I like it that way. But it's amazing how many customers, regardless of how much they've researching pricing online, feel they HAVE to negotiate everything. These are the ones who claim to "hate playing games". Several of em on this site!

 

I've noticed that

 

Franz, I think they get that way for numerous reasons but some of it is learned early on from the "used car" attitude of some high pressure salesmen and unfortunately good salesmen get corralled in with them. Here is a little scenario I put together in another thread just for a little humor. I am sure you know this type salesman:

"Rodney, if you sign right now I can save you 26 thousand dollars and your payments will only be $75.00 a month. Just sign right here and I'll run it up front and see what the boss says. It'll only take a few minutes and I'll be right back. I promise to save you more than anywhere but you have to sign right now in order for me to get this incredible price on this incredible vehicle. Oh, did you see this was 4 wheel drive too? And another great feature is, oh my gosh, I can't believe I didn't tell you this. This cab is 100% MILITARY grade aluminum. And did you see these headlights? Lets walk around this truck together while I explain all the features and I am sure you will be in the driver's seat by tomorrow morning. What's that you ask? Dual alternators? Oh no, they don't fight with each other. One comes on for a while and then the other comes on so they don't wear out as fast. But lets look at the ...well I would have to talk to trailer tow specialist to answer that but I am sure it is adequate. Please just sign right here so I can get the process started then I'll take your deposit as soon as I get back from leaning on the partition talking about the game with the other salesmen and pretending to present this offer to the manager, and oh, by the way, if you sign right now you could be driving this beautiful truck first thing tomorrow....."