Practical Front Axle Swap Advice Needed
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Practical Front Axle Swap Advice Needed
Although I’ve been on FTE for several years I have not posted very much. However, I have read everything I can find on this site (and have read and reread the “read this first” threads numerous times} and I just wanted to take the time to say how much I appreciate the comments many of you have posted as we try to keep these trucks on the road. Thanks for sharing your experiences and knowledge, guys.
First my application—my truck (1973 F250, 4x4, 428FE, 4 speed, power ram assist steering, standard cab) is only used off road occasionally forhunting, wood hauling, etc. It spends 95% of its time on pavement or gravelroads and although it is not my daily driver it is driven several times a week. I have no intention of doing any heavy towing, rock crawling, etc. Although I’ve broken several trucks in the past , I am now a very careful driver. With four kids in, or close to college, I can’t afford not to be.
I have been making very slow but steady progress on building my 1973 F250—body, paint, interior, engine, etc., and I now need some practical advice about my running gear. According to the original owner, and confirmed by the VIN code, I have a special-ordered Dana 60 front with the closed knuckles that was typically only available on crewcabs, instead of the standard D44. Mr.N lists this axle as “undesirable” on his Dana 60 site--as does the “Dana 60 Bible’’ found in several places online. According to several parts suppliers’ websites, the front driver’s side outer shaft cannot be ordered from any source and other parts are getting very hard to find as well. Although my axle currently works fine, at some point I’m going to need to rebuild it and the parts will be veryhard if not impossible to find. That means my truck will be parked and that is simply not acceptable.
So I’m trying to figure out what axle I should start putting together for the swap I’ll need to make when it finally gives out. I am running 9.00 x16 (36.2 ”) tires and the truck has the factory suspension. I do not intend to lift it.
I’ve considered trying to find the 1976-1977 open-knuckle D60 that superseded my axle—because the LP will easily work with my suspension and I won’t have problems with header clearance-- but parts are even more difficult to find for this axle—BOTH the inner AND outer driver’s side shafts are unavailable as best as I can determine. So it looks like from the perspective of parts availability, my options are as follows: (1) a LP D44 open knuckle axle from a 1976-1977 truck, (2) a HP D44 from a 1977.5-1979 truck or (3) the oft-suggested HP D60 from a 1977.5-1979 truck swap. Or…(4) I could find a donor truck with the “undesirable”axle I currently have and hope the parts can be salvaged.
Has anybody else confronted this choice? I know that the HP D60 is by far the toughest axle and parts are readily available for it but I really don’t need it for my application—see above. Besides—they are almost impossible to find with $1200--$1500 as the starting point for an axle that needs to be completely rebuilt. Finding another obsolete axle also doesn’t seemto make sense to me.
The 1976-1977 LP D44 would give me an upgrade to front disk brakes and parts are readily available for this axle.
The 1977.5-1979 HP D44 would give me the same brake upgrades plus higher ground clearance in front in addition to the increased strength of the high pinion spiral-cut gears. Parts are readily available for this axle as well. However, it also might cause problems for my header clearance.
So…have any of you swapped a HP D44 into a truck with headers and factory suspension? Are there any options I have missed? What are your experiences? I welcome your feedback, suggestions, and patience.
First my application—my truck (1973 F250, 4x4, 428FE, 4 speed, power ram assist steering, standard cab) is only used off road occasionally forhunting, wood hauling, etc. It spends 95% of its time on pavement or gravelroads and although it is not my daily driver it is driven several times a week. I have no intention of doing any heavy towing, rock crawling, etc. Although I’ve broken several trucks in the past , I am now a very careful driver. With four kids in, or close to college, I can’t afford not to be.
I have been making very slow but steady progress on building my 1973 F250—body, paint, interior, engine, etc., and I now need some practical advice about my running gear. According to the original owner, and confirmed by the VIN code, I have a special-ordered Dana 60 front with the closed knuckles that was typically only available on crewcabs, instead of the standard D44. Mr.N lists this axle as “undesirable” on his Dana 60 site--as does the “Dana 60 Bible’’ found in several places online. According to several parts suppliers’ websites, the front driver’s side outer shaft cannot be ordered from any source and other parts are getting very hard to find as well. Although my axle currently works fine, at some point I’m going to need to rebuild it and the parts will be veryhard if not impossible to find. That means my truck will be parked and that is simply not acceptable.
So I’m trying to figure out what axle I should start putting together for the swap I’ll need to make when it finally gives out. I am running 9.00 x16 (36.2 ”) tires and the truck has the factory suspension. I do not intend to lift it.
I’ve considered trying to find the 1976-1977 open-knuckle D60 that superseded my axle—because the LP will easily work with my suspension and I won’t have problems with header clearance-- but parts are even more difficult to find for this axle—BOTH the inner AND outer driver’s side shafts are unavailable as best as I can determine. So it looks like from the perspective of parts availability, my options are as follows: (1) a LP D44 open knuckle axle from a 1976-1977 truck, (2) a HP D44 from a 1977.5-1979 truck or (3) the oft-suggested HP D60 from a 1977.5-1979 truck swap. Or…(4) I could find a donor truck with the “undesirable”axle I currently have and hope the parts can be salvaged.
Has anybody else confronted this choice? I know that the HP D60 is by far the toughest axle and parts are readily available for it but I really don’t need it for my application—see above. Besides—they are almost impossible to find with $1200--$1500 as the starting point for an axle that needs to be completely rebuilt. Finding another obsolete axle also doesn’t seemto make sense to me.
The 1976-1977 LP D44 would give me an upgrade to front disk brakes and parts are readily available for this axle.
The 1977.5-1979 HP D44 would give me the same brake upgrades plus higher ground clearance in front in addition to the increased strength of the high pinion spiral-cut gears. Parts are readily available for this axle as well. However, it also might cause problems for my header clearance.
So…have any of you swapped a HP D44 into a truck with headers and factory suspension? Are there any options I have missed? What are your experiences? I welcome your feedback, suggestions, and patience.
Cargo Master
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,099
Likes: 8
From: York, Pa
I was in the same boat as you a few years ago and decided on the hp D60. I do not regret the decision but it was expensive. The easiest and cheapest swap you could do would be a open knuckle lp d44 since you would only get into brake hoses and a combo u joint. However the better option would be hp d44 and also do the 78/79 3/4 ton ps gearbox too. The downfall is now you need brake hoses, new driveshaft the gearbox and whatever else the axle may need. I'm not sure about stock height and header clearance but myself I would go the hp 44. You'll be happy with the turning radius of a open knuckle axle once it's done.
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PA74F250
This is exactly the kind of feedback I need. Although I’d like to save some money , the cost of the D60 swap wouldn’t necessarily preclude me from going that route, its' really a matter of complexity and availabilityof the axles. As I continue to think about it—and look for a swappable axle—I havea couple of more questions for you.
The HP D60 swap worked well for you. I gather from your previous postings that your truck has at least 37 inch tires and is lifted. How much lift are you running?I know there is a lot of “how to” info about this swap posted but is there any specific advice you can offer me from your own experience?
If I am going to do this swap, I will also take your advice and upgrade to the later power steering in addition to the brakes—if I go with the HP D44 or D60 axle.
You are right about the improved turn radius. I used to have a 1976 F250 with the LP open knuckle D44; it turned a lot better than my current beast.
Finally, have you also upgraded your rear axle or are you still running the 1974 axle? My VIN indicates that I have a D61 instead of a D60 rear. Hmmm...
Thanks for your advice.
This is exactly the kind of feedback I need. Although I’d like to save some money , the cost of the D60 swap wouldn’t necessarily preclude me from going that route, its' really a matter of complexity and availabilityof the axles. As I continue to think about it—and look for a swappable axle—I havea couple of more questions for you.
The HP D60 swap worked well for you. I gather from your previous postings that your truck has at least 37 inch tires and is lifted. How much lift are you running?I know there is a lot of “how to” info about this swap posted but is there any specific advice you can offer me from your own experience?
If I am going to do this swap, I will also take your advice and upgrade to the later power steering in addition to the brakes—if I go with the HP D44 or D60 axle.
You are right about the improved turn radius. I used to have a 1976 F250 with the LP open knuckle D44; it turned a lot better than my current beast.
Finally, have you also upgraded your rear axle or are you still running the 1974 axle? My VIN indicates that I have a D61 instead of a D60 rear. Hmmm...
Thanks for your advice.
Cargo Master
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,099
Likes: 8
From: York, Pa
I do not regret getting the hp 60 one bit but I got pretty good deal on it. I paid $850 for mine with a new gear set included along with the stuff to swap steering. With that being said I made it up doing the usual stuff it needed. I'd say with the crossover steering setup and refurbishing my axle I had roughly $3k in it and I did the gears myself. You can put just as much money in any other axle if you start doing things. Just try to get one with the right gears in it from the start and if your lucky good brakes. I still use the rear d60 because it's not broke and has a Detroit locker in it. Despite what they say they really are tough but I do have a D70 in stock just in case. As for tires and lift I have 37" hummer tires and 40" Groundhawgs with a 4" lift.
Lead Driver
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,250
Likes: 11
From: West Virginia
I personally would not swap the old closed knuckle axles under anything and I wouldn't even keep one under a truck that came with it... I'm just not a fan and the drums, for those that came with drums, are inadequate for the front of a truck. Those axles are coarse spline and though some have higher gawr than newer hp44's I don't think there is any loss in strength.
D60's are nice but expensive. Cheaper to buy them in whole trucks than to buy bare axles from people who know what they have. For me personally the cost is steep given that the world has moved on and there are newer axles that put the strength of the old kingpin ones to shame, and they are available for a fraction of the price. But they come with their own draw backs, like short drivers side tubes, cast mounts, and 8x170 bolt patterns.
But great factory lockouts, big shafts, huge u joints, excellent brakes, etc may make up for it.
Really just depends what you have to pull parts off of.
D60's are nice but expensive. Cheaper to buy them in whole trucks than to buy bare axles from people who know what they have. For me personally the cost is steep given that the world has moved on and there are newer axles that put the strength of the old kingpin ones to shame, and they are available for a fraction of the price. But they come with their own draw backs, like short drivers side tubes, cast mounts, and 8x170 bolt patterns.
But great factory lockouts, big shafts, huge u joints, excellent brakes, etc may make up for it.
Really just depends what you have to pull parts off of.
Tuned
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 348
Likes: 2
From: Northern Michigan
I've swapped axles before. But not this scenario. Have you thought about Dodge axles. My 93 1 ton Dodge sports an OEM Dana 60 low pinion with lockouts. 4.10 gears. Diff is on the passenger side and it has disc brakes. Swapping spring perches isn't that big of a job. Just be sure to get the pinion angle correct.
Drivers side diff. DOHT!
Drivers side diff. DOHT!
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Thanks for all the great ideas guys. I have decided definitely not to try to find a donor axle to keep my closed knuckle D60 alive—thanks for removing any doubt in that respect Hasteranger, it was really not a very good idea. Moving on from that...I had just about decided on not doing a LP upgrade at all when Palmrose 2 posted his interesting suggestion re: LP Dodge axles…very nice out of the box idea. Hmm…
I just got the Beast II back from the paint shop. It's looking pretty old school...I'll post some pics soon.
I just got the Beast II back from the paint shop. It's looking pretty old school...I'll post some pics soon.
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Guys, so after lots of thinking, and considering your advice, I decided to go ahead with the Dana 60 HP front axle after all. If I’m going to put money, parts, time, thought, etc., into something, I think I should just go with the D60. The right axle showed up close to a friend’s house in Denver and I was way overdue for a road trip anyway. So I grabbed the axle and it’s now home inTexas—it has the 4:10 gears I wanted so I got pretty lucky. This is where the fun begins…
Thank you for your suggestions. You really forced me to think this through.
Thank you for your suggestions. You really forced me to think this through.
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Yeah...I know it....the wallet gets thinner. So the next question becomes which steering option should I pursue? My truck is not lifted so several of the popular options might be problematic for me. Believe it or not, I am perfectly happy with the ram assist I currently have. Numerous threads are devoted to various steering options and perhaps I would like to upgrade at some point--in fact I am sure of it. However, I replaced the ram assist pump and box five years ago, installed a small cooler and filter, and have had nary a leak. I'd like to optimize what I have and put off the major steering swap for a while. I'd like to focus on the axle and brakes first.
Any ideas about optimizing my existing power steering?
Any ideas about optimizing my existing power steering?
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