Which Torque Converter?
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Senior User
Joined: Jun 2015
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Which Torque Converter?
OK, I hate the factory TC (torque converter), and my next mod will be the TC along with a upgraded valve body. I have just started looking and there are lots of options, Suncoast, Banks, ATS, and many more. I was wondering which is best for a close to factory truck, but will also work with future mods. The truck will be used for daily driving and towing, so I want a low stall application, and I also want a drain plug. my truck is a 2000 2 wheel drive dually.
Or would I be better off with a HD 4R100
Fuel economy is a must,
Or would I be better off with a HD 4R100
Fuel economy is a must,
Butt-Head
Joined: Apr 2004
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From: Reed Point, MT
Or would I be better off with a HD 4R100
Elder User
Joined: Aug 2015
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My opinion would be a BD Diesel furnace brazed billet converter, John wood valve body. The HD is not needed unless you tow weight a lot, or want a hot rod with horse power. The valve body is a huge value, and improved my transmission immensely.
Postmaster
Joined: Dec 2010
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From: Gary,Indiana
First of all how many miles are on your truck?
How heavy do you tow?
How much HP do plan to make down the road?
How deep are your pockets $$$$$$$$$$
Because all of these things will play a factor in what will work for your needs. Now putting a high $$ TC in a old used trans COULD be a waste of money. Let's just say you put a new TC in and 10k later the trans goes out, you just wiped out a TC!
TC once it gets crap in it, it will be junk or at least would need to be rebuilt also. Which can run $400 or better. And replacing the valve body is actually one of the last trans upgrades that need to be done. Since there is NO design flaw with the valve body and it can be adjusted (To a point) in tuning.
The main issues with a 4R100 is center support, pump bushing, pump seal, OD retaining ring and TC.
Please do your research and you will see a stock 4R100 has more then a few design flaws. So yes a HD4R100 is a step up but still NOT bullet proof. If you have deep pockets and want the best go with a BTS or John Woods 4R100.
How heavy do you tow?
How much HP do plan to make down the road?
How deep are your pockets $$$$$$$$$$
Because all of these things will play a factor in what will work for your needs. Now putting a high $$ TC in a old used trans COULD be a waste of money. Let's just say you put a new TC in and 10k later the trans goes out, you just wiped out a TC!
TC once it gets crap in it, it will be junk or at least would need to be rebuilt also. Which can run $400 or better. And replacing the valve body is actually one of the last trans upgrades that need to be done. Since there is NO design flaw with the valve body and it can be adjusted (To a point) in tuning. The main issues with a 4R100 is center support, pump bushing, pump seal, OD retaining ring and TC.
Please do your research and you will see a stock 4R100 has more then a few design flaws. So yes a HD4R100 is a step up but still NOT bullet proof. If you have deep pockets and want the best go with a BTS or John Woods 4R100.
Elder User
Joined: Aug 2015
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Good points. Except the valve body. My stock tranny had 178k miles on it when I built my 500+ hp monster. I knew my Tranny would not last long, and the wife said no new until it goes. Lol. So, I've been trying. Any way, it ate the tranny in about 4 months. I have a very heavy foot and addiction to horse power. Turned out it wasn't the tranny, but the valve body packed it in. So in went John Woods valve body. I don't use the 500+ tune much, know its a definite kill. But my daily driver is about 400hp, and as said I have a heavy foot. To this day the Tranny still holds up, and that valve body is the key. It is a total improvement over stock and will make any age tranny last longer. Much longer. The Torque converter helps too. Transmission failure rarely causes debris to enter the torque converter.
Postmaster
Joined: Dec 2010
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From: Gary,Indiana
Good points. Except the valve body. My stock tranny had 178k miles on it when I built my 500+ hp monster. I knew my Tranny would not last long, and the wife said no new until it goes. Lol. So, I've been trying. Any way, it ate the tranny in about 4 months. I have a very heavy foot and addiction to horse power. Turned out it wasn't the tranny, but the valve body packed it in. So in went John Woods valve body. I don't use the 500+ tune much, know its a definite kill. But my daily driver is about 400hp, and as said I have a heavy foot. To this day the Tranny still holds up, and that valve body is the key. It is a total improvement over stock and will make any age tranny last longer. Much longer. The Torque converter helps too. Transmission failure rarely causes debris to enter the torque converter.
Oh ... there is also one more major 4R100 design flaw on the some 2001's and that is the mechanical diode spag.
So I hope none you guys have one of these trans because the mechanical diode spag is a ticking time bomb.
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Elder User
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Mines an 02. So no worry there. I know its a matter of time. Whats amazing is how it holds up now. Just luck maybe, but I give it the thumbs up for a stock truck. When it does go it will go to John Woods for a super build, and I know that will hold up, since his upgrades cure all those issues. And if this tranny can do it. John Woods will definitely hold up.
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Postmaster
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 2,951
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From: Gary,Indiana
Mines an 02. So no worry there. I know its a matter of time. Whats amazing is how it holds up now. Just luck maybe, but I give it the thumbs up for a stock truck. When it does go it will go to John Woods for a super build, and I know that will hold up, since his upgrades cure all those issues. And if this tranny can do it. John Woods will definitely hold up.
I personally think Banks, ATS, BD, RacerX and few more companies are highly over rated and you are just paying their "Marketing" bill since they only use 1/2 the cool parts JW or BTS use.
I almost forgot to touch on SunCoast they make some really trick parts and I am sure they too build a really nice 4R100. I have never know anyone run a SunCoast trans. I have used their parts from them and other who have had good luck with their parts too.
Logistics Pro
Joined: Apr 2011
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From: Earth
I agree 100% that you got a good tranny from the factory, maybe some good luck. If you have the cash for a John Woods or BTS that is the way to go. Because both of these guys don't just rebuild the 4R100 but they have re-engineered it! They also use custom made parts, billet or cyroed and they blue print it to their specs. Also if you were to price out the parts they use in their builds you end up with at LEAST $2600 in parts. So actually you will get your money's worth with either of these companies.
I personally think Banks, ATS, BD, RacerX and few more companies are highly over rated and you are just paying their "Marketing" bill since they only use 1/2 the cool parts JW or BTS use.
I almost forgot to touch on SunCoast they make some really trick parts and I am sure they too build a really nice 4R100. I have never know anyone run a SunCoast trans. I have used their parts from them and other who have had good luck with their parts too.
I personally think Banks, ATS, BD, RacerX and few more companies are highly over rated and you are just paying their "Marketing" bill since they only use 1/2 the cool parts JW or BTS use.
I almost forgot to touch on SunCoast they make some really trick parts and I am sure they too build a really nice 4R100. I have never know anyone run a SunCoast trans. I have used their parts from them and other who have had good luck with their parts too.
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Senior User
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Even more confused now. My friend has a Suncoast transmission and he has had for many years with no problems. His truck has a tune and some fuel mods only, but he pulls heavy (tractors, hay, planters, etc)
My transmission has no issues, just thought I should upgrade the valve body and TC to protect the transmission. Did not know about the other problems like the OD ring and center support. It is a 5,000 dollar truck, don't want to go crazy.
My transmission has no issues, just thought I should upgrade the valve body and TC to protect the transmission. Did not know about the other problems like the OD ring and center support. It is a 5,000 dollar truck, don't want to go crazy.
Postmaster
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 2,951
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From: Gary,Indiana
Even more confused now. My friend has a Suncoast transmission and he has had for many years with no problems. His truck has a tune and some fuel mods only, but he pulls heavy (tractors, hay, planters, etc)
My transmission has no issues, just thought I should upgrade the valve body and TC to protect the transmission. Did not know about the other problems like the OD ring and center support. It is a 5,000 dollar truck, don't want to go crazy.
My transmission has no issues, just thought I should upgrade the valve body and TC to protect the transmission. Did not know about the other problems like the OD ring and center support. It is a 5,000 dollar truck, don't want to go crazy.
Logistics Pro
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 4,744
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From: Earth
Personally in your case I would just leave the TC and valve body alone and spend your money changing ATF, filter in the pan and put an external ATF filter on it. I wouldn't worry about the TC until it sounds like it has mables inside it when unlocked. That and don't drive it hard if you want it to last longer. I see you already have a 6.0 cooler which is very helpful keeping temps down when towing. Do you have a trans temp gauge yet? If not get one and keep an eye on trans temp.
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