So I at long last have a lead on the holy grail of all Ys. The 312.


I am going to look at it on Wednesday. It is in a 49 F6. The only reason being is in 62 they could not locate a good flattie to replace the blown one.
I live next to the guy who did the swap with his dad while on leave from the service. He is very insistant that it is a 312.


Also I finaly got my shop up so it will be in full service within 18 months so the restoration can begain at last.


Now the opinion part,


After talking with momma (The wife) she has stated some goals for this thing that she would like to see assuming we use this as intended.


I would like to use my 64 LWB F100 to pull a smaller camper, either pop up or single axle travel trailer. It would be
1-Trailer weight of around or less than 3500lbs. (most popups are under 3000lbs)
2-Equiped with trailer brakes. Most likely electric but potentially the semi effective surge type
3-Hauling two adults, some firewood, coolers and associated camping such and two dogs (I call them medium sized, the vet and insurance agent says they are large) IE 1000lbs.


Momma says,
You need AC!
You need power steering!


I am definitely going to install disc brakes in it and intened to keep the old 4spd.


This is what I would like to do,


312 w/ 113 heads, ram horns, petronix and 390 holley.
Little lost on cam choice- thinking stock or murmmets 260
3.50 9 inch with 235/75 R15 tires on the rear.
CPP power steering
Speedway disc brake conversion
Classic auto air combo AC and heater
Lots of soundproofing and a set of long tube smitthys.
I would like to cruise at 65mph on the flats and am willing to chug a bit in the hills.


I have towed with the old girl a bit and hauled some fairly stout loads (1500-2000lbs) of wood and rock on several occasions and find the acceleration and speed with a 292 and 3.89 rear just fine. braking is the only challenge with the manual drums.


The main thing is is this doable out of the old girl I realize that you cannot go to napa and get every part that day if something happens.....


Just want something neat and interesting to take around.

 

Quickest way to tell if its a 312, is pull a plug and measure the stroke. 292 is 3.300, 312 is 3.440.

 

People do it, so yes, it is doable. I think you're going the wrong way with the rear gearing.

The 312 should have good torque for the job but make usre it is a 312 before you pay for a 312. Lots of people insist it is. I wouldn't take anyone's word on that. Even if he believes he's being honest, it is based off of a 53 year old memory. Memory becomes less reliable as time goes on.

What I would do, if that really is a 312, is buy it for the crank, have the crank turned to fit a 292 block and then bore the 292 .050, to 312 bore. That will give the strongest combination, better for a tow rig. It will also free up a little power since the 292s smaller mains will consume less power due to less friction.

 

I find it hard to belive that a 3.50 rear is high! I pulled a reversed WC allis loader behind a 83 F150 with a 300. With the tractor and trailer that is about 8000lbs.
While I love the 300 it is only comparable in torque and about half the horsepower. I think a 312 pulling a much much lighter load with double the power should be sufficient.


The guy is my neighbor, He is polish, He got angry when I second gussed him. I am going to offer $200 for the thing and see where it goes. If he guarantees it I will go higher. He is a well known guy and I have been told he is trustworthy by some good folks.


What is the value of a good 312? On the coasts stuff goes a lot higher than around here but that is all I know.


I do intend to use a 292 block. I have one pickled in vasaline down at the farm.

 

The value depends on a lot of things. If the motor is seized, I'd offer scrap value. If it turns over, maybe $200. If it runs, and can be shown running, possibly more than $200.
I don't value 312s more than any other Y. They have their own issues which really make them less desirable - the crank is the main thing I'd want.

 

They are prone to cracks on the crank journals?

 

Yes, cracks in the main journal and cam tunnel alignment issues, possibly due to the material removed from the block to fit the larger mains. Also more minor things like more expensive rear main seal and bearings.

 

Looked at that engine last night. Bit of an enigma.


The cylinder head casting appears to be ECR-B. I cant find any reference to that casting number.
The has a 57 and up intake on it as it is a standard holley carb on it. It has the dual advance distributor as well. The exhaust is a crossover pipe style and it has a late 60s alternator on it.
I could not look at the crank flange as it has a 1 piece bellhousing with a SAE bolt pattern.
I told they guy I would buy it if he could prove it was a 312 but was going to have to pull it out.
He is going to pull it next spring and I have first dibs.

 

ECR is heavy duty truck or industrial 292 according to Mummerts head ID chart. Intake is also possibly HD truck. Exhaust is possibly truck.

So it's a cobbled together Y which is not looking too good as far as being a 312. It is possible that all of that could have been put onto a 312 short block, but I wouldn't hold my breath.

Block numbers, and car or truck water pump would be more clues. Did you get / notice those?

 

We are going to pull it next spring and look at the crank. Not much else one can do.

 

I am a little confused here ....Are you going to tow with the 49 F-6 or the 64 F-100?

If you're going to install disc brakes, "tow" with & drive the F-6 etc.......... understand that you'll likely need to replace the front AND rear axles, and find different wheels and tires for it. (Don't even think of using the "widow-makers" it likely has on it) Another user on this forum used a DANA 80 on his 56 F-600.

AND, I would install a dual circuit brake system (and I am on my 55 F-600) . The single system was great until it developed a leak. Then you have NO BRAKES.


If you tow any trailer, ensure that it has BIG electric brakes on it. With surge brakes, if you lose your tow vehicle brakes, then you ALSO have NO BRAKES!

Cheers,


Rick

 

Towing the little camper is with the 64 F100.


The supposed 312 engine is in a 49 F6 about 20 miles away from here.


I also own a 49 F6. It has widow maker wheels and a single circuit brake system.


I use it to haul gravel and dirt and such. It gets about 500 miles a year at most.


I have no idea why everyone is so against split rims. Billions of miles have been traveled with loads on 20" split rim tires. So if you assume the likely hood of a bad thing happening it is probably in the 1 to 10,000,000 range.


Servicing them is a different story..............

 

And I can tell you from experience that a dual master cylinder in a vehicle not originally designed for it is not necessarily any safer. Why? Don't know. Don't know enough about it. Pedal ratio has been suggested, but have found no way to confirm this and no one seems to know what the correct ratio is.
All I can say is I had a rear brake failure with a dual mc and had no brakes at all. Fortunately this happened in my driveway. Fixed the problem with the rear and braking was back to normal.

So don't let a dual mc give a false sense of security.

 

I wish I had a dual circuit system. I do feel it is a lot safer.
The hand brake works very good and one can always shut the engine off while in gear........


I had my wheel cylinder fail completely with 3 yards of gravel on coming up to a stoplight.


I hit the handbrake and started down shifting the clash box as hard as I could. I stopped thank god. I went straight home and parked it till I got wheel cylinders in the rear.


The only thing that sucks is one cannot get the booster anymore. I had mine sent to midland and they sent it back as no service parts are available.


My F6 will be going up for sale this winter or next spring. It needs paint but otherwise is as restored as one can get it.

 

This is the whole purpose of dual circuit brake systems.............You might have had other issues with that system....

It's really not a false sense of security.

Get a leak with a single circuit, You lose all the brakes.

Leak with a dual circuit, You shouldn't lose the brakes. (unless something else is wrong with it)

I'll be putting a dual circuit on mine, I'm planing a master cyl with at least 1.5" pistons, proportioning valve etc.......... I'll post what finally works.

The safety record of split rims is not the issue. The issue is OLD rusty split rims.

There also just isn't anyone that will mount tires on them anymore.....

Conventional wisdom is that they are unsafe today. If you were driving down the street and you had one pop a ring that killed someone, the survivors and their lawyers would own your house and any other assets you have after it was all said and done because negligence is pretty easy to prove with something like this.

Just saying........




Rick