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I need to replace the fuel tank pressure sensor on my '99 Expedition Eddie Bauer 5.4 liter and I need some advice. It seems like it would be relatively simple to drop the tank about 12 inches, disconnect the wire, remove the sensor from the top of the fuel pump, install the new sensor, connect the wire and raise the tank and reconnect straps
My question is: since the sensor is fairly small, is it possible to remove it from the top of the tank without dropping the tank? Is there enough room on top of the tank and clear access to do this? Obviously it would save a lot of time and effort but I am not sure if there is enough room to do it this way. Has anyone done this way or is it necessary to drop the tank? I have the tank almost empty now so it would not be that heavy, I also will likely be using a garage with a lift and jack to lower the tank but, if at all possible I would obviously prefer to do it the easier way.
Any words of wisdom you can provide will be greatly appreciated. Also, is there a write up (or video) somewhere on how to do this procedure?
Drop the spare tire and take a look. Put it on ramps if you have them so you can sit. I'm pretty sure you can disconnect and remove with a quarter turn.
On a 99 the FTPS is built into the fuel pump assembly. I don't know that you can change the sensor without lowering the tank even a little bit. But if you want to try, I would remove the drive shaft and that should allow you room to get around to the top of the tank. Give the FTPS a 1/4 turn to the right and lift it out. Disconnect the wire connector from it, plug the connector into the new sensor, install it, and give it a 1/4 turn back to the left to lock it back in place.
I was hoping that there was enough room between the top of the tank and body to slide a hand and remove it. I have seen a couple of videos that show how to do it but they all involve replacing the fuel pump which obviously is much bigger and does require lowering the tank but I could not find anything just on the pressure sensor.
It seems it would be easier to lower the tank than messing with the drive shaft. In any case, I will take it to a place near my home where you can rent a bay and lift by the hour and it includes usage of their tools as well as a mechanic to provide advice. I have used it several times and it is a huge help, particularly when you need to work under the car and the lift makes all the difference.
Latest update and good news. I had reserved a bay with lift at the local DIY place and the spare tire was off (different problem). Once I got under the truck there was plenty of room to disconnect the plug from the old sensor, remove the sensor, install the new sensor and connect the plug without lowering the tank. I can see where it might be needed to lower the tank to replace the fuel pump but it is most definitely not needed to replace the fuel sensor...maybe not even the fuel pump. Not having the spare tire in the way made a huge difference. The entire process took a couple of minutes at most.
Had I know this, I would have done it in my driveway maybe with ramps just to have the additional clearance. Hopefully it will help others needing to replace the fuel pressure sensor.
Older thread, but it helped me out. I replaced the FTPS yesterday on our 2000 Expedition 2WD, it was as easy as vtgboss posted. I drove both left side wheels up on ramps, put the jack under the frame for support, removed the spare and took a look. Removing the spare gave me plenty of room and I was able to sit up behind the axle. All that took me 10 minutes. Disconnected the connector, turned the sensor 90 degrees CCW and wiggled it out. The sensor DOES clear the ring holding the fuel pump so removal and replacement (with a little vaseline on the o-ring) made the install easier than expected. Drove it for 50 miles and the P0452 code has not returned.
So, in my 2003 Expedition, I am looking at everything because the EVAP system is never completing. I first had a P0446 code. I fixed up the Vent solenoid. I now have a P0442 code.
I am seeing an odd value for what I believe is Fuel Tank Pressure. It shows to be nearly 5000. I am pretty sure this is incorrect.
In my opinion, this would NOT be from a leak. Rather, this would be from a defective part.
Torque reading of FTPRES (Fuel Tank Pressure)
So, I went to look at the reading at the sensor. The book shows it to be attached to a line between the tank and the Vent Solenoid. Fuel Pressure Sensor location.
I can't see it anywhere. Some posts, including the thread above, states that it should be visible behind the spare tire. I could not see it. I have to go to work soon, so I cleaned up.
After I get everything back together, I remember that I have this inspection camera. (Sometimes I wonder how I get anything done!) Anyway, I pull it out and I am only able to see the following that looks to be just about centered on top of the tank. This view is from the driver's side of the vehicle.I could not get my hands through there.
Fuel Tank Pressure Switch
My questions are:
Does anyone have experience with this reading in Torque? Is your reading off the rails like mine, yet passes the tests?
Has anyone been able to successfully change one of these without dropping the tank?
It does not look like any of the replacement part images I find called out for this vehicle. Frankly, the new part looks to be too tall. Is the part I need not the part I am finding at all? Is what I need actually part of a hose assembly?
You're likely beating your head unnecessarily against a wall if you're trying to get the vehicle ready for emissions testing. Most jurisdictions allow at least one "incomplete" monitor as long as there are no fault codes.
The "data" you're seeing in Torque is undoubtedly due to a faulty formula. The only way you'd see 4800 psi pressure in the vent system is during an explosion event.
The parts listing you found is incorrect, the sensor is in the vent hose.
I can't comment on the pressure switch, but this may help with the EVAP Leak code. Do you ever smell gas outside the truck once you park after driving with a full tank? I did with my 2003 for a few years. Finally dropped the tank last year to replace the fuel pump when the fuel system quit holding pressure after being off for a few minutes. I found the vent fittings at the front and rear of the tank had cracked. They're fused into place, not serviceable. I got some tank repair putty and filled the cracks. I no longer have the gas smell and I've had the EVAP leak code once since, I'm sure for a vacuum line somewhere.
If you look at the scale that's built for the Torque Pro app's Ford FTPRES PID , I think it's a 0-10 scale. I went out and looked at my '03 Expy's FTPRES in Torque Pro and it's pretty steady at 4.9 and I have no DTC codes. Like Project said, if you ever actually had 4800 psi in that sensor it would be in some type of catastrophic explosion as the Expy was turned to schrapnel. So, I don't think that sensor is your problem. I think who ever made up the Torque app plugin didn't get it right. Some people say that that sensor is really just sending a voltage from 0-5v to the ECU and the higher the voltage (closer to 5v ) the lower the tank pressure. I took my gas cap off and it didn't change the value, so I'm inclined to believe that 0-5v scale. So actually what's being read by Torque is a voltage number, not a psi number. So 4.8-4.9v is probably normal and low tank pressure. If you go into the Torque Ford FTPRES PID and change the scale from PSI to Volts you'll see, and you'll feel better. Oh, and my EVAP System shows incomplete most of the time as well on the Torque app. I'm not sure it's set to read the ECU correctly for that. Because other scanners show the drive cycles and EVAP tests as completed. So don't ditch your Expy on readings from an open source app like Torque. I usually use my Ford IDS3, Auto Enginuity laptop scan software or an Ancel FX6000 to look at live data on our vehicles. I really only use the Torque app as a temporary or quick look at a DTC code if I have nothing else with me. Do you have access to a mechanic's smoke tester ? That would help find any leaks too.
At atmospheric pressure, the FTP sensor should have an output voltage of about 2.5 -2.6 volts. Keep in mind that his sensor is designed to measure very small changes in pressure and vacuum. If you'll notice, the unit is in "in H20" or inches water column. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inch_of_water]. There's a reason that, for leak testing, you aren't supposed to pressurize the system with more than a pound or two of pressure.
At atmospheric pressure, the FTP sensor should have an output voltage of about 2.5 -2.6 volts. Keep in mind that his sensor is designed to measure very small changes in pressure and vacuum. If you'll notice, the unit is in "in H20" or inches water column. [[url]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inch_of_water]. There's a reason that, for leak testing, you aren't supposed to pressurize the system with more than a pound or two of pressure.
Project I agree. I went and looked at it with IDS and it's right at 2.53 volts. I think the $4 Torque Pro is just messed up with this PID and it's causing a lot of headaches if that's all you're depending on for your troubleshooting. I very rarely use it. Just in emergencies if I had nothing else. But I wouldn't rip my vehicle apart over anything Torque gave me.
The testing stations (yes, I have tried a couple) are the ones failing it. Texas is not too lax on everything.
Attached is the PID config and it shows what is listed for FTPRES, and what Hamfisted described. It is listed as PSI and MAX of 10.0 and MIN of 0.0. The equation is ((A*256)=B)*0.1449. I agree about the values and the explosion part. This whole "adventure" has been a pain. I'll try reloading the Plug-in. Even re-load the App if I have to. I just changed the PSI to Volts. I'll test it in the AM.
Sensor is in the vent hose. It figures that it wouldn't be easy or simple.
Tank repair putty? Never heard of it. I'll remember that if I find that is the case. Smell fuel vapors after shutting down? My smeller is not great. But, I wouldsmell fuel if I did have a leak. I don't smell anything.
Smoke Machine? It must be made of gold. I have not found somebody that does not want a fortune to check with it. So, I am going to build one. I have almost all of the parts.
This week has been and continues to be tough. Everything is pulling at me. Will respond ASAP.
Effective October 15, 2008:For vehicles year model 2001 and newer, we allow one (1) non-continuous monitor to be Not Ready and still pass the test, but two (2) or more Not Ready's will cause the vehicle to fail.
It would be helpful if you posted EXACTLY why the e-testing facilities have failed your vehicle. A simple, single incomplete without any DTCs should cause a failure.
As for the Torque formula and the units, there's something wrong with the implementation. It's probably a red herring at this point based on the limited data presented. I don't know how to fix it, but I can see enough to know to ignore those numbers as presented.
There is no valid data supplied that indicates the FTP sensor is defective. Possibly another rabbit trail. The whole premise of this thread is based on a shaky "diagnosis" or, more likely a guess.
