starter issue: manual or auto?
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starter issue: manual or auto?
my 84 6.9 has the 4 sp manual tran. after replacing it's starter last yr, the replacement is doing that same thing where it grinds uselessly a time or two and then catches. autozone special reman Japanese m series w lifetime warranty.
question.... does it need a specific type of starter for manual tran? I looked at flywheel and it seems to be ok, a couple chingers on teeth here and there. starter is longer nose, and you can see its teeth, there is a space between the body and the solenoid. i did read the article on the differences between man and auto, tooth count, etc. but need more info, advice. this truck is daily driver, and I need to know..should I try for the shorter fatter nose they pictured in the article? one day, I know, ring gear will need replx, try to be good with it for now.
question.... does it need a specific type of starter for manual tran? I looked at flywheel and it seems to be ok, a couple chingers on teeth here and there. starter is longer nose, and you can see its teeth, there is a space between the body and the solenoid. i did read the article on the differences between man and auto, tooth count, etc. but need more info, advice. this truck is daily driver, and I need to know..should I try for the shorter fatter nose they pictured in the article? one day, I know, ring gear will need replx, try to be good with it for now.
More Turbo
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 515
Likes: 8
No it does not matter.
I actually had a similar experience, except my starter is from O'reilly auto parts. First one I got lasted like a month before it started doing the grinding thing you're talking about. This was one of the ones with the longer nose as well, with that snout that sticks out over half of it (like this: http://dcpcart.com/OScart/images/69starter.png).
I took it back and the only one they had was the one without that snout thing, like this: https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/i...LeqPuBuzK2-8sA
I put that ^ starter on and it fits fine and everything. I also couldn't believe how much faster it cranked with that starter! It started so fast, that starter died after like 2 weeks so I got another one and it's been good so far.
So yes, it should work.
I actually had a similar experience, except my starter is from O'reilly auto parts. First one I got lasted like a month before it started doing the grinding thing you're talking about. This was one of the ones with the longer nose as well, with that snout that sticks out over half of it (like this: http://dcpcart.com/OScart/images/69starter.png).
I took it back and the only one they had was the one without that snout thing, like this: https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/i...LeqPuBuzK2-8sA
I put that ^ starter on and it fits fine and everything. I also couldn't believe how much faster it cranked with that starter! It started so fast, that starter died after like 2 weeks so I got another one and it's been good so far.
So yes, it should work.
Logistics Pro
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 3,739
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From: Western Mass
If you have a lifetime warranty at autozone, why don't you just swap it?
Thats better than forking over more cash...
If you want to spend the money, get a new style hi-torque one like this:
DB Electrical - FORD TRUCK & CASE 6.9L 7.3L DIESEL STARTER F250 F350 1985-1994 HI TORK
Its smaller/lighter so easier to install and spins over faster.
Thats better than forking over more cash...
If you want to spend the money, get a new style hi-torque one like this:
DB Electrical - FORD TRUCK & CASE 6.9L 7.3L DIESEL STARTER F250 F350 1985-1994 HI TORK
Its smaller/lighter so easier to install and spins over faster.
Postmaster
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 3,860
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What's interesting is that my truck came from the PO with one that looked like this:
DB Electrical - FORD TRUCK & CASE 6.9L 7.3L DIESEL STARTER F250 F350 1985-1994 HI TORK
It's always been faithful and cranked over well enough; no lack of power or anything but I ended up getting an older Denso unit, like this: http://dcpcart.com/OScart/images/69starter.png
I was just going to use it on a test engine, but it worked /extremely/ well. Better than my other one -- I'm thinking that it's just not geared as low, and as long as I can supply it enough power it will crank faster.
I'm going to be using it instead now... For one thing, it's a /ton/ easier to install the third bolt on it.
It had a flaky solenoid, which I replaced for $20, and the end bearing had /totally/ gone; made myself a bushing and it runs great now.
DB Electrical - FORD TRUCK & CASE 6.9L 7.3L DIESEL STARTER F250 F350 1985-1994 HI TORK
It's always been faithful and cranked over well enough; no lack of power or anything but I ended up getting an older Denso unit, like this: http://dcpcart.com/OScart/images/69starter.png
I was just going to use it on a test engine, but it worked /extremely/ well. Better than my other one -- I'm thinking that it's just not geared as low, and as long as I can supply it enough power it will crank faster.
I'm going to be using it instead now... For one thing, it's a /ton/ easier to install the third bolt on it.
It had a flaky solenoid, which I replaced for $20, and the end bearing had /totally/ gone; made myself a bushing and it runs great now.
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autozone where we go is pretty good. it's 100 mi round trip but, yeh, swap out is option #1. or get $ back and use toward a better quality unit. the starter before this ( from po) was the same kind... i like the db site. better prices than rock auto, which I was searching.
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Senior User
Joined: Mar 2013
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From: Agassiz, BC Canada
I haven't had very much luck with Napa starters, re man or new. I changed several in couple of years on the wife's 4 runner. Just my personal experience.
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OK, now...are there or are there not 2 different starters? one for manual ( ring gear facing crank) and one for auto ( flex plate facing trans)? I have read that the spacing is different which determines the reach of the starter teeth to gear teeth. so are some of us burning starters, blaming the product and not realizing the wrong unit for our particular truck is the case? what is also confusing is that these "wrong?" or " faulty?" units seem to hold up for a while, instead of self destructing immediately or refusing to engage. :/?
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I found the link for the article on different starters....www.bcbroncos.com/ford%20starters.pdf....
maybe because it was on a bronco forum, that is misleading. the info seemed general, tho, re ford. also, would there be a dif on a diesel? and as the article stated, the amount of teeth on the flywheel...ring gear, flex plate...see what I mean?
maybe because it was on a bronco forum, that is misleading. the info seemed general, tho, re ford. also, would there be a dif on a diesel? and as the article stated, the amount of teeth on the flywheel...ring gear, flex plate...see what I mean?
Hotshot
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 18,488
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From: The Big, Oregon
Yes, Ford's gas engines use a different starter for auto vs manual. The auto one reaches about 3/8" further in, and will grind constantly on a manual trans app if you can get it installed at all.
The diesels only have one starter for manual or auto.
Your starter likely needs to be greased. The pinion gear slides out on the shat you can see in the nose cone, put some good quality moly-graphite grease there. If you feel like doing some disassembly work, then put the same kind of grease on the pivot for the bendix arm. If that's riveted together, then spray some chain and cable lube in there. Disconnect the motor side of the solenoid, and activate the plunger a few times to work the lube in, and see if it's still sticking.
The diesels only have one starter for manual or auto.
Your starter likely needs to be greased. The pinion gear slides out on the shat you can see in the nose cone, put some good quality moly-graphite grease there. If you feel like doing some disassembly work, then put the same kind of grease on the pivot for the bendix arm. If that's riveted together, then spray some chain and cable lube in there. Disconnect the motor side of the solenoid, and activate the plunger a few times to work the lube in, and see if it's still sticking.
Postmaster
Joined: Dec 2011
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Your starter likely needs to be greased. The pinion gear slides out on the shat you can see in the nose cone, put some good quality moly-graphite grease there. If you feel like doing some disassembly work, then put the same kind of grease on the pivot for the bendix arm. If that's riveted together, then spray some chain and cable lube in there. Disconnect the motor side of the solenoid, and activate the plunger a few times to work the lube in, and see if it's still sticking.
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ohhhhhhhh. NOW I get it. thank you. that makes sense. ford is ford, but DIESEL is a whole different critter when you get down to it. I can also believe dryness or something causing intermittent problems. we live in a dry, sandy, extreme temperature changeable area. the dust and CRAP that gets into everything prob doesn't help. I will try your idea, ford six. and also really better check the teeth on ring gear. I did see a couple dings in one spot. of course, by the time I take this starter out and go digging around in it, I might as well just take my warranty to autozone and come back with a brand clean replacement. options are good....
Last edited by maxride; Sep 18, 2014 at 07:58 AM. Reason: wrong name
Hotshot
Joined: Oct 2002
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From: The Big, Oregon
I have fixed a no-crank issue with two different starters by removing the end cap from the starter motor, thoroughly cleaning the contact points at the brush plate and cap, then reassembling with allen head screws so they can be torqued tighter. The starter grounds through the end cap by the brush plate's contact, if there is any corrosion between the cap and plate it will not start.