problems with timing gear and chain install
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Laughing Gas
Joined: Oct 2013
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From: Manitoba, Canada
problems with timing gear and chain install
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1968 F100 360. So last spring I replaced my timing gear and chain. When I ordered the new parts I didn't realize there were single and double sets. I bought single and the old ones were double. The install seemed to go well. The single sprockets are the same thickness as the old doubles in the center. I noticed after I started the engine I could hear a rattly clacky noise when revving. I put the original fuel pump back on ( I had put new fuel and water pumps on) and the noise remained. My mechanics stethoscope was loudest on the upper part of the timing cover. Today I pulled the cover (see pic). I can see where the fuel pump eccentric has been rubbing a bit and a slight rub up higher. I'm assuming this might be the culprit but I'm not sure why it's running out too far and rubbing? Also another thing I'm confused about is the lining pin that goes into the cam and lines up the upper gear and fuel pump eccentric. The pin will push in so far that it doesn't stick out of the top gear. Of course I can just not push it in all the way but is this normal? It's exactly 1 1/2" in length.
1968 F100 360. So last spring I replaced my timing gear and chain. When I ordered the new parts I didn't realize there were single and double sets. I bought single and the old ones were double. The install seemed to go well. The single sprockets are the same thickness as the old doubles in the center. I noticed after I started the engine I could hear a rattly clacky noise when revving. I put the original fuel pump back on ( I had put new fuel and water pumps on) and the noise remained. My mechanics stethoscope was loudest on the upper part of the timing cover. Today I pulled the cover (see pic). I can see where the fuel pump eccentric has been rubbing a bit and a slight rub up higher. I'm assuming this might be the culprit but I'm not sure why it's running out too far and rubbing? Also another thing I'm confused about is the lining pin that goes into the cam and lines up the upper gear and fuel pump eccentric. The pin will push in so far that it doesn't stick out of the top gear. Of course I can just not push it in all the way but is this normal? It's exactly 1 1/2" in length.
Hotshot
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 14,255
Likes: 199
From: Phoenix, Az.
Sometimes when replacing the timing gears and chain kit it will also come with (or require you to purchase separate) a different cam retaining thrust plate. This is bacause the back of the cam's timing gear is not the same as factory Ford. So the replacement thrust plate would be thicker or shallower. Did your kit come with this plate? Did the catalog or instructions mention replacing it?
And on the pin, Those are a friction fit. Did your timing chain kit come with the pin you are trying to use? Or have you replaced the cam?
And on the pin, Those are a friction fit. Did your timing chain kit come with the pin you are trying to use? Or have you replaced the cam?
Thread Starter
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Laughing Gas
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 947
Likes: 6
From: Manitoba, Canada
.
It's the original thrust washer and original cam and pin. No extra parts or instructions came with the timing kit. The pin has no noticeable wiggle but slides in pretty easy and will slide in deep enough that it doesn't stick out at all in order to catch the eccentric cup. So a new pin would stay in place after tapping it into the new gear? Or could I use locktite retainer on the old one? Before I removed the eccentric, etc I put a straight edge on it to measure how far it comes out. If the newest parts stick out the same I need a thinner thrust washer? Maybe I could grind a smidgen off the cover. It's only barely rubbing on the two raised lines in the casting.
Tuned
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 340
Likes: 8
From: Rock Hill, SC
murrandsue's Recent Uploads | Photobucket
So last spring I replaced my timing gear and chain. When I ordered the new parts I didn't realize there were single and double sets. I bought single and the old ones were double. The install seemed to go well. The single sprockets are the same thickness as the old doubles in the center. I noticed after I started the engine I could hear a rattly clacky noise when revving. I put the original fuel pump back on and the noise remained. My mechanics stethoscope was loudest on the upper part of the timing cover. Today I pulled the cover (see pic). I can see where the fuel pump eccentric has been rubbing a bit and a slight rub up higher. I'm assuming this might be the culprit but I'm not sure why it's running out too far and rubbing? Also another thing I'm confused about is the lining pin that goes into the cam and lines up the upper gear and fuel pump eccentric. The pin will push in so far that it doesn't stick out of the top gear. Of course I can just not push it in all the way but is this normal? It's exactly 1 1/2" in length.
So last spring I replaced my timing gear and chain. When I ordered the new parts I didn't realize there were single and double sets. I bought single and the old ones were double. The install seemed to go well. The single sprockets are the same thickness as the old doubles in the center. I noticed after I started the engine I could hear a rattly clacky noise when revving. I put the original fuel pump back on and the noise remained. My mechanics stethoscope was loudest on the upper part of the timing cover. Today I pulled the cover (see pic). I can see where the fuel pump eccentric has been rubbing a bit and a slight rub up higher. I'm assuming this might be the culprit but I'm not sure why it's running out too far and rubbing? Also another thing I'm confused about is the lining pin that goes into the cam and lines up the upper gear and fuel pump eccentric. The pin will push in so far that it doesn't stick out of the top gear. Of course I can just not push it in all the way but is this normal? It's exactly 1 1/2" in length.
Lead Driver
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 7,592
Likes: 10
From: **** hole San Jose ca.
It's the original thrust washer and original cam and pin. No extra parts or instructions came with the timing kit. The pin has no noticeable wiggle but slides in pretty easy and will slide in deep enough that it doesn't stick out at all in order to catch the eccentric cup. So a new pin would stay in place after tapping it into the new gear? Or could I use locktite retainer on the old one? Before I removed the eccentric, etc I put a straight edge on it to measure how far it comes out. If the newest parts stick out the same I need a thinner thrust washer? Maybe I could grind a smidgen off the cover. It's only barely rubbing on the two raised lines in the casting.
2nd Time was when a friend forgot to install the Cam Thrust Plate that holds the Cam in this behind the cam gear mounts with two screws.
was cam plate installed?
Loose cam pin just tag the sprocket with a punch, once it's in the end bolt is tighten the washer just covers the tip to keep it in so it not going to turn.
orich
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Laughing Gas
Joined: Oct 2013
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From: Manitoba, Canada
I've only seen this two times happen, Once I missed place the old style cam retainer spring & rubbing button the was on the early 60's blocks to keep the cam from drifting forward and rubbing the timing cover.
2nd Time was when a friend forgot to install the Cam Thrust Plate that holds the Camgear in this behind the cam mounts with two screws.
was cam plate installed?
Loose cam pin just tag the sprocket with a punch, once it's in the end bolt is tighten the washer just covers the tip to keep it in so it not going to turn.
orich
2nd Time was when a friend forgot to install the Cam Thrust Plate that holds the Camgear in this behind the cam mounts with two screws.
was cam plate installed?
Loose cam pin just tag the sprocket with a punch, once it's in the end bolt is tighten the washer just covers the tip to keep it in so it not going to turn.
orich
No I never had the cam plate off. I'll use a punch to snug up the pin. I've done that on bearing surfaces before.
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Laughing Gas
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From: Manitoba, Canada
I used gaskets. I guess no gaskets would make the cover sit closer.
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Laughing Gas
Joined: Oct 2013
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From: Manitoba, Canada
Well before I removed the cheap set of timing gears I put a straight edge across the eccentric to measure to the block face. After the new better quality set (Jegs 0555-20453) was on I re-measured and now have about 1/8" more clearance so there will be no more rubbing on the cover. I'm sure if I just let it rub it would have eventually clearanced itself but at least I figured it out and I used better quality parts in the end.
Lead Driver
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 7,592
Likes: 10
From: **** hole San Jose ca.
Ha And that was 40 yrs+ ago.
has not changed much!Orich
Ford Parts Specialist
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 88,826
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From: Simi Valley, CA
A spacer (6265 in parts catalog pic) was required with the factory installed nylon timing gear. This gear was not available at the parts counter, only installed on new vehicles.
The FoMoCo 'service part replacement' aluminum timing gear had the spacer made as part of it. So the separate 6265 spacer was removed and tossed away.
I would assume that the aftermarket replacement timing gears also have the spacer made as part of them.
Right pic: C8AZ-6256-A .. Aluminum Timing Gear = Notice what is says inre to 6265 spacer.
The FoMoCo 'service part replacement' aluminum timing gear had the spacer made as part of it. So the separate 6265 spacer was removed and tossed away.
I would assume that the aftermarket replacement timing gears also have the spacer made as part of them.
Right pic: C8AZ-6256-A .. Aluminum Timing Gear = Notice what is says inre to 6265 spacer.
Hotshot
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 14,255
Likes: 199
From: Phoenix, Az.
No. Prolly not that Uni. If the gears lined up and the chain went on you're OK.
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