2003 excursion trans problem please help!
Post Fiend
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 11,798
Likes: 14
From: Mt. Shasta California
That's a good idea, but it won't help solve this problem.
The temperature is getting too high in the torque converter, not in the transmission. How will you measure that? Measuring the transmission temperature won't show anything useful.
Backing a load in soft sand will get the torque converter very hot very fast. And you may not have noticed that I said it will also heat up going forward at low speed. But at least there is some airflow, in reverse you need a headwind that is going faster than you're backing to get much air over the cooler. And yes, I know about the engine fan. At low engine speeds it isn't doing much at all. As the trans gets hot it doesn't engage the fan clutch until the engine gets hot. And that's usually too late for the transmission.
The temperature is getting too high in the torque converter, not in the transmission. How will you measure that? Measuring the transmission temperature won't show anything useful.
Backing a load in soft sand will get the torque converter very hot very fast. And you may not have noticed that I said it will also heat up going forward at low speed. But at least there is some airflow, in reverse you need a headwind that is going faster than you're backing to get much air over the cooler. And yes, I know about the engine fan. At low engine speeds it isn't doing much at all. As the trans gets hot it doesn't engage the fan clutch until the engine gets hot. And that's usually too late for the transmission.
Putting it another way; It took many miles to get the trans up to operating temp so backing up for less that a minute won't cause ANY additional heat..............(Not in the sand now.)
Cargo Master
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 2,097
Likes: 5
From: chicago northwest suburbs
If there is heat build up in the TQ then that hot fluid will be coming out and going past the trans temp sensor. so yes you will see it getting hot. and yes it will show an issue. maybe ha has a plugged cooler or a dirty filter (screen) in the trans. either way we need to know exactly what the temp is. both driving down the road and backing up in the sand.
Post Fiend
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 11,798
Likes: 14
From: Mt. Shasta California
If there is heat build up in the TQ then that hot fluid will be coming out and going past the trans temp sensor. so yes you will see it getting hot. and yes it will show an issue. maybe ha has a plugged cooler or a dirty filter (screen) in the trans. either way we need to know exactly what the temp is. both driving down the road and backing up in the sand.
Laughing Gas
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 880
Likes: 13
From: Northcentral Wisconsin
So the viton seal may stop a leak at the torque converter, but the OP said he's losing fluid out of the vent tube. Any suggestions on what may cause that? I guess I would change the filter and fluid, using a synthetic ATF because it handles heat better. I would install the viton seal also, and maybe a larger cooler. If you're in the sand a lot, maybe an electric fan for the tranny cooler. If you've gone a long way thru the sand, maybe have a beer before you back into your spot so the tranny can cool a bit.
Post Fiend
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 11,798
Likes: 14
From: Mt. Shasta California
So the viton seal may stop a leak at the torque converter, but the OP said he's losing fluid out of the vent tube. Any suggestions on what may cause that? I guess I would change the filter and fluid, using a synthetic ATF because it handles heat better. I would install the viton seal also, and maybe a larger cooler. If you're in the sand a lot, maybe an electric fan for the tranny cooler. If you've gone a long way thru the sand, maybe have a beer before you back into your spot so the tranny can cool a bit.
Frmr Ford Trans Engr
Joined: Aug 1999
Posts: 24,731
Likes: 2,658
From: SE Florida
If there is heat build up in the TQ then that hot fluid will be coming out and going past the trans temp sensor. so yes you will see it getting hot. and yes it will show an issue. maybe ha has a plugged cooler or a dirty filter (screen) in the trans. either way we need to know exactly what the temp is. both driving down the road and backing up in the sand.
The hot fluid from the torque converter first goes to the coolers, not past the temperature sensor. And when operating at very load speeds with a large load the torque converter creates heat A LOT faster than can be carried away. I have seen the converter get hot enough to melt the seal and the trans wasn't up to 200F yet.
I've said all I'm going to on this subject. I'll leave it to all of you to believe who you want to believe. One of us actually knows how this works and the others just don't understand the system, but are willing to offer their incorrect views of how they want to believe this works.
Cargo Master
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,450
Likes: 13
From: Forest lake minnesota
Not true according to the testing I did when I was at Ford. You just are plain wrong.
Another wrong.
The hot fluid from the torque converter first goes to the coolers, not past the temperature sensor. And when operating at very load speeds with a large load the torque converter creates heat A LOT faster than can be carried away. I have seen the converter get hot enough to melt the seal and the trans wasn't up to 200F yet.
I've said all I'm going to on this subject. I'll leave it to all of you to believe who you want to believe. One of us actually knows how this works and the others just don't understand the system, but are willing to offer their incorrect views of how they want to believe this works.
Another wrong.
The hot fluid from the torque converter first goes to the coolers, not past the temperature sensor. And when operating at very load speeds with a large load the torque converter creates heat A LOT faster than can be carried away. I have seen the converter get hot enough to melt the seal and the trans wasn't up to 200F yet.
I've said all I'm going to on this subject. I'll leave it to all of you to believe who you want to believe. One of us actually knows how this works and the others just don't understand the system, but are willing to offer their incorrect views of how they want to believe this works.
Lead Driver
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 9,266
Likes: 149
From: In the field...
^^^^ Thanks, Chris, new sig line ^^^^. 
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Post Fiend
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 11,798
Likes: 14
From: Mt. Shasta California
[Not true according to the testing I did when I was at Ford. You just are plain wrong.
[/B]
Another wrong.
The hot fluid from the torque converter first goes to the coolers, not past the temperature sensor. And when operating at very load speeds with a large load the torque converter creates heat A LOT faster than can be carried away. I have seen the converter get hot enough to melt the seal and the trans wasn't up to 200F yet.
I've said all I'm going to on this subject. I'll leave it to all of you to believe who you want to believe. One of us actually knows how this works and the others just don't understand the system, but are willing to offer their incorrect views of how they want to believe this works.
[/B]
Another wrong.
The hot fluid from the torque converter first goes to the coolers, not past the temperature sensor. And when operating at very load speeds with a large load the torque converter creates heat A LOT faster than can be carried away. I have seen the converter get hot enough to melt the seal and the trans wasn't up to 200F yet.
I've said all I'm going to on this subject. I'll leave it to all of you to believe who you want to believe. One of us actually knows how this works and the others just don't understand the system, but are willing to offer their incorrect views of how they want to believe this works.
Super Moderator
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 29,380
Likes: 118
From: Central Coast of CA
Brent, are you really trying to include Mark in that 90%? 
It's amazing you can ignore us when we ask you to back up your claims...like when you claim something is simple physics but refuse to post said physics as proof to back up your claim...then you have the gumption to insist that Mark post proof of his information?
To quote some of the more intelligent guys here..."Wow...just wow"
Stewart
It's amazing you can ignore us when we ask you to back up your claims...like when you claim something is simple physics but refuse to post said physics as proof to back up your claim...then you have the gumption to insist that Mark post proof of his information?
To quote some of the more intelligent guys here..."Wow...just wow"
Stewart
Last edited by Stewart_H; Jul 21, 2014 at 11:46 AM.
Lead Driver
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 5,139
Likes: 209
What? Are you saying I'm sooooooo stupid I can't compose my own thoughts?!
Really, is that what you're saying? Cuz I thought a single "Wow" + ellipses was enough. This one CAN'T get locked.Theres far too much potential. LOL
Really, is that what you're saying? Cuz I thought a single "Wow" + ellipses was enough. This one CAN'T get locked.Theres far too much potential. LOL