Head Bolt/Stud Tech thread...
New User
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 12
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Should i assume you have a turbo? In that case check for wear on the block / heads from the fire rings in the gaskets. If its severe it will lead to more gasket problems. Studs from R&D IDI Performance - Home
Regarding head bolts eBay is good place to buy?
I'm checking out r&d.
Thanks for quick feed back!
New User
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 12
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One of the guys was recommending something called Bars and a ceramic sealer to fix coolant leaks.
Does anyone have experience with this stuff?
Thank you
Lead Driver
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 6,938
Likes: 12
If you dont plan to turbo. Headbolts are good enough. When you mentioned the ARPs i just assumed you had a turbo and were going to stud it.
I would pull the engine if it were me, but people argue back on forth to do it in or out of the vehicle. FYI if you dont want studs, it a royal PITA if not impossible to put the studs in, in the vehicle.
I would pull the engine if it were me, but people argue back on forth to do it in or out of the vehicle. FYI if you dont want studs, it a royal PITA if not impossible to put the studs in, in the vehicle.
Postmaster
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 3,860
Likes: 7
No.
No.
NOOOOOOOOO.
Really, NO.
Seriously, if you have coolant leaks, fix them right.
For radiator leaks, epoxy/JB weld is a perfectly good solution.
Bars leaks is NOT.
I used some of that **** one time. It's been three years, the engine getting totally rebuilt, a couple of flushes and I'm /STILL/ finding that brownish gunk in things.
Worst part is that it will stick to your radiator cap and keep it from sealing, so you'll end up losing all your radiator pressure. I've replaced my cap twice due to embedded crap in the rubber gasket keeping my system from building up any pressure.
New User
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 12
Likes: 0
Don't want to hijack
No.
No.
No.
NOOOOOOOOO.
Really, NO.
Seriously, if you have coolant leaks, fix them right.
For radiator leaks, epoxy/JB weld is a perfectly good solution.
Bars leaks is NOT.
I used some of that **** one time. It's been three years, the engine getting totally rebuilt, a couple of flushes and I'm /STILL/ finding that brownish gunk in things.
Worst part is that it will stick to your radiator cap and keep it from sealing, so you'll end up losing all your radiator pressure. I've replaced my cap twice due to embedded crap in the rubber gasket keeping my system from building up any pressure.
No.
No.
NOOOOOOOOO.
Really, NO.
Seriously, if you have coolant leaks, fix them right.
For radiator leaks, epoxy/JB weld is a perfectly good solution.
Bars leaks is NOT.
I used some of that **** one time. It's been three years, the engine getting totally rebuilt, a couple of flushes and I'm /STILL/ finding that brownish gunk in things.
Worst part is that it will stick to your radiator cap and keep it from sealing, so you'll end up losing all your radiator pressure. I've replaced my cap twice due to embedded crap in the rubber gasket keeping my system from building up any pressure.
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...l#post15929270
Thanks
Tuned
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 435
Likes: 6
From: Kitimat British columbia
No.
No.
No.
NOOOOOOOOO.
Really, NO.
Seriously, if you have coolant leaks, fix them right.
For radiator leaks, epoxy/JB weld is a perfectly good solution.
Bars leaks is NOT.
I used some of that **** one time. It's been three years, the engine getting totally rebuilt, a couple of flushes and I'm /STILL/ finding that brownish gunk in things.
Worst part is that it will stick to your radiator cap and keep it from sealing, so you'll end up losing all your radiator pressure. I've replaced my cap twice due to embedded crap in the rubber gasket keeping my system from building up any pressure.
No.
No.
NOOOOOOOOO.
Really, NO.
Seriously, if you have coolant leaks, fix them right.
For radiator leaks, epoxy/JB weld is a perfectly good solution.
Bars leaks is NOT.
I used some of that **** one time. It's been three years, the engine getting totally rebuilt, a couple of flushes and I'm /STILL/ finding that brownish gunk in things.
Worst part is that it will stick to your radiator cap and keep it from sealing, so you'll end up losing all your radiator pressure. I've replaced my cap twice due to embedded crap in the rubber gasket keeping my system from building up any pressure.
.
Senior User
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 213
Likes: 0
From: Foothills of cascades
Just stumbled upon this. Thanks for finally giving is real data on putting larger threads into a 6.9 block. It really is interesting to see all of the old ways of thinking collapse with all of this new data.
In your calculations, it appears you are using the bolts minor diameter to determine clamping load. If this is the case, and if you are using the same P=T/KD calculation I am, a smaller bolt at the same torque will provide more clamping load (P). I guess I never actually sat down and thought that one through. Its interesting to see that we can get a 1/2-13 head bolt into a 6.9 block. Although the same calculation shows that with a larger stud, a higher torque rating will be required on a 1/2" stud to overcome the larger diameter than the 7/16" stud?
So the question I'm wondering, is if you can't drill/tap a 6.9 block all the way for a 7.3 stud, can they still be used as long as its tapped to the correct length? Wonder how much a set of 9/16" studs would run. I suppose the heads would need to be machined to accept the difference?
In your calculations, it appears you are using the bolts minor diameter to determine clamping load. If this is the case, and if you are using the same P=T/KD calculation I am, a smaller bolt at the same torque will provide more clamping load (P). I guess I never actually sat down and thought that one through. Its interesting to see that we can get a 1/2-13 head bolt into a 6.9 block. Although the same calculation shows that with a larger stud, a higher torque rating will be required on a 1/2" stud to overcome the larger diameter than the 7/16" stud?
So the question I'm wondering, is if you can't drill/tap a 6.9 block all the way for a 7.3 stud, can they still be used as long as its tapped to the correct length? Wonder how much a set of 9/16" studs would run. I suppose the heads would need to be machined to accept the difference?
Postmaster
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 2,554
Likes: 6
From: Northern Arizona
Justin tried this the DIY way and it didn't work out... read about it in his build thread starting on pg. 138 post 2067:
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...build-138.html
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...build-138.html
Well, Im finally throwing in the towel on the 6.9.
I got one side of the block drilled and tapped, and that all went well. A couple of studs weren't 100% perpendicular to the surface, but not enough to see with your eyes, just enough to interfere with putting the head over them. It wasnt enough to interfere with putting the studs in
after the head was on, just before. That would have been fine with me, but when I was running the bottoming tap through all the holes to finish them, I mildly cross-threaded one because the tap was hanging a bit on the counterbore. It would probably work, I haven't put any torque on it yet, but sometimes you just gotta let reality slap you in the face. Ive been trying to salvage this 6.9 since I blew the gasket, and we all know I have more than your average IDI'r into the bottom end, but I think its time to cut my losses and build my IDIT. I literally have $1000 into the 9/16" studs and tooling to try and make them work...If I was to sell these studs, they would be around $600, Your probably going to be at least another $400 into machine work just to make the studs work... At the end of the day, You can sleeve down a 7.3 for that much money.
Now I don't want people to get that it is impossible out of this. I think it can be done, I will keep my studs, and maybe someday I will continue this with a 6.9 block, but as far as I am concerned, the Juice isn't worth the squeeze.
I got one side of the block drilled and tapped, and that all went well. A couple of studs weren't 100% perpendicular to the surface, but not enough to see with your eyes, just enough to interfere with putting the head over them. It wasnt enough to interfere with putting the studs in
after the head was on, just before. That would have been fine with me, but when I was running the bottoming tap through all the holes to finish them, I mildly cross-threaded one because the tap was hanging a bit on the counterbore. It would probably work, I haven't put any torque on it yet, but sometimes you just gotta let reality slap you in the face. Ive been trying to salvage this 6.9 since I blew the gasket, and we all know I have more than your average IDI'r into the bottom end, but I think its time to cut my losses and build my IDIT. I literally have $1000 into the 9/16" studs and tooling to try and make them work...If I was to sell these studs, they would be around $600, Your probably going to be at least another $400 into machine work just to make the studs work... At the end of the day, You can sleeve down a 7.3 for that much money.
Now I don't want people to get that it is impossible out of this. I think it can be done, I will keep my studs, and maybe someday I will continue this with a 6.9 block, but as far as I am concerned, the Juice isn't worth the squeeze.
Tuned
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 435
Likes: 6
From: Kitimat British columbia
I toyed around with it too, I have half a 7.3 block done so far being to busy with other things, everything looks straight as far as I can tell anyways. But I was going to bolt it done and not do studs, the bolts I was looking at it was about 150-200 for a complete set. And if I remember right he had to helicoil the 6.9 block otherwise it would crack. The 7.3 idi non turbo block I did seemed to hold up and not crack and I torqued to 190 ft lbs.
Postmaster
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 3,860
Likes: 7
When I get a chance, I'm going to look into upsizing a block to like 9/16 or 5/8, and just use (cheap) grade 8 bolts. I'm thinking I can probably modify a drillbit to follow the existing hole fairly well, and if I can use a guide plate to start the drill and tap, I shouldn't have too much trouble keeping things straight.
I've got a siezed 6.9 block with a large crack in the side which probably isn't good for much other than such tests, so...
I've got a siezed 6.9 block with a large crack in the side which probably isn't good for much other than such tests, so...
Senior User
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 188
Likes: 0
When I get a chance, I'm going to look into upsizing a block to like 9/16 or 5/8, and just use (cheap) grade 8 bolts. I'm thinking I can probably modify a drillbit to follow the existing hole fairly well, and if I can use a guide plate to start the drill and tap, I shouldn't have too much trouble keeping things straight.
I've got a siezed 6.9 block with a large crack in the side which probably isn't good for much other than such tests, so...
I've got a siezed 6.9 block with a large crack in the side which probably isn't good for much other than such tests, so...
Postmaster
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 3,860
Likes: 7
I didn't know this.
Just checked and yes, cap screws per ASTM A574 are 180K tensile, which is above grade 8 by a bit. That's a good way of going, then...
Just checked and yes, cap screws per ASTM A574 are 180K tensile, which is above grade 8 by a bit. That's a good way of going, then...
Posting Guru
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 2,036
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They make grade 12 bolts as well, idk if you could find the specific size you need. But it's food for thought...
