84 Bronco Electrical Issues
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84 Bronco Electrical Issues
Well it all started the day before yesterday. I recently bought an 84 Bronco XLT 302 w/ 4 spd that ran great. All the interior gauges worked flawlessly. The cd player a previous owner installed was an eye sore and it lost its memory every time you shut the truck off, so I decided that would be an easy fix. the red, yellow and orange wire were all going to the same power point so I fix that by running the new wire to a constant power and for some reason I chose the forward most post on the starter solenoid. Well after I did that I got back in the truck and it worked but I noticed something funny with the Tachometer, it was moving all over the place and when I turned the lights on it would go all the way over past 6000. I thought ok maybe a wire came loose while I was messing around under the dash or something and I would get to it tomorrow.
Well the next morning I go out and find that the bronco has absolutely no electrical power. after several hours of investigating I find that if I run a wire from the positive side of the battery to the top post on the alternator (which only has 2 wires coming off it) I have my power back. Only problem is the tachometer acts fine until I turn the lights on then it goes crazy and again flips over and maxes out. I also noticed my ammeter is no longer working where before all this it had.
What could I have done? I made sure all wires were hooked up like before. I have gone over dozens of wire diagrams, all of which seem completely different then the set up in this Bronco. Sorry for the long post. I wanted to get as much detail as I could. Any suggestions?
update: Just found out that when I do run that jumper wire and it allows me to have power to the truck, even using the power windows or headlights make the cd player cut out and the tachometer go crazy.
Well the next morning I go out and find that the bronco has absolutely no electrical power. after several hours of investigating I find that if I run a wire from the positive side of the battery to the top post on the alternator (which only has 2 wires coming off it) I have my power back. Only problem is the tachometer acts fine until I turn the lights on then it goes crazy and again flips over and maxes out. I also noticed my ammeter is no longer working where before all this it had.
What could I have done? I made sure all wires were hooked up like before. I have gone over dozens of wire diagrams, all of which seem completely different then the set up in this Bronco. Sorry for the long post. I wanted to get as much detail as I could. Any suggestions?
update: Just found out that when I do run that jumper wire and it allows me to have power to the truck, even using the power windows or headlights make the cd player cut out and the tachometer go crazy.
Last edited by fordtrck302; Jan 12, 2014 at 12:05 PM. Reason: update to problem
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From: Gateway to the West
Ok, first off... when something goes haywire AFTER you change the wiring, the surest way to get things back to the way they were is to REVERSE what you changed in the first place. This eliminates the possibility that what you changed is what is causing the problem. You may have to deal with making the changes in some other manner if those that you made cause undesirable operation.
Terminating (connecting) any wiring from an electrical device in the truck directly to the start solenoid terminals is a dangerous move at the very least. EVERY device must have an OPD (overcurrent protection device) in the circuit... in other words, a fuse or circuit breaker sized according to the actual current draw for that device. Not only that, but wiring directly to any part of the non switched side of the electrical system will cause the exact problem you were confronted with the next day... The audio system (and anything else that might be tied in with the wiring you ran to the solenoid) was being fed power even with the truck off and it drained the battery overnight. Take the time to isolate the wiring in question and be certain there are no other electrical devices tied into these circuits as well. There is no telling what a PO may have done to the electrical system until you actually dig into it and see for yourself.
Given that you are dealing with an aftermarket audio system, it would be best to make sure you know what each of the wires coming from that device are supposed to do before attempting to terminate them into the truck's electrical system. Some audio systems do need one of the wires connected on the non-switched side of the system to maintain clock, radio station preset and audio balance settings while the truck is off. However, the power to the amplifier, tuner and internal lighting for the same system will have to be on the switched side of the electrical system.
(When I mention the "switched and "non-switched" sides of the system I am referring to the ignition switch. The circuits on the "switched" side are all those that receive power once the key is in the "accessory" or "ON" position. Everything else is the non-switched side).
Terminating (connecting) any wiring from an electrical device in the truck directly to the start solenoid terminals is a dangerous move at the very least. EVERY device must have an OPD (overcurrent protection device) in the circuit... in other words, a fuse or circuit breaker sized according to the actual current draw for that device. Not only that, but wiring directly to any part of the non switched side of the electrical system will cause the exact problem you were confronted with the next day... The audio system (and anything else that might be tied in with the wiring you ran to the solenoid) was being fed power even with the truck off and it drained the battery overnight. Take the time to isolate the wiring in question and be certain there are no other electrical devices tied into these circuits as well. There is no telling what a PO may have done to the electrical system until you actually dig into it and see for yourself.
Given that you are dealing with an aftermarket audio system, it would be best to make sure you know what each of the wires coming from that device are supposed to do before attempting to terminate them into the truck's electrical system. Some audio systems do need one of the wires connected on the non-switched side of the system to maintain clock, radio station preset and audio balance settings while the truck is off. However, the power to the amplifier, tuner and internal lighting for the same system will have to be on the switched side of the electrical system.
(When I mention the "switched and "non-switched" sides of the system I am referring to the ignition switch. The circuits on the "switched" side are all those that receive power once the key is in the "accessory" or "ON" position. Everything else is the non-switched side).
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Thank you for the reply. I have since ran the power wire for the CD player to the fuse that it is suppose to draw its power from. I have double checked and the CD player is connected as it should. I have tried to back trace the steps I made and have come up with no solution as to what happened.
This might be wrong but in order to restore power to the fuse box I had to run a wire from the Battery positive terminal to the BAT stud on the back of the alternator. This was the only thing I could do to get power back. I know for a fact there was no wire before so I am not sure why this would fix the problem. I think the original fault is still there I am just masking it with this current solution.
Now the truck runs great as it did before but I am completely dumbfounded as to what gremlin found my truck over the night to cause it to lose power like it did.
This might be wrong but in order to restore power to the fuse box I had to run a wire from the Battery positive terminal to the BAT stud on the back of the alternator. This was the only thing I could do to get power back. I know for a fact there was no wire before so I am not sure why this would fix the problem. I think the original fault is still there I am just masking it with this current solution.
Now the truck runs great as it did before but I am completely dumbfounded as to what gremlin found my truck over the night to cause it to lose power like it did.
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From: Gateway to the West
You are correct in believing that there should be a wire from the battery positive to the "BATT" terminal on the alternator. Putting it in, was definitely the right thing to do. If there has not been one there, you certainly have something odd going on. Without that wire, the alternator would not charge the battery and eventually the battery would die because the truck would be running on battery power only.
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I am very curious to know how the vehicle was running before without this wire going from the battery to the alternator. Is there a specific gauge wire I should use or install a fusible link or anything like that for this wire?
Before all of this started my Ammeter worked just fine but now it is stuck right in the middle and does nothing. I really appreciate your help and advice. Thank you,
Before all of this started my Ammeter worked just fine but now it is stuck right in the middle and does nothing. I really appreciate your help and advice. Thank you,
Lead Driver
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From: Gateway to the West
The ammeter shouldn't move much at all and "stuck in the middle" is a good thing because an ammeter, unlike a voltmeter, indicates whether there is a draw on the electrical system or there is an overcharging condition. Hence the reason for the letters "D" and "C" at either end of the gauge. The best condition is to have the needle sit just over on the "C" side of center while the truck is running and center when the truck is off and no other electrical devices are on. (If the truck isn't running and you leave the lights on, the ammeter should drop into the "D" side of the gauge as there is a draw on the system and no charge being supplied since the alternator is not running).
The vehicle will run with a good battery on just the battery. However, eventually, the battery will lose its charge and everything will stop if the alternator is not sending voltage BACK to it. The charge wire should be a minimum of 10 gauge wire with 8 being even better. There is no need for a fusible link in this case unless you want it there. Both the battery and the alternator put out voltage. The charge wire is the "balance beam" between the two. Electricity will flow through it either direction depending upon which device is drawing power. (With electricity its not "give and take" its "take because I need it"). A low battery or one that is being drawn upon by other devices in the system, will in turn draw power from the alternator as the charge in the cells drops. When the alternator stops, there is no more electricity being generated so the power from the battery will flow through the metal charge wire as far as the "BATT" terminal on the alternator. This isn't really a draw on the battery, just a continuous electrical link by virtue of the battery terminal-to-metal wire-to-alternator terminal.
The vehicle will run with a good battery on just the battery. However, eventually, the battery will lose its charge and everything will stop if the alternator is not sending voltage BACK to it. The charge wire should be a minimum of 10 gauge wire with 8 being even better. There is no need for a fusible link in this case unless you want it there. Both the battery and the alternator put out voltage. The charge wire is the "balance beam" between the two. Electricity will flow through it either direction depending upon which device is drawing power. (With electricity its not "give and take" its "take because I need it"). A low battery or one that is being drawn upon by other devices in the system, will in turn draw power from the alternator as the charge in the cells drops. When the alternator stops, there is no more electricity being generated so the power from the battery will flow through the metal charge wire as far as the "BATT" terminal on the alternator. This isn't really a draw on the battery, just a continuous electrical link by virtue of the battery terminal-to-metal wire-to-alternator terminal.
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The cd player a previous owner installed was an eye sore and it lost its memory every time you shut the truck off, so I decided that would be an easy fix. the red, yellow and orange wire were all going to the same power point so I fix that by running the new wire to a constant power and for some reason I chose the forward most post on the starter solenoid.
........This might be wrong but in order to restore power to the fuse box I had to run a wire from the Battery positive terminal to the BAT stud on the back of the alternator. This was the only thing I could do to get power back. I know for a fact there was no wire before so I am not sure why this would fix the problem. I think the original fault is still there I am just masking it with this current solution.....
A heavy-gauge wire ran from positive battery to one stud (the other stud has a wire down to the starter itself). Also on the battery-side starter relay stud were ring terminals with wires to fusible links, or the ends of the fusible links themselves had ring terminals on them. One or more fusible links distributed power from that point to fuse block, etc. Another fusible link connected at the relay stud came from the alternator output stud via wiring harness.
Since you attached your own wire to this relay stud to try to fix the CD player problem, you had to have loosened it up.
Did you put ALL the ring terminals back onto the proper stud? If you by mistake moved one or more over to the starter side stud, you will have problems!
Did you securely reconnect those ring terminals? Clean and shiny on the mating surfaces? They stack up, and need to be clean and tight. Don't catch part of a ring terminals wire-barrel part under the nut or another ring terminal, or else it won't be properly connected. Usually the ring terminals are splayed this way and that so the terminal wire-barrels don't touch first. Need good solid contact on the flat ring area.
Since adding a jumper wire from positive battery post to alternator output stud directly, allowed it to have power again, I theorize that the connection from alternator to the power feed to fuse block is there, but that juncture point has somehow been separated from positive battery... thus your added battery to alternator wire connects them again.
Start with a good visual over by the starter relay.
Some Fords had enough power feeds that there wouldn't be enough stud length at the starter relay, too much stack-up, so they had a positive-wire pigtail coming out of the positive battery clamp. This pigtail also went to fusible links. If by chance you have one of these pigtails, make sure it is alright.
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I have made sure all ring terminals that were previously attached to the relay are free of corrosion and provide a good contact surface and re-attached in the same way they were before.
I currently have and since owning the truck have only had 3 wires comming from the positive side of the Starter Selenoid/Relay. They are the thick gauge wire from the Positive battery terminal, a red wire that leads into a 4 wire quick disconnect harness (this harness itself has a thick yellow wire, a thin yellow wire with maybe green stripe, a green wire with a dark stripe maybe black and then the red wire which connects to the relay.) and finally the third wire is being ran into the dash for a push button ignition.
I have read all about these fusible links and have only found two in this area and they both are split off the same wire. I believe the thick yellow wire leave the harness I previously mentioned.
I currently have and since owning the truck have only had 3 wires comming from the positive side of the Starter Selenoid/Relay. They are the thick gauge wire from the Positive battery terminal, a red wire that leads into a 4 wire quick disconnect harness (this harness itself has a thick yellow wire, a thin yellow wire with maybe green stripe, a green wire with a dark stripe maybe black and then the red wire which connects to the relay.) and finally the third wire is being ran into the dash for a push button ignition.
I have read all about these fusible links and have only found two in this area and they both are split off the same wire. I believe the thick yellow wire leave the harness I previously mentioned.
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STARTER RELAY
ALTERNATOR WIRES
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Last edited by fordtrck302; Jan 14, 2014 at 10:15 AM. Reason: Add pics
Thread Starter
|
Senior User
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 368
Likes: 1
From: Texas
I want to thank you guys for your help. I have owned several older Fords but I have never had electrical issues with them so this is new to me
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