Ok so I just bought my truck, 2002 F250 with the 7.3L Powerstroke diesel with just over 270,000 miles on it, about a month ago. All current mods are in my sig, not too much done to it. It was great for the first couple weeks, and then for the past 2 weeks I've been having some issues though. This is my first truck and diesel. I know some things, but not basic stuff like maintenance and some basic troubleshooting, so bare with me. I know more about aftermarket/upgrade parts and stuff like that, haha, sort of backwards I know.

Anyways, its been having some issues starting when cold lately. It started great every morning for the first week, week and a half. And it was cold, but not really cold, probably 30's and 40's maybe dropping down into the 20's at night, but it still started fine. Then one day I sat in the truck with the key on for about 10 minutes or so, doing a few things in the truck, and listening to music. I've done it before in my Moms car and my Dads truck and other vehicles with no issues, so I didn't think anything of it. Then later that day, I was went to start it up to go out to dinner with a few buddies, and it wouldn't start. It really sucked, because it was the first time I showed them all the truck and it wouldn't start, lol. :-missing: So we ended up having to jump it. Shut it off and started again, a few times that night and it started fine every time. The next day it was dead again in the morning, and we had to jump it again.

So I don't know if I killed the batteries with leaving the key on for 10 minutes or so or what? When I went to crank it, it would just die and not turn over, like the batteries were dead, not like bad glow plugs. I cranked it a few more times, and every time it got more and more dead, eventually not cranking at all. It eventually got to the point of all the gauges flashing up, like it was completely dead and reset or something. I'm guessing its the batteries. It is a used truck, and I have no idea how old the batteries are, they look pretty old. I had my uncle test them, and I think they were a bit low on volts with the key on, and then would drop down to I think it was 7 or 8 when I cranked it. But it was fine at idle, and starts fine every time after driving it, so it seems like the alternator is working and doing its job.

It hasn't really started right, when cold at least, since then, and has only gotten worse. We put a battery charger on it too, and it didn't seem to help much. The past two weeks I had been on Christmas break, from school so I didn't drive it too much. Now this week when I need it, it won't start, so I can't take it to school. So for most of the past two weeks, the only way that I could get it to start, in the morning was to have the block heater plugged in. Once I did that it started great every time, which makes sense because it probably takes stress off of the batteries. And I drove it every time after starting it to try and sort of charge up the batteries.

Then this past weekend and Monday and Tuesday it got worse. It was really cold Sunday night and Monday through Wednesday morning. It was single digits and below zero. I had school off Monday and Tuesday because of the severe cold weather. It was very rough and barely started every time we tried. I started it on Sunday before it got really cold, and it took 4 cranks to start it, and that was with the block heater being plugged in all night. I didn't start it at all on Monday. Then Tuesday (the coldest day) me and my Dad tried to start it, and it took a good 20 minutes of almost constant cranking to start it. This was later in the day, with the block heater being plugged in from early morning on and the battery charger on it. I know it was really cold, but I would think with all that on it, that it should pretty much start right up. And the whole time, it was just pouring a whiteish gray smoke, and a lot of it. Its never done that before, it was pretty bad and didn't smell good either. Eventually it did start, and once it starts it runs and drives fine.

It did the same thing yesterday too, but almost worse. I think it was plugged in all night, and my Dad eventually put the battery charger on it too. We couldn't get it to start in the morning so I couldn't take it to school. I guess it ended up taking my Dad about 6 hours to start it. He would go out and try to start it for a while and then go back inside, and I guess kept doing that until it started. This was with the block heater plugged in and the battery charger going off and on. Once he finally got it started, he took it to his work and had his mechanic look at it. He ended up putting a new glow plug relay on it. I guess it helped a little, but I don't think it fully solved the issue. I think it dropped into the single digits last night, but my Dad waited a little this morning, and by the time he started it, it was probably high teens or low 20s out. I guess he went out twice to start it and the second time it started. This was with no block heater or battery charger on it. So I think it helped but might not have fully fixed the problem.

So what do you guys think happened to cause all of this? Why do you guys think the batteries and glow plug relay suddenly went bad? Do you guys think I need new batteries and if so what is the best brand? Do you also think it could be glow plugs to? And what caused it to have that really long, rough and smoky cold starts? It just didn't make much sense to me because it started great before, and then it just wouldn't start. That's why I didn't think it was the glow plugs either, because it started fine at first. Just didn't make sense. What do you guys think?

Wow, sorry for the book guys. Just wanted to make sure you guys new everything that happened, and understood everything. It just seemed weird to me because it started fine at first and then almost like overnight it wouldn't start. Thanks for any help! Again sorry for the long post.

 

Sounds like your batteries are getting weak. It also sounds like your heater isn't working maybe because the GFI or breaker that it's plugged into is thrown or the extension cord is bad. Or like my truck the plug on the cord to the block heater took a crap. Your truck should start pretty easy being plugged in unless your GP relay is shot. If your GP's are original, which there is no way to know they would need replacing also. The white smoke is normal for really cold start ups with out the block heater, with the heater you will have some but it won't last very long. If your batteries are going bad they won't be able to handle the GP's and the cranking for starting the truck. I just put two new Motorcrafts in mine, the old one's were just over 3 years old. Motorcraft has a pretty good warranty 3 years replacement and prorated to..I can't remember how many months, anyway I got $60 back for each battery.

 

Hey Jon,

It sounds like batteries to me.....could be more but the batteries are the place to start troubleshooting anyway. If you see the gauges acting like windshield wipers then you have a bad battery or two. Usually it is one bad battery that pulls the other one down, and when it happens it usually gives you not much warning.

To start off with I would have the batteries tested at autozone or someplace like that, along with the alternator. Since your in school, the cheapest place I can think of to buy batteries is Walmart. Plus they give you a two or three year replacement warranty on it.

When the cold temps come it really can make a weak battery go down quickly. If you get lucky you might find that only one battery is bad. You can simply disconnect that one and start the truck on one battery. I've done this a couple of times when one battery was so bad it pulled the second one down with it. Then when I disconnected the bad battery she fired right up with the one. This will buy you the time to drive to Walmart & get a replacement. Most would recommend replacing both at the same time but if money is tight you'll be fine for a while.

Like Jason said, with weak batteries - the glow plugs & the starting will max her out easily. Plus the 7.3L needs at least 10.5 volts to fire the injectors if I remember correctly. Keep in mind the glow plugs stay on longer than the wait to start light does in the dash. Plus if you leave her outside and are running 15W-40 oil she will start hard when the temps get down in the single digits.

 

Edit: My puter won't let me edit a post I missed that you put a new GP relay on, and that the smoke was while cranking. Definitely sounds like GP's to me, if this is any help I just pulled GP's out of a motor with 170K and they didn't look good at all, so if yours are original I'd go that route. Along with batteries.

 

If you need to replace the battery, do them both at the same time even if you think one is dead and the other might be ok. If you put one new battery in with an old one, it won't be very long until you need to address this issue again. JMHO

 

"And what caused it to have that really long, rough and smoky cold starts?"

Usually it's from the combustion chamber not being warm enough (GPR, glow plugs, batteries), but once she starts it should clear up in a minute or two. But, start with checking the batteries and your engine block heater & cord. If those turn out ok it's pretty easy to test the glow plugs through the harness on the valve cover with a multimeter.

Keep us posted!

 

When you ohm them you want a range between .1-2.0

 

When the the time comes, here is a link to Woodnthings' website on the 7.3L glow plug system. He does a great job in explaining how the system works and there is a video clip at the bottom of the web page showing how to test the glow plugs and the whole system.

https://sites.google.com/site/woodnt...ow-plug-system


P.S. I have been (as well as many others on this site) in the same boat as you about 4 times over the past 10 years. One time it was glow plugs, one time it was the GPR, once or twice it was batteries and the last time it was my starter. Either way, don't worry about it - with the knowledge these folks have on this site coupled with their willingness to help - You will fix your problem.

 

Ok thanks for all the help guys!

I was definitely thinking the batteries had a big part in it. I was thinking either getting the cheaper ones from Walmart or go with Motorcraft ones. My Dad asked his mechanic about the Motorcraft ones and I guess they're like $120 or so with a 3 year warranty, which isn't too bad at all. I'll have to see how much cheaper the Walmart ones are and how their warranty is. I'll probably just replace both batteries to be safe.

Like Jason said, I wonder if maybe the plug for the block heater went out. When I've plugged it in, it has blown the breaker a few times. Mostly its from the plug on the block heater being wet I think, one time it actually shocked me a little. If I dry it off it works fine. Now I plug it into the truck first and then into the wall, haha, that's probably better and safer too. I wonder if maybe that shock and blowing the breaker could have shorted out or fried the block heater, or plug?

Thanks Rich! Not exactly sure what oil is in it right now, any way to tell for sure? I'll probably be changing all the fluids and filters here in a few hundred miles here, just to be safe. So I could change it then. And yes it is outside, but I think the front was the opposite way of the wind, which might help a little. I wish I could put it inside, but just don't have the room.

And yeah it was very smoky those few times we started it. And that was while cranking, it was pouring white-gray smoke. Didn't look or smell good. It did clear up eventually though, as much as it could with being so cold. Normally it does smoke a little on start up and then clears up, like you said and how It should. It did definitely look and sound like the glow plugs were bad, but just didn't add up because it started fine for the fist two weeks, or so with no issues. And that was in not quite as cold, but still colder temperatures. Could the weak batteries have killed the GPR and glow plugs somehow?

I think I'll get some new batteries, probably this weekend, and then go from. I know that the batteries are definitely a little weak. And then I'll test the glow plugs after that if I need to. About are how hard is it to change out the glow plugs? I don't think it'd be too bad, but my Dad said its about a day or two of work, sound right? How do you test the block heater cord and plug?

Thanks for the link Rich! That should definitely help a lot. I don't really know how to work on the trucks right now, but hopefully I can learn a lot about it, and eventually be able to do my own work. I'm sure I'll great it all figured out, especially with all your guy's help and knowledge. Its a great site with great people, that you can learn a lot from. I knew the problem wouldn't be too bad, I guess at worst its probably the glow plugs or starter. I wasn't too worried, especially since once its started it runs great. We'll see how it does tomorrow morning. I'll definitely keep you guys posted.

Thanks guys!

 

If you get some time, read my cold start thread in my signature line. Glow plugs aren't too bad, it's a bit of a pain in the rear to get the passenger side valve cover off, but other than that, there isn't too much to it. Good luck, and let us know how new batteries do for you.

 

Ok so this morning I guess it didn't start well either. It took my Dad 3 times or cranks to start it. And on the 3rd time he used a shot of ether to start it. I guess he did that yesterday. I know not good. He said that's the only way he could get it to start. He was actually joking with my Uncle on whether or not he should tell me or not, because he figured I'd be pissed, haha. Yeah I'm not too happy about it, but not too much I can do about it now, just have to try to make sure it doesn't happen again.

But yeah, still having the same issue. It'll crank and want to turn over, but just doesn't. It doesn't seem like the batteries are as dead as they were. So I guess the battery charger did help a little bit, but it they did still start to get weak after the 4th time of cranking it yesterday, and my dad had to put the battery charger on it again.

Jason (HKusp) I read through the first few, pages of your cold start thread, and mine seems to be doing pretty close to what yours did, and having the same issues. Except mines smokes a lot when cranking. My Dad said it pours out like clouds of white/gray smoke. I know the one day I saw it, it was pouring out smoke when cranking. What is the UVCH part that you replaced?

It sure seems like it could be that glow plugs, but I just don't think so because it started fine for like the first two weeks or so, and then after the first time the batteries went dead, it wouldn't start. It just doesn't make sense how the glow plugs could almost

Could the batteries going bad somehow caused the GPR to go out and then causing the glow plugs to go bad?

Do you guys still think the weak batteries could still be the problem. I think I'm just going to replace them anyways to see if that helps, but just wanted to see what you guys think. I've read that it needs at least 10.5 volts to fire the injectors, like Rich said, so I was thinking that might be my problem. Since I know the batteries are weak, and when we tested them, they dropped to 7 or 8 volts when cranking. Could this be true, and maybe whats causing all of the white smoke?

Thanks again for that link Rich! It definitely helped things make a little more sense. So is that a sure way to test the glow plugs? Because my Dads mechanic was saying that the only way to test the glow plugs was to take the valve covers off, and at that you might as well replace them anyways.

 

You can ohm the GP's out right at the UVCH. I think they should be less than 2 ohms at most, but I believe less than 1 is preferred, don't quote me on that though. The procedure should be described in that thread. If not, it is in this one. Click here>>>>>https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/4...ke-thread.html

 

Jon, from my experience if the batteries are bad replace them, that could be the whole issue. If that doesn't fix it I say GP's, I would bet they are the the originals. In my original motor I replaced the GP's at 250K and the weren't up to the task then.

 

Yeah I think I'm just going to say screw it and, do both the batteries and glow plugs. I'll just do batteries at first and go from there, but I got a feeling that that's not going to help fully. From doing a little more reading of different threads and other things, it definitely seems like the glow plugs are bad, and probably most of them too, based on the amount of white smoke that I'm getting. And then after that, since I'm already in there, I might as well fix the oil cooler too. Then hopefully it should be good to go, I hope.

Like I said before it just didn't make sense that the glow plugs would work fine for the first week or two in 30 and 40 degree temperatures, and then a week or two later not work in the same temperatures, and hardly start at all.

I'll see how it starts tomorrow. I'll take a video of it, so you guys can see what it does.

 

I summarized the post above.

1. Check your battery cables (on both ends of each of them) for proper connection with no corrosion.
2. Have the batteries properly tested at a battery place, not a car parts place.