It's part of the wholesale agreement I'd think. They have a similar relationship with Commercial Tire iirc. I don't know anything about them. Are they better to work with? Too, I'd have to think either retailer would let you work through the details of an order directly with AWS. Stu

 

I'm sure it is all about the wholesaler agreement and a no-compete clause. We have Commercial Tires here too, and that's probably where I'd go if I needed to, just because. But I really don't know much about them, either.

 

Here's what you need, these are Budd #71410s with tires. The $800 BIN price isn't terrible, but with the seller being in Florida the shipping would be a killer. Stu

4 Budd 19 5 x 5 25 Dodge Truck Wheels | eBay

 

Part of my problem was I didn't understand what I was looking for. I didn't know the difference between the tubed and tubeless rim sizes. I thought I was looking for a 17" tubeless rim but it's actually the 19.5". The info you posted earlier finally "clicked" in my head and gave me a bunch of options I didn't realize I had.

 

Stu, how exactly do they "re-center" a wheel, i.e., put on old center on a new wheel? Do the put the old center over the new wheel's center, or do they cut both out and weld the old center to the new rim? I'm having a hard time understanding how they could reliably get a concentric new wheel doing anythingbut laying the old center over the new. (not to mention lawyer issues)

 

Let me see if I can confuse you then! As I thought on this over night I believe that the solution Mike Goldsby found (new 17" tubeless rims) is more workable than trying to have your centers remounted in to new tubeless 19.5" outer rims. The reason is because the stock widow maker has the center disc attached to the outer rim along its "semi drop center". Another way of saying it would be that the center disc's diameter doesn't allow it to reach all the way out to the base of the outer rim. The center disc is somewhat smaller I believe than would be required for it to fit cleanly into a 19.5" tubeless outer rim. One of my projects today was/is to measure the center disc of a widow maker 17" and compare it to the center disc of a #71410 19.5". I believe the 17" center will be much smaller in this instance than the 19.5".

This is not the case when dealing with 17" and 19.5" Budd type dual wheels. The centers of those wheels are exactly alike. The center of a 17" tube type will fit a 19.5" outer rim in this example because the 17" center mounts directly to the flat of its outer tube type rim. Stu

Edit - Ross - AWS has a big machine that locates the used donor center into the new outer rim. Once the correct geometry is achieved it gets welded solid on both sides. The method you describe is how I've seen Stockton do it. Looking at pictures of wheels they've done it's obvious that they welded a flat plate to the face of a complete donor wheel then machined out the original center. Let me see if I can find a picture of one I saved to show it. Stu

 

I sorta thought that too but the $225 total cost for each wheel sandblasted AND powder coated with no shipping costs made me think they weren't making a huge amount of money on the deal. The tires I bought were competitively priced too....

Now, having said all that, The entire deal, 2 (new) TOYO 9.00-20's radials, new tubes, flaps, + 4 recapped radial 9.00-20's tubes, flaps, 6 AWS wheels mounted etc totaled $2800!


Any place else would have probably been the same or more!

 

Thanks Stu! I'm somewhat surprised (maybe not) that they couldn't order wheels that haven't been drilled for lug bolts, or machined for the center hub opening, and drill them to order.

I suspect you might need longer studs with those modified wheels, too? I'd guess the new centers are at least 3/16" thick?

 

The really big guys that have Accuride affiliation, like Wheels Now in Wisconsin and Century Wheel out west, can do them from blanks. I talked to Wheels Now years ago and the cost was silly. The wheels I bought from AWS looked like stock 19.5s. Stock center thickness and stud length. The ones done by Stockton I can't say how thick the flat plate would be. Could be 1/4". Since it looks like they cut out the original center the stud length is probably stock. The truck pictured is a Chevy. Did you count the hand holes front to back? Stu

 

Thanks, I missed the part about Stockton machining out the original center after welding the plate on. So stud length wouldn't be much different.

5 vs 6 on handholes?! why?

 

Stockton not paying attention. Stu

 

When ya think about the entire farming community, vineyards, orange groves, old truck restorers, etc.... that there would be an off the shelf wheel available in a one piece, that looks like an original WM. How many trucks were made that are still out there? More than some of the makes and models Coker has made wheels for, I'm willing to bet.

 

Like anything else, you can buy whatever you need for a half ton from 15 different catalogs or on-line vendors. Bigger trucks aren't there...yet if they will be ever. So it falls to us and venders like Chuck that are also in the hobby to help guys sort things out. Stu

 

As I suspected. The center disc of an F-3 17" widow maker measures 15 1/2" in diameter while the center disc of a Budd #71410 19.5" measures 16 3/4". This says that a company like AWS would play heck remounting widow maker centers in new tubeless 19.5" outer rims. But it reaffirms what Mike Goldsby found. That the WM centers fit very nicely into modern 17" "drop center" tubeless rims. Stockton did his, but I'd think AWS could do that same. The below picture of an F-3 widow maker shows how the center disc is mounted to the "semi drop center" of the rim, which is in fact the raised joint area that causes us such headaches. The second picture is Mike Goldsby's 17". Stu