What's up its Phil once again here to start a basic chat argument about rather it is good for timing chains to have the ability to stretch or not stretch.



STRETCH

VS.

NO STRETCH

GO!


(OPENING DEBATE)


I Believe it is good for a chain to have the ability to stretch....


If a Chain cannot stretch That means it will break and kill your engine before you realize there is a issue.


IF a Timing chain breaks it can cause severe mechanical damage.


A Stretch allows you to know your chain is close to breaking.


Symptoms of a stretch timing chain is a 5-6% advance in your timing, low idle under load, fouled spark plugs and or moist spark plugs.



Your turn ...

 

They don't "stretch" like a rubber band, the pins wear, causing the whole chain to elongate by the amount of wear times the number of pins.

In addition, material is lost from the sprockets, which reduces their diameters, adding to the slack.

Yea, it's good they stretch, as it keeps mechanics and suppliers in business.

 

Most people don't pay enough attention to the issues with their cars to understand that it's the timing chain wearing (as stated before it's really not stretch), and so as a result it just fails anyways. The only vehicles I have seen give a pronounced issue due to timing chain wear are Mercedes diesels, since the changing length changes the injection timing as well.
With a gas engine, people just say that something isn't quite right, and they either throw thousands at an engine rebuild because it's getting "tired", they sell them for next to nothing, or they keep driving it just putting up with the issues until there is finally a failure.

 

Well in comparison, i know how a timing chain works and its made of metal.

the so called stretch "Is not represented as a "rubberband" in my mind. It is represented by the age of the vehicles wear and tear.

I have heard of issues of new timing chains snapping the crank off yes it is highly logical.

Excessive heating of metal does cause expansion though.

 

My truck is well above being tired for its age after reviewing the underside of the valve casing it is relatively clean compared to most cylinder heads of its age and caliber. If kepts right, it has over 5-20 years more of life in it excluding the stretching of the timing chain. Still say a new set of heads would help but overall it is in the 30-35 years of age range mechanically.


I have seen engines that are 10 years old and look 40 inside the cylinder head and the external is coated with rust.

 

Ductility is the ability of a material to be stretched and/or bent without breaking. These chains must have reasonable ductility to resist fracture from stress as well as fatigue. Most of the time, the chains will operate in what is known as the elastic range, which is the range of stresses and strains that the material can operate in and return to its original size and shape. However, over time, the material will not completely return to this size and shape if stresses are sufficiently high enough or run through enough cycles. So essentially what that means is that over time, there will be some stretch. The pins also do wear, and the gear also does wear, but the chain also does stretch some. It doesn't take a large amount to make things go a few degrees out. It would be difficult to notice by the naked eye how much they do stretch. I can guarantee as a chain ages though, it will also be stretched. Even if it is only a few hundred thousandths of an inch per link, add that up over the length of the chain, and it will become an issue.

 

That is a high representation of how i feel about a timing chain, My timing is stretched by 5 degree's though instead of 10 degree's advance it reads 15 degrees in advancement. I was thinking going for a edlebrock timing chain kit or a cloyes they sell stretch proof kits but i don't think that is safe as they say it is... when i think of no stretch i think of extreme wear and breakage..

Like cast iron does not bend or stretch it breaks.

 

Take a new one and an old one of the same manufacturer apart and measure the components. Let us know what you find. Perspiring minds want to know....

 

How does stretch add to the timing event? If the chain stretches then the cam would lag in relation to the crank. If the distributor is driven off of the cam, then it too would be retarded with respect to the crank.

 

trust me when i say this my vehicle is retarded lol spudder and drowning out from timing chain cause everything is offset.

 

The ignition and cam timing would both be off, and since the relationship you are setting when using a timing light is actually the crankshaft next to a timing mark, it would indicate that the cam is indeed a little late. However, the cam would be the few degrees late, which then makes the ignition timing a little late as evidenced by the pointer not be aligned with the mark on the balancer if it hasn't been touched. I have seen the mark jump all over, a few degrees at least on older motors that have chain slop.

 

^^^
This is the easiest way to check for a sloppy timing chain.
Put a light on it and snap the throttle open and closed a couple of times.
If the marks jump around instead of advancing and retarding smoothly you are observing the chain flailing around inside the timing case.

If you still have the crap nylon toothed cam gear from the factory be sure to drop the pan and clear all the shards of plastic out of the pickup screen too.

 

If it's an high-mile engine, I'd just replace the timing chain and sprockets and be done with it. It's not rocket surgery and you can inspect other items while doing that job.

 

The way you make timing chain sound is like the chain is having a openly gay night in the timing case every time the gears move ~,~ i've checked a lot on there these two conflict have nothing to do with each other btw i don't have the money to keep picking with it anyway....


like i said i am getting a nice moped and going for my motorcycles endorsement then swap the 50cc out with a gy6 150cc Simple as pie and with it being a moped I can get completely around the system of the rules. It says no working on "Vehicles in the lot" By lot they mean parking lot. By parking lot they mean a confined space out doors. I can completely set the whole scooter on my back pouch and in 40 minutes flat i can swap the whole engine on the moped and just go. All i got to do is get the new engine, 20 minutes for the break in period then change the oil again.... bam bam booma boop no problems. Working on a 4 cycle engine requires no rocket science, hell it does not even require a garage to mess with ..... Mainly just a tool box. As for the truck, I might as well dump it up in a storage some where.... for the amount that i save i am paying only 1/3 of what i normally spend on gas on that fat sucker.

 

Just sell the truck or scrap it since scrap is high. The money could go towards a motorcycle or economical car. (I rode and owned only motorcycles for several years, a 1988 Harley FXR and a BMW R90 I still have.)

Storage is only a way to bleed money. The days of gasoline cheap enough to feed trucks which aren't used for work rigs are gone.

All a truck needing work is to someone just starting to drive is a money toilet. Things are different now than a million years ago when I was growing up.

Knowing when NOT to mess with something pays off.

If you ever want to play with trucks, buy the TOOLS BEFORE you buy the truck. Tools make money and make toys, but toys without tools cost dearly. Tools are so much better to have than toys it's no contest.

Finally, get comfortable with selling and swapping and scrapping instead of "wanting". You'll learn to treat every vehicle as an expendable means to an end instead of a shrine.

That's the winning game.