One other concern I have about this swap is the bolts that will be used on the flywheel. All three potential solutions use bolts that are longer than stock. Does anyone have any concern about this added length increasing the likelihood of shearing off the bolts? I don't know, but I thought I would throw it out there for those folks here who are more knowledgable.

 

If the proper place bolts are used I'd have no concern about shear or loss of clamping force.

Gary,
I know when I went to the ZF and swapped clutches I needed a later model flywheel drilling for the 12" clutch PP.
I have NO intention of pulling it down to take measurements, but you have quite a bit of data from my PMGR starter issues with this swap.

 

Bradd - Jim is one of our guru's, so I trust his assessment. And, in case you missed the discussion of "place bolts" earlier in the thread, here's a link: place bolts.

 

But, there is a bit of confusion in the MPC about 460 starters. As the last two pic's show the catalog shows that a 460 in an E250 or 350 before 1/81 takes one starter, but an F or E250/350 from 1/81 takes a different starter - at least up through the end of that catalog in 89. So, was the 460 available in an F250/350 before 1/81 and was just not mentioned in the catalog? Or, was it just not available? Anyway, I'm thinking there should be some caution noted in a writeup about the 460 starter/M-block flywheel matchup. While it looks like the starter for a 460 in either an pickup or van between 2/81 and 12/89 will work, I don't know about the starters before or after that window.

They didn't mention about the 460 availability, but I do know that you could get the 460 in the F250's as far back as 74 at least.

It wasn't available in the smaller trucks.

Later on, don't know the yrs. but you could get it in the E-250/350 vans.

My 76 had a 390 but the 460 was available then.
My 460 is a 77 model engine(non-cat)also d-3ve-a2a heads.
The fuel pump(manual on block) has to be for the E-250 or 350.
When getting parts you have to specify E series. for fuel pump,belts,etc. <!-- / message --><!-- attachments -->
Another question; Was the starters different on the C6 and manual trans. in 70's 460

 

I wonder if it wasn't available until Feb 81 in the 80-86 trucks. But, this could be just one more error I've found in the MPC.

 

I was wondering as edited in other post, about the differences on the starters for the 460 for manual or auto trans.

Might be some combination that would work with the 351M/460 flywheel.

I might just be having FLASHBACK....

 

The 460 was dropped from trucks I think in 1980, the M-block 400 was the largest available until 1982 or 83 as the M-block was phased out & retired.

 

THanks, Gary. I do remember reading that last night now that I've seen it again. It was a lot of info to digest in those 20 some pages and obviously I didn't completely digest all of it. Thanks for the reassurance and sorry to make you revisit something you already had covered.

 

The 460 was only available in 2WD back in the '70's.
When it became re-available in the '80's it could also be found in 4WD.
There was no difference in starters for auto/manual in these years.
Later '90's trucks with the PMGR like I have did see a difference in starters for auto/manual applications.
The flywheel that is drilled for my 12" ZF clutch is different -it seems- from the flexplate that fits the E4OD.

My truck has a mechanical fuel pump.
I never had to order for a van.
But I do know that all vans and early 460's in pickups did have the Saginaw steering pump instead of the whiny C2 style pump found on '80's trucks.

 

Yes, the 460 (77yr model) that I have in my 76 does have the Saginaw pump.

The fuel pump is different than a regular 460.
You have to get an E-series engine pump for it.
The shaft is different.
This engine came out of a 77 model 30ft Motorhome.

 

When you say "shaft" do you mean the lever that rides on the cam eccentric?

 

Yes the lever that rides on the cam eccentric is longer and crooked more than the regular one.
I'll try to post a pic tomorrow of the old one.
The parts man(old school) looked up the one for the 77 model 460 and when I got the old one off,big difference.
When I took it back, with my old one, we finally looked under the E-series and found it.
I'll try to get the part #.

You would think that they would be the same, but NOOOOO.
Anyway, I'll do that tomorrow.....Tired...Good night..

BTW, I sincerely apologize for the Hijacking...Head up the a** syndrome.. Trav.

 

Hmmm, I wonder why the timing case is unique to the vans?

Is it because they have a forward mounted dipstick and a different oil pan?
I know 4x4 460's like mine have a rear sump and extended pickup in order to clear the frame crossmenber.

(sorry for the hijack Gary.)

 

No prob's on the diversion of topic. Gives me a partial excuse for the # of pages.

 

my tranny is in yeah! but adapting a 205 transfer case behind ZF. will not bolt up due to shift linkage issue. got that figured out and already mocked up. need to get a new yoke and seals for 205 case. will hopefully be built up this weekend. you have to clearance the shift rods by grinding a notch on flange at zf tranny. have photos in my albums. this has been done already and not a big deal. grind the mimnum amount you can and use common sense on just clearing situation. used a carbide grinder to notch out flange on flange. took about 45 minutes with a couple mock ups and clearance checks. scary simple stuff to me. still maintain strength to flange also.