Is it time to get a statement from some of the major diesel fuel additive manufacturers stating that their product will not void the Ford warranty and that it meets or exceeds Ford product specs?

 

Persistent you are...where to begin...so much wrong and so little time

My position has moved a bit...but not how you think.

I am certainly pleased that my information was responsible for 55 potential Ford buyers resulted in further review of their truck needs. Ford's blanket policy of warranty denial for the HPFP failures should be a concern to consider before parting with $50,000 of their hard earned money. Some who paused to evaluate the risk factor jumped in the Ford waters anyway. I congratulated them on their new truck. I have not spoken badly to anyone who has purchased a new Ford...but I have cautioned them to use the PM22A additive. It was prudent advice given the circumstances regarding the poor fuel supply. I have not asked one owner to sell his 6.7 truck. In fact, in private conversations, I have recommended the opposite. If any of these members want to speak up, they can. The conversations were private and I will respect that fact. Ford precipitated this discussion and the resulting lost sales with shameful treatment of a loyal customer.

I do not know if using additives is a good or bad thing. I do know that Ford sells the stuff because they know the fuel supply here in the US is not up to standards needed by the Bosch pump. Earlier today, I received an interesting partial analysis of the entire Ford response from a respected FTE member .He has said he will be posting a complete analysis when he gets it all into a spreadsheet. It is interesting...and condemning ...stand by for his report. The research going on into the DLC coatings solubility issues covered petroleum distillates common to engine oils. These same products can be found un diesel fuel and are likely found in diesel fuel additives. Additive company's are very unlikely to volunteer proprietary information regarding the formula for their product. This makes running additives a roll of the dice if, and that is yet undetermined, DLC coating delamination is a concern.

The DLC coating research has piqued my interest. While I still say lack of lubricity in our fuel is a problem, I am very curious as to where this research may lead us. It is just one more potential avenue that needs to be traveled in the search for the truth about these failures. The Ford report clearly shows that the better quality fuel required by law in Canada has resulted in very measurable differences in the number of HPFP failures between the two markets. I certainly do not need to change my position on lubricity due to the NHTSA report. It bolsters my argument dramatically.

Your allegation that the information posted by me is useless is not supported by the many on this site that have come to a realization that the owners of this engine need to be especially vigilant when buying, treating and using US diesel fuel. How many of the members here have started running fuel additives because of the dialog here. You discount my supporters who take the time to send me personal messages asking me to continue to provide information I feel is relevant to the subject of Bosch HPFP failures. Are you saying these people are wrong. Some of the names would surprise you.

Your battle plan for the potential failure of the HPFP is most interesting. The HPFP will fail catastrophically without warning. Which tank of fuel out of the dozens of tankfuls you have purchased had the "bad fuel" that Ford will claim destroyed the HPFP. If you are near home and have a trusted dealer who is not looking to generate additional shop income by turning warranty pay into customer pay, you have a small chance of getting the HPFP covered by warranty. This statement has been verified by more than a few that have sweated out the warranty denial problem. How will you protect yourself from this happening. It will happen very quickly and without your knowledge. The Tech Hotline will be told "bad fuel" and you are now without warranty coverage. BTDT.

Your buy good diesel fuel line was spot on...how do you know...you don't...the dealer does not even know. You can be sure of one thing though. In order to get fuel that meets minimum Bosch standards, which is incidentally the same standard used for Canadian, the fuel blender will have had to spend his dollars to provide fuel that exceeds US standards.

Document the dealers work. I have been down that road as well. See comments about the Ford Tech Hotline noted above...same stuff...different day

Finally, your challenge regarding the fuel in my truck. I certainly did not test the fuel to ASTM standards....but here's the catch...Ford never mentioned fuel quality. They never took the fuel samples that were laid out for them. The only reason given for warranty denial was the first dealers completely discredited claim that water was the cause. This was debunked at Shepherds when they used the Ford dictated diagnostic procedures to arrive at the conclusion that the pump failed due to unknown mechanical problems. If Ford thought there was anything but water tobe used for denial, why did they not test the fuel. Do you really want to head down the road to accepting that the owner needs too provide the testing information for potential warranty coverage? Now there is a slippery slope to create...and the situation is already severely stacked against the owner. You are also leaving out the part that no water was ever found in any part of my fuel system.

There is no question that a disreputable Ford dealer who was trying to cover two failed diagnosis's with a customer pay sham is why the warranty was denied. The bigger issue is that Ford has their name on the truck. They should have fixed the truck under warranty and avoided this whole problem...I hope they enjoyed that $8000 they saved by not paying for the repair...I am enjoying the more than $500,000 in lost profits Ford has not made because of the way they handled the situation.

Meanwhile, buy that good diesel, treat it with the PM22A crutch, pray a little that the HPFP God shines down on you and just drive the truck...and smile...it is what I do every day.

Regards

 

Located in Texas...Never price shop when buying fuel always same brand. I stated when using the Ford Motorcraft product ....I had issues with Parafifin.....I didnot state that the Ford Motorcraft caused paraffin...it didnot do enough to prevent it.....and I used the Ford product alot....avg 45,000 miles a year on the work truck.....and put that Ford product in the tank everytime I put fuel in it....There was a posting sometime back ....someone complained about paraffin build up within the water separator housing and the lower fuel filter. I think this was within this forum or another one.....If you have time read the following....it helped me .
DTS Articles - Fuel Coagulation

 

That was very well put......enjoyed reading your posting....

 

People can speculate all they want about the effect of the various additives on the fuel pump. I'm not worried about using PowerService or Stanadyne in place of the Ford PM22A at this point. Rickatic's pump went and by his account, he used no additives prior to the failure. We're seeing a significantly higher failure rate in the US than in Canada. Both of those facts lend credibility to the theory that the culprit is lubricity. If someone presents evidence which casts doubt on that theory, I'm always ready to listen but for now, it looks like a lubricity to me.

 

Not to be dis-respectful, but opinions mean zero. Only documented analysis are fact. I feel Motorcraft is better then Optilube, cost less also and thats just my opinion. Yes I do use 2% bio, it's the only on road fuel sold in Pennsylvania since 2010. I use the PM22 as a cetane booster.

 

My 2005 6.0 psd Owners Manual Supplement states the same as above. So Ford has taken this position about additives already back in 2005.

 

Agree 100%. Like I said, my opinion, you do with your truck what you like. No bio mix in NY where I am so I will use what gives the next best lubrication with the current info that is available.

 

Stanadyne only has a letter from Ford saying it is approved for the 99 powerstroke. A little outdated but i'm going to continue using it in my 6.7. I looked for an email link at Stanadyne to ask them about 6.7 Ford HPFP concerns, there is non, will have to write a letter and will post if they respond. I feel sorry for the people who sold thier expensive vehicles because they are fearfull of what they read in a public forum. Victims of fear mongers. They must have a lot of money and drink a lot of kool-aid.

 

Rick, very well said...again...Please keep up the research and providing us with the best data you can.

 

And Ford also states it's acceptable to use additives to increase cetane numbers provided they meet or exceed Ford specifications. What Ford is saying is, we know what's in our product and have control of it's production. There are a lot of elixirs out there, some good and some harmful so Ford does not recommend any fuel additive that they have no control of.

 

Do a little research on wax drop out. 10 degrees isn't what I would call extreme climate conditions. Wax drop out has been known about as a problem with ULSF for something like 5 years.

 

I hve used power dderve and was not happy with the results. pm22a nets me .6-1.0 gallon per mile. power serve failed there with no gain.

 

That last sentence....opinion or fact? All Ford says is like your first sentence .........."provided they meet or exceed Ford specifications". Just because they don't specifically say it on the bottle doesn't mean they don't meet or far exceed Ford specs. And of course Ford is going to tell you to use their product if you are going to use an additive, you think they will tell you to use GM's?

Like you said, opinions mean zero.

 

im not oblivious to what can happen, but I highly doubt an additive will make that happen. I would say it was a fuel "type" or formula issue. I live in New England and have never had an issue, on my personal vehicle or any trucks or equipment at work.