High Idle
Lead Driver
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 5,368
Likes: 97
From: Northern Indiana
Shake-n-bake, do you have any extra harness for a aid module? I am thinking about buying on on eBay but they don't have the wiring harness.
Or will the module not work for my truck since I can get the other wire thing to work since mine is a 99?
Or will the module not work for my truck since I can get the other wire thing to work since mine is a 99?
Post Fiend
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 6,096
Likes: 26
From: Mesa AZ
There are AIC modules on eBay with the harness so if you go that route then just make sure you bid on one with the wire harness.
Post Fiend
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 6,096
Likes: 26
From: Mesa AZ
Elder User
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 765
Likes: 1
From: Eastern Ohio
Did some digging and found this on fleet fords site.
So it looks like the pcm knows if it is PTO trans, but it doesn't state that it needs to be for it to work. Many times power is taken directly from the engine via a belt drive.
This from the same site says "all diesel engine PCM's are pto-capable". From a chart found here. https://www.fleet.ford.com/truckbbas...df/193-194.pdf
Edit: Chart didn't work, so these are the two lines we are concerned with.
So, if you weren't confused earlier you should be know.
"Cannot find the PTO Circuit".
The Super Duty F-Series PTO Circuit wiring changed soon after 1/1998 Job #1. The PTO Circuit wires moved more toward the driver's side, under the steering column and onto the harness for the black 4-pin APCM connector. The wires shown as 18-gage are 20-gage. Job #1 began with Circuit 640, red with yellow trace, 18-gage (really 20-gage), then changed to Circuit 295, light blue with pink trace, 20-gage. PTO Circuit 322, correctly remains light blue with yellow trace, but there is another wire with the same color near it (Circuit 323, not related to PTO). To verify that the correct wire is chosen, check to confirm that the 4R100 overdrive-cancel light is illuminated as it normally should be when the PTO Circuit is activated.
"The PTO Circuit is wired properly but will not respond".
When the vehicle battery is disconnected for extended period the powertrain control strategy "forgets" PTO logic and will not respond to commands for elevated idle until it has had a chance to re-count the number of teeth on the gear-set in the 4R100 automatic transmission (36-teeth for non-PTO 4R100 and 115 teeth for the PTO-4R100). To remedy this simply drive the vehicle a short distance. Typically less than a mile will be sufficient to prepare the strategy to respond properly. Driving in first gear will speed this up. Driving stationary with the rear wheels off of the ground will not work. Also note that once the ignition is turned ON, CRANK, and START, sitting and idling for too long before driving may bypass the strategy's "search" cycle, leaving the driving remedy ineffective. If this occurs, shut off the engine and start the cycle over. No need to rush to drive, but avoid unnecessary delay.
The Super Duty F-Series PTO Circuit wiring changed soon after 1/1998 Job #1. The PTO Circuit wires moved more toward the driver's side, under the steering column and onto the harness for the black 4-pin APCM connector. The wires shown as 18-gage are 20-gage. Job #1 began with Circuit 640, red with yellow trace, 18-gage (really 20-gage), then changed to Circuit 295, light blue with pink trace, 20-gage. PTO Circuit 322, correctly remains light blue with yellow trace, but there is another wire with the same color near it (Circuit 323, not related to PTO). To verify that the correct wire is chosen, check to confirm that the 4R100 overdrive-cancel light is illuminated as it normally should be when the PTO Circuit is activated.
"The PTO Circuit is wired properly but will not respond".
When the vehicle battery is disconnected for extended period the powertrain control strategy "forgets" PTO logic and will not respond to commands for elevated idle until it has had a chance to re-count the number of teeth on the gear-set in the 4R100 automatic transmission (36-teeth for non-PTO 4R100 and 115 teeth for the PTO-4R100). To remedy this simply drive the vehicle a short distance. Typically less than a mile will be sufficient to prepare the strategy to respond properly. Driving in first gear will speed this up. Driving stationary with the rear wheels off of the ground will not work. Also note that once the ignition is turned ON, CRANK, and START, sitting and idling for too long before driving may bypass the strategy's "search" cycle, leaving the driving remedy ineffective. If this occurs, shut off the engine and start the cycle over. No need to rush to drive, but avoid unnecessary delay.
This from the same site says "all diesel engine PCM's are pto-capable". From a chart found here. https://www.fleet.ford.com/truckbbas...df/193-194.pdf
Edit: Chart didn't work, so these are the two lines we are concerned with.
PTO versus NON-PTO Transmission
Diesel Engine PCM: All diesel engine PCM’s are PTO-capable
Under-dash PTO wiring:Two circuits, 12-volt power and PTO signal to PCM, included.
Diesel Engine PCM: All diesel engine PCM’s are PTO-capable
Under-dash PTO wiring:Two circuits, 12-volt power and PTO signal to PCM, included.
Elder User
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 765
Likes: 1
From: Eastern Ohio
I guess I should have read farther. From page 2.
So it looks like no pto auto tranny=no free fast idle. Despite what they say on page 1.
STATIONARY ELEVATED IDLE CONTROL
Ford offers the following two methods for obtaining
stationary elevated idle control for 7.3L and 6.0L diesel
engines. For gas engines the PTO installer will need to
obtain elevated idle control from an aftermarket source:
a. “Auxiliary Idle Control”: option code 96P for FSeries
(option code 961 for E-Series) contains a
“full function” Auxiliary Powertrain Control Module
or APCM, mounting bracket and operating
manual. It must be ordered separately and is not
included with the Transmission Power Take-Off
Provision option. A “limited function” APCM is
included in the kit that is part of the Ambulance
Prep Option, has no LED read-out, and is not a
separate orderable option. Both of these kits are
more fully described later in this section under
PTO Auxiliary Idle Control. The operating
manuals can be found at www.fleet.ford.com/
truckbbas, then “Publications” drop-down box. It
will function for both manual or automatic
transmissions.
b. “Elevated Idle Feature”: this feature is inherent in
the powertrain control modules of diesel engine
vehicles ordered with “Transmission Power
Take-Off Provision”. Activating the Ford “PTO
Circuit” will automatically elevate the engine idle
to 1200 rpm in “PARK” or “NEUTRAL”
regardless of the parking brake being set. This
feature does not require use of the Auxiliary Idle
Control option or APCM module. This feature is
not available for manual transmission.
Ford offers the following two methods for obtaining
stationary elevated idle control for 7.3L and 6.0L diesel
engines. For gas engines the PTO installer will need to
obtain elevated idle control from an aftermarket source:
a. “Auxiliary Idle Control”: option code 96P for FSeries
(option code 961 for E-Series) contains a
“full function” Auxiliary Powertrain Control Module
or APCM, mounting bracket and operating
manual. It must be ordered separately and is not
included with the Transmission Power Take-Off
Provision option. A “limited function” APCM is
included in the kit that is part of the Ambulance
Prep Option, has no LED read-out, and is not a
separate orderable option. Both of these kits are
more fully described later in this section under
PTO Auxiliary Idle Control. The operating
manuals can be found at www.fleet.ford.com/
truckbbas, then “Publications” drop-down box. It
will function for both manual or automatic
transmissions.
b. “Elevated Idle Feature”: this feature is inherent in
the powertrain control modules of diesel engine
vehicles ordered with “Transmission Power
Take-Off Provision”. Activating the Ford “PTO
Circuit” will automatically elevate the engine idle
to 1200 rpm in “PARK” or “NEUTRAL”
regardless of the parking brake being set. This
feature does not require use of the Auxiliary Idle
Control option or APCM module. This feature is
not available for manual transmission.
Post Fiend
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 6,096
Likes: 26
From: Mesa AZ
Great info, I remember reading about the PCM relearning function in the Muncie PTO manual. I will look through the manual again tomorrow. I think it had some sort of caution about using the blue with pink wire for power...(which my '99 is using for something else). I wonder if that is not allowing the PCM to relearn? I will experiment and report back...
Thanks for the info, seems logical the PTO circuit would be active for all vehicles since there are a variety of ways to "take off power" from the engine. I have seen pumps that are driven by the serpentine belt system as well so the PTO fast idle wire should work for that system. Heck, there is a label on my '99 wiring harness that says "Power Take Off Circuit" so it makes sense that it should work.
Thanks for the info, seems logical the PTO circuit would be active for all vehicles since there are a variety of ways to "take off power" from the engine. I have seen pumps that are driven by the serpentine belt system as well so the PTO fast idle wire should work for that system. Heck, there is a label on my '99 wiring harness that says "Power Take Off Circuit" so it makes sense that it should work.
Posting Guru
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,153
Likes: 0
From: Boston, MA
Ford Auxiliary Idle Control (AIC)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qxtUqfuFKYI
This just popped up for sale near me. I can get it for you if you'd like.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qxtUqfuFKYI
This just popped up for sale near me. I can get it for you if you'd like.
Postmaster
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,340
Likes: 2
You guys might check out this link: DFUSER Ford 7.3L Powerstroke Diesel Auxiliary Idle Controller AIC High Idle
Never used it before so can't say much about it.
Never used it before so can't say much about it.
Posting Guru
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,153
Likes: 0
From: Boston, MA
He's asking $175 but I'm sure I can send him that link to that idle controller and get him down to a cheaper price. What's your maximum price? I'll work on the guy selling it.
Post Fiend
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 6,096
Likes: 26
From: Mesa AZ
I guess I should have read farther. From page 2.
...
b. “Elevated Idle Feature”: this feature is inherent in
the powertrain control modules of diesel engine
vehicles ordered with “Transmission Power
Take-Off Provision”. Activating the Ford “PTO
Circuit” will automatically elevate the engine idle
to 1200 rpm in “PARK” or “NEUTRAL”
regardless of the parking brake being set. This
feature does not require use of the Auxiliary Idle
Control option or APCM module. This feature is
not available for manual transmission
So it looks like no pto auto tranny=no free fast idle. Despite what they say on page 1.
...
b. “Elevated Idle Feature”: this feature is inherent in
the powertrain control modules of diesel engine
vehicles ordered with “Transmission Power
Take-Off Provision”. Activating the Ford “PTO
Circuit” will automatically elevate the engine idle
to 1200 rpm in “PARK” or “NEUTRAL”
regardless of the parking brake being set. This
feature does not require use of the Auxiliary Idle
Control option or APCM module. This feature is
not available for manual transmission
So it looks like no pto auto tranny=no free fast idle. Despite what they say on page 1.
I guess the manual trans guys are out of luck as well....bummer.
I did find the pages in the Muncie manual that talks about the PCM reset feature (attached). It says something very interesting. It says there is a window to reset the PCM but it doesn't say how big that window is but presumably it means that if you don't activate the PTO circuit in time then it won't work. The info you posted form the fleet site sounds pretty definitive but I am going to try and reset the PTO circuit on my '99 and see if that works. I figure I'll disconnect my batteries for about 15 minutes, wire up the switch, drive the truck for a mile or two and then park and try the switch. Might work!
Post Fiend
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 6,096
Likes: 26
From: Mesa AZ
I got mine off eBay for $15 plus shipping. It came with the mounting bracket and wiring harness. I've bid on others but wasn't successful bidder, they normally seem to sell in the $50-$70 range (plus shipping)
I have also seen new in the box units for sale on Amazon for $199....