Won't Start.
Thread Starter
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Senior User
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 164
Likes: 0
From: Montgomeryville, PA
FICM Sync upon long cranking goes red.
Yes, fuel in upper bowl.
Reached out to a Ford Diesel mechanic I know.
His ideas:
1. Check to see if tach moves during cranking, if it does, it's not a cam sensor issue.
2. HPO leak.
My thoughts, if there's HPO issues, I don't think it would just not start. I think it would start cold, run like crap, and not start hot. And throw a Code somewhere. I think AE must be able to report HPO Pressure. I'll check that when I get home. Batteries are fully charged again so, let the fun being again.
I don't think the 58V FICM voltage is an issue. I'm not the only guy running it. What's the potential issue? It fried ALL the injectors? Not likely.
At work today, I'll report more when I get home tonight.
If I didn't say this earlier, I changed the fuel filters just for good measure.
And THANK YOU to everyone working through this with me.
Yes, fuel in upper bowl.
Reached out to a Ford Diesel mechanic I know.
His ideas:
1. Check to see if tach moves during cranking, if it does, it's not a cam sensor issue.
2. HPO leak.
My thoughts, if there's HPO issues, I don't think it would just not start. I think it would start cold, run like crap, and not start hot. And throw a Code somewhere. I think AE must be able to report HPO Pressure. I'll check that when I get home. Batteries are fully charged again so, let the fun being again.
I don't think the 58V FICM voltage is an issue. I'm not the only guy running it. What's the potential issue? It fried ALL the injectors? Not likely.
At work today, I'll report more when I get home tonight.
If I didn't say this earlier, I changed the fuel filters just for good measure.
And THANK YOU to everyone working through this with me.
Senior User
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 359
Likes: 0
From: Oklahoma
Did you ever check the fan wire harness as suggested by blade35? Do you have a method (gauge) to check fuel pressure? Did you verify that CMP/CKP are in sync (this can be done with AE). With AE you can run an injector buzz test, run this test and listen carefully for each injector to buzz and pay attention to the sound of the buzz from each injector, they should all have the same tone. All 8 will buzz together and then it will run through them individually, 3 times it does this.
Hotshot
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 19,072
Likes: 242
From: Saratoga Springs,UT
Does your AE have a 1 FICM Sync It goes green on a known good FICM
Thread Starter
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Senior User
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 164
Likes: 0
From: Montgomeryville, PA
OK here's what I know so far.
ICP 1300 PSI
FICM 57.2V
Cam Sensor 0 Green
Battery 12V+
My brother's stepson is a diesel mechanic, he says I should see the tach move when cranking, says if it doesn't cam sensor is no good. Can someone crank their diesel and see if the tach moves.
FICM Sync went red with extended cranking.
FWIW Will all this cranking, no smell of diesel at exhaust.
How do i check crank sensor in AE, I didn't see that in the sensor list.
ICP 1300 PSI
FICM 57.2V
Cam Sensor 0 Green
Battery 12V+
My brother's stepson is a diesel mechanic, he says I should see the tach move when cranking, says if it doesn't cam sensor is no good. Can someone crank their diesel and see if the tach moves.
FICM Sync went red with extended cranking.
FWIW Will all this cranking, no smell of diesel at exhaust.
How do i check crank sensor in AE, I didn't see that in the sensor list.
Lead Driver
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 8,180
Likes: 669
From: Scio, OR
My tach doesn't move until a second or so after it starts. I don't think that is a good indicator of either cam or crank sensor operation.
I don't think their are PID's for either the cam or crank operation, other than sync and FICM sync. I'd have to hook up and look them over though, to see for sure.
I might be able to do that in the morning, but I have to get some stuff done and get to town to get ball joints done, so I might not be able to do anything until tomorrow evening.
I don't think their are PID's for either the cam or crank operation, other than sync and FICM sync. I'd have to hook up and look them over though, to see for sure.
I might be able to do that in the morning, but I have to get some stuff done and get to town to get ball joints done, so I might not be able to do anything until tomorrow evening.
Thread Starter
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Senior User
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 164
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From: Montgomeryville, PA
Thanks for checking.
Starting to wonder why I don't have the smell of diesel at exhaust after all this cranking.
Could the ICP be reading false? It's an 05 so the icp is kinda easy to get to. Think it worthwhile to put a mechanical gauge in the ICP port?
Where would I test fuel pressure?
I did check the fan wire harness. It's good.
I did the buzz test, it passed in AE. Not really sure what I'm listening for, but I did hear it buzz.
Starting to wonder why I don't have the smell of diesel at exhaust after all this cranking.
Could the ICP be reading false? It's an 05 so the icp is kinda easy to get to. Think it worthwhile to put a mechanical gauge in the ICP port?
Where would I test fuel pressure?
I did check the fan wire harness. It's good.
I did the buzz test, it passed in AE. Not really sure what I'm listening for, but I did hear it buzz.
Last edited by PADoubleX; Jul 25, 2011 at 10:26 PM. Reason: more thoughts
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Senior User
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 359
Likes: 0
From: Oklahoma
Thanks for checking.
Starting to wonder why I don't have the smell of diesel at exhaust after all this cranking.
Could the ICP be reading false? It's an 05 so the icp is kinda easy to get to. Think it worthwhile to put a mechanical gauge in the ICP port?
Where would I test fuel pressure?
I did check the fan wire harness. It's good.
I did the buzz test, it passed in AE. Not really sure what I'm listening for, but I did hear it buzz.
Starting to wonder why I don't have the smell of diesel at exhaust after all this cranking.
Could the ICP be reading false? It's an 05 so the icp is kinda easy to get to. Think it worthwhile to put a mechanical gauge in the ICP port?
Where would I test fuel pressure?
I did check the fan wire harness. It's good.
I did the buzz test, it passed in AE. Not really sure what I'm listening for, but I did hear it buzz.
Hotshot
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 15,369
Likes: 121
From: Stuttgart, Ar
Fuel pressure test port thread in the top picture fitting size is M12x1.5. Most gauges are 1/8" NPT. Page 30: Fuel Supply System
I'm going to have some more time with AE this morning so I'll see if I can figure out something else on the FICM sync readings that AE gives. There's a lot of stuff I still can't find that I should have and hopefully I'll know more when my tutor calls this morning--LOL.
I'm going to have some more time with AE this morning so I'll see if I can figure out something else on the FICM sync readings that AE gives. There's a lot of stuff I still can't find that I should have and hopefully I'll know more when my tutor calls this morning--LOL.
Senior User
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 359
Likes: 0
From: Oklahoma
Fuel pressure test port thread in the top picture fitting size is M12x1.5. Most gauges are 1/8" NPT. Page 30: Fuel Supply System
I'm going to have some more time with AE this morning so I'll see if I can figure out something else on the FICM sync readings that AE gives. There's a lot of stuff I still can't find that I should have and hopefully I'll know more when my tutor calls this morning--LOL.
I'm going to have some more time with AE this morning so I'll see if I can figure out something else on the FICM sync readings that AE gives. There's a lot of stuff I still can't find that I should have and hopefully I'll know more when my tutor calls this morning--LOL.
talk to ya later this a.m.
Thread Starter
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Senior User
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 164
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From: Montgomeryville, PA
YES!
From embry1123
"Did you verify that CMP/CKP are in sync ?" They are not.
Just got DTC P2617 Crankshaft Position Sensor Circuit Open
Never been so happy to get a code. At least I have a direction to head now.
From embry1123
"Did you verify that CMP/CKP are in sync ?" They are not.
Just got DTC P2617 Crankshaft Position Sensor Circuit Open
Never been so happy to get a code. At least I have a direction to head now.
Hotshot
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 15,369
Likes: 121
From: Stuttgart, Ar
FYI--I had FICM sync and CMP/CKP sync on the live grid with the motor running and the CMP/CKP sync goes on and off all the time however they DO have to be in sync for the motor to start. The FICM sync reads 1 when it's all good. The gauge being in the red % range is because of the way it's scaled not because of a fault.
Lead Driver
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 8,180
Likes: 669
From: Scio, OR
I recall Cheezit saying once that you need sync for the motor to start, but after that it isn't necessary.
As I see it, the crank position sensor is what the engine needs for timing. It's a 60 tooth hall effect sensor with two teeth missing. Since the cam goes around once for every two crank revolutions, the cam sensor is used to let the PCM know which TDC is between which of two possible strokes. Once it knows that, it remembers it and doesn't need the cam sensor anymore.
As I see it, the crank position sensor is what the engine needs for timing. It's a 60 tooth hall effect sensor with two teeth missing. Since the cam goes around once for every two crank revolutions, the cam sensor is used to let the PCM know which TDC is between which of two possible strokes. Once it knows that, it remembers it and doesn't need the cam sensor anymore.
Thread Starter
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Senior User
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 164
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From: Montgomeryville, PA
Waiting on the CPS, in at 3:30 today, I'll install tonight. $52 gamble.
I had FICM sync issues after extended crank. Today I had CMP/CPK out of sync issues, the P2617 DTC.
We'll see what happens tonight.
I had FICM sync issues after extended crank. Today I had CMP/CPK out of sync issues, the P2617 DTC.
We'll see what happens tonight.