Hope it is OK that I have posted this twice, once in the Expedition section, to get a cross section of opinions.

Folks,

We bought a 2007 Expedition EL this past winter, then bought a new travel trailer (4100lb, 25 foot with 520lb hitch weight). We have 6 kids (most under 10). We knew we had to watch the hitch weight capacity of the truck with the kids and gear and for now will be OK. But on our first trip I was amazed at how hard the Expy had to work to tow the trailer (2800rpm to 3000rpm at 55pmh with OD off) and the gas mileage was dismal at 9mph (I think likely evey a little less). The $300 CDN gas bill for a 670km return trip was a shocker (guess it should not have been).

95% of our driving with the Expy is 10 minute drives to town or I use for work and drive about 250km max 2-3 times a week. Question is, would it be worth trading in on a diesel Excursion? We do plan on taking a couple of long haul trips to both the maritimes and British Columbia. The diesel Excursion would out perform the Expy at the gas pumps and on the hills towing, but is it really worth getting such a big rig in the Excursion when for the daily commute, the mileage would be better in the Expy, let alone short duration trips not being that great for a diesel. I wonder though, am I going to blow something in the Expy, even on a short trip, given its performance so far?

Decisions, decisions.
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What kind of mileage do you typically get in the Expy as your daily driver? I think you will find the Ex can compete with that, and stomp the Expy in power for pulling. Would be a no-brainer for me, but obviously I am a little partial to Ex's. Plus, with 6 kids, the added interior room would be nice.

 

You probably cannot justify a diesel Excursion on economics. I have a diesel and absolutely love the pulling power. We tow a really big trailer (10,500 lb) and have logged many cross-country trips with this rig.

However, 6.0L diesel engines are very finicky and require high expense maintenance. The fuel savings will not overcome these expenses.

With 6 kids, though, you may soon be shopping for an even bigger trailer(?). You may want the diesel Excursion for the increased pulling power.

 

PSMike--

By the way, we recently returned from Canada. We entered at Niagara Falls, Ontario and drove up around the north side of Lake Huron. Spent a few nights enjoying the weather and beautiful scenery. We came back into the U.S. through Sault Ste. Marie and spent a few nights at Mackinaw City, Michigan.

We are now 'enjoying' >100F days in Oklahoma. I'll try to remember these days when the north wind howls. LOL.

In Canada, we did note that diesel is taxed a little bit less outrageously than gasoline. It was still about $1.30 CDN per LITER (about $4.92/US gallon). Ouch.

Lower speed limits on the TC (Trans Canada) and light winds allowed us to tow this overall load of 19,000 lb with a fuel economy of 10.5 mpg. We unhitched in Thessalon, Ontario for some touring. Keeping it below 100 kph (62 mph) allowed us to average 17 mpg while sight-seeing. My normal commutes around Tulsa give me about 13-14 mpg. I think my fuel economy numbers are fairly typical for 6.0L owners.

 

I average more than 17, I am typically around 18 to19.5 but I try to use my Ex for highway runs only, we have other cars for the daily work.

 

You get the mileage based on driving habits and pulling. I drive mine like I stole t typically. 13.5-15, tops. If i keep my foot out, I've got up to 18, but it ain't my style. Pulling my 4800 lb boat, don't even want to track it. JK, don't do long enough trips to know, I would think in the 12 range.

 

Glad you made the switch and welcome to the King Of SUV's we are Proud to have you aboard. Got any Pics of the KING?

 

The gas Expy will get 14-15 around town and 17-20 on the highway. I only got rid of mine since I got the bigger boat and needed the towing capacity. It was a great truck and actually pulled the Sea Ray home from the dealer - 5 hour trip and did really well with the 6spd trans. Loading up the truck with passengers, cargo and then a trailer will get you bad mileage - 8-9 is about right for a gasser with a load behind it. I used to get 12 towing the race car with a light load and just the car on the trailer but that was not the norm. The Expy rides better and has a better feature set (still miss the AC seats and power liftgate)!

Do some research on the diesel engines offered in the Ex - the 7.3 is fantastic if you can find one in good shape and low mileage. The 6.0 has its fair share of issues - some are extremely expensive to resolve. Good luck with your decision.

 

Go diesel Excursion ! You will never look back

 

Plus we will like having you here on the Excursion forum !

 

I haven't been disappointed yet with our excursion. Our 6.0 did cost a few bucks in EGR and oil cooler maintenance after a year of ownership but I read plenty about it prior to the purchase and I was prepared. It's impossible to my wife to pack light so the Excursion provides all the room we need for the kids, dogs, and luggage. The pulling power and ride comfort can't be matched in my opinion. The excursion is bumpy without a load but once you hook up a few thousand pounds it's smooth as can be.

Agree with the previous posters that economics will not support the switch although your costs at the pump will probably decrease.

Good luck with your decision!

 

4100 pounds towing is definitely not the type of weight that requires an Excursion! Just trying to shoot straight with you. As far as 3000 rpms, I hit that towing with my Diesel 6.0 on the hills regularly and I even saw 8-9 mpgs in the hills with my Diesel. I just don't want you to think that an Excursion is a night and day difference vs. your Expedition when your towing 4K weights. A V10 towing that same weight will most likely get 9mpgs, a Diesel may get 10-12 mpgs. A Diesel won't even know your trailer is back there most likely, but jeez 4100 pounds should be an easy tow for a 5.4? Seem like overkill for such a light trailer setup? Have you actually weighed your trailer fully loaded on a scale? Maybe it's heavier that your thinking it is while fully loaded? I have 5 kids and I know we load our trailer down with so much crap when we travel, shoot you could be at 5100 or even 6K who knows? But, your 5.4 should handle 4100 with no problem!

 

i know i towed almost 6k with my '98 230HP 5.4 expedition a few weeks ago and it was great. put your foot down and go, dont mind the RPMs they do what they need to.

 

PSMike - I have a 98 expedition with the 5.4, 280k on the clock, love the size of the vehicle, turning etc for our family of 4 its served us well since purchasing it with 108k in 2003. Still runs but I couldn't justify for the 6th year in a row the fixes it sorely needs which includes a new motor(or at least some serious doctor work to find the leaking oil and coolant), exhaust, and all the minor don't have to but should's. It towed our trailer ok when it had 108k on it but once I hit 200k it really went down hill(no pun intended).

So I've searched for about 6 months to find the excursion I could afford and bought it on July 8th. A 2004 with 170k on a 6.0L. I drove it ~200 miles home without reseting the overhead meter (which read 9.3) and got 17.7 mpg, I turned around 2 days later and dropped the trailer on it ( ~5500 pnds ) and towed it ~70 miles to camp. 13.3 towing. I always knew diesels were better for this but never got to drive one while towing.... UNREAL! Got up to and held highway speeds so much better and got ~7 better mpg than the 5.4 did.

During the middle of the week I had to run home for a day at work and got 19.1 mpg going back.

The 13.3 was measured the others were on the accuracy meter overhead but after seeing the towing numbers, I'm inclined to believe they are pretty close.

I'm still a little nervous about the 6.0, you should be with any used vehicle, but even with all the hype on them, quite a few I talked to came back and said I've maintained mine, ran it within the specifications of the vehicle and haven't had any major issues.

To meet the needs you describe I would not hesitate to buy a excursion after the last week. If you read these forums you will pick up on all the little idiosyncrasies of the excursions (not all engine related) and you'll be prepared for it.

The only down fall is that the low mileage ex's are still on the market for huge money, I've watched those not get sold for 6 months now, not sure if they are just that hard into them or think they'll still get the big dollars on a 7-8 year old vehicle thats just sat around.

--Mike

 

Reps to both you guys for shooting straight on MPG's...I've seen too many people on here ask the diesel "mpg" question and get some super high number...so they go out and buy a PSD only to find that their results vary from the internet...go figure...so a big THANKS to both of you guys for your straight shooting.

I've spent more than a few nights in campgrounds chewing the fat around the camp fire with PSD owners...and in person...I get drastically different mpg numbers over what I read on the net...

Sure a PSD gets better mpgs over a gasser...but not some of the crazy numbers I've seen.

The 6.OH is a finicky motor (just search some of scottman's posts on how much money he spent on his before dumping it for an 8.1L Burb!) and folks that tend to tune them are the ones that seem to be more prone to issues down the road...the 6.OH is not the most robust...so those that leave the motor as Ford/Navistar shipped it are those that tend to report minimal issues...the early 2003's and 2004's tended to have the most issues with turbo's until that was modified with coated vanes.

As far as needing a PSD or V10 for power...well...neither is needed IMO for the current trailer.

As far as 2800-3000 RPM's being defined as "working hard"...well today's modern OHC motors are designed to run at higher RPM's to make power...that's simply where the power band is...it is DIFFERENT than a diesel...the gasser makes power at higher RPM's and the diesel makes power at lower RPM's...NEITHER are struggling or working hard when they turn RPM's to make power...

Simply going to a strong more powerful motor will change how many RPM's that are turned while working...but IMO the RPM's you are turning don't sound like the motor is working hard...it is simply WORKING!

I've seen 4000-4500 RPM's climbing 11,000' Rocky Mountain passes towing 9000#'s...the V10 makes power clear up there so why not use it?...

I'm not sure you would ever recover the loss on your current Expy or the added outlay for the Ex which will be OLDER than your current vehicle but likely cost you MORE...

Sure the Ex is a more "stout" vehicle...but the Expy EL has the advantage of a smoother more refined daily ride and has the advantage of the extra gear(s) in the transmission.

All in all...if it were my money (which it isn't) and while I'd love to see you join the Ex family...I think your Expy is doing what it should be doing.

Good luck with your decisions.

Joe.