It was precipitates, but only 1 went into it. The other two did not.

 

I agree 100%.If this info was available when I deleted my cooler on the 350 I would have left it in place.The Ex still has the EGR cooler and as long as I own the truck it will keep the cooler.

 

I acknowledge that I am not nearly as smart as you, with regards to engine mechanics, but one thing that stands out for me is the principal of surface to volume ratios. When you consider the amount of coolant within the passages of the egr cooler, in relation to the amount of surface area of the material surrounding the coolant being subjected to extreme heat, as opposed to the relatively lower surface to volume ratio of the coolant within the cylinder head... It seems to me that you will have a significantly greater amount of coolant cooked in a much shorter time in the egr cooler vise cylinder heads due to the relatively high percentage exposed to the surface adjacent to the egr cooler passage walls. In the cylinder heads there is a deeper volume of coolant, in relation to the surface area, which allows for dissipation and absorbtion of heat. IMO, you will need to flush, drain and replace coolant in either case. But it seems it would be needed more often, by far, with a functioning egr cooler.
Does this make sense? If not, I'll try to explain it a little better on a follow up post. Kind of in a hurry to go right now so I can't proof read my post.

Edited for clarification.

 

I agree 100%....no matter what people say.....1000*F+ flowing through a heat exchanger that flows coolant/water through tubes opposite flow of EGT's in excess of 1000*....even as a closed system that raises boiling points does not make sense to me....I don't give a ***** how blue in the face people defend or try and justify it it is a stupida$$ design and I want no part of it.

that is just me...to each his own

 

Here is the kicker.

I flow 40% more fuel than 90% of the 6.0 owning population. I haul ~16k on a regular basis. Put down over 500HP at the rear wheels. My cruising ECT/EOT/TFT temperatures are hotter than someone with a stock setup, however, not only do a run a stock EGR/Oil Cooler setup, but I have the exact same componants that came with my truck when it had 20 miles on it. It now has 248+K miles on it. It has been putting down over 500 ponies since it had 78k.

Granted, I'm perhaps one of the few, if not only, one that is modified to that extent and still running the stock coolers, but everyone that has taken the pro-EGR delete stance, my experience should not exist. Unless there is something else going on. I flush my coolant every 100k, I do not run a coolant filter nor do I plan too.

If the EGR system is as bad as everyone says it is, how can my experience exist? We are talking about something that even a blind squirrel finding nuts has a better chance of happening. Yes as far as I know I'm a statistic of one, however, it only takes one to disprove the rule. And I say I'm a statistic of one, because I'm willing to bet that most people wouldn't keep their emissions equipment if they are running modified injectors and a bigger turbo.

Hell, I've never once cleaned the EGR valve. The only cleaning it would get is by my working the truck. Think of everything that is stacked up against me. How does one reconcile everything? To add to that, while people think that the EGR coolers are crap, they think that the 03 and 04 coolers are less crappy then the later ones. I guess which one I have? One of the ones from the crappier years. The hits just keep on coming.

The way I see it is there is one of 3 scenerios going on:

1. I'm full of crap and lying out of my teeth about my truck and what it can or can't do (thankfully both Bean from Bean's Diesel, and Matt at Spartan Diesel can back me up on this, so I do have other sources to verify me). No, I'm not saying anyone was saying this, but it was a possible scenerio that I had to acknowledge.

2. I'm one of the luckiests SOBs out there. Boy I wish that this would apply to the lotto purchases I do.

or

3. There is something going on here and it isn't as straightforward as people think it is.

 

I'd sure like to know what this something is. Until someone nails it down and identifies it, I will maintain my theory as my personal belief. It is what makes the most sense to me. If someone actually comes up with something concrete as to the source of all the crud clogging oil coolers other than the theory I described and I am proven wrong, I will again flow coolant through that WART without concern for consequences. Until then, well, lets just say I'll do what I can, to try to avoid having to change oil coolers any more than necessary.

 

Thing is, don't think that the lack of proof against your theory is proof that your theory is correct. It might be, but lack of evidence against it isn't proof that it's true.

I ask you, how does your theory explain my experience? If I'm understanding your theory correctly, my experience should not have happened at all. The baseline of all my temperatures is hotter than of a stock or just tuned truck.

That would mean that my coolant, which is already hotter due to my running a more aggressive truck, is going around that Cooler already hotter and with hotter EGTs to boot. After Almost 200k of being like that, my EGR cooler should have crapped out if not by stock standards certainly due to my running moderately modified parts. Why hasn't it?

 

I know the answer TEX.....your truck was the only one that was not built by americans....it was a japanese transplant made by toyota. The rest of ours were built on a Friday after lunch.

 

Just before a holiday weekend.

 

HAHAHA ...I forgot that part!

 

Hmmm I debated whether to chime in here or not but hell I will give my 2 cents.

I do agree the EGR Cooler/Oil cooler setup is about as STUPID as it get's. I am more of a weekend mechanic but the pictures of the passages ways speaks volumes to me. It also speaks volumes to me the "lack" of thought involved in the coolant flow. One single point of failure can take the whole system down in critical components. Oil cooler is plugged, there goes the egr cooler, and god knows what else. I understand the need for the system for EPA standards but it would have made more sense to not have them in series (from a coolant flow perspective). It does not take a rocket scientist to see that.

I don't think removing the EGR from the truck fixes squat. For me it's also not an option because of So Cal not worth the fine. We are also running 1 EGR valve in our 6.0L...has anyone taken a look at Chevy, Dodge or our new 6.7L? I know they have more then 1 in their systems and if the EGR was truely the issue shouldn't they have more issues then us? Are they? This is also why I don't believe "ITS" the culprit but rather part of a chain of bad design decisions.

Forgetting about the coolant for a moment.. let me throw this up at you...

If our beloved oil cooler was in it's own closed system separate from the trucks normal system do you think we would have as many issues? I would bet it would be alot fewer then what we are seeing if not almost non existant.

If they simply widened the passages ways and kept them from operating in series from a coolant flow perspective the failure rate would I am sure drop quite a bit?

Why is a coolant filter not part of the warranty repair? What costs us 100 bucks is probably 50 or less for them in that consumption of volume. It may not prevent the failure but it sure could help "slow" it down.

Now back to the coolant itself....maybe the real culprit is Ford brand of coolant? The rest are casualties of war if you will. The coolant being exposed to 1000 degrees or better whether in the cylinder walls or egr cooler can't be good. If it's precipatiing or turning to a goo because of flash boiling or excessive temps coupled with tiny passages ways equals blockage and ultimately failure.

To me fix the passage ways (more flow and faster), change the flow pattern (not in series), and/or go back to what is tried and true if all else fails (Oil cooler is air cooled up front like the old days). Bullet Proof Diesel has both of those covered unfortunately pricey as hell. The other option is a coolant filter which really should be upgrade #1 IMHO. Catch the casting sand and crap floating in it now before it's too late. Finally is the Gold coolant really doing us justice?

Tex I envy you sir! I agree with alot of what you said and even in my own arguement your truck shoots holes in. Maybe your the lucky one I don't know but there is logic in your comments and your trucks performance is hard to argue with. Wanna trade!?

For me when I can afford it all...

Coolant filter
BPD EGR Cooler
BPD Oil Cooler

Pit

Turbo Replaced ~33k
Oil Cooler/Egr Cooler Replacement ~55K
Front Locking hubs Replaced ~ 82K
FICM Failure ~ 82k
Fuel Gauge Sending Units (3 of them) sprinkled through those repairs.
All warranty TG!

Truck has 83K on it now.

 

ok well i tore into my truck before i started buying alot of parts and am glad that i did. when i first pulled my egr valve it looked good light covering of soft black soot, next came the turbo i haven't opened that up yet to clean it so idk what kind of condition it is in, when the intake manifold came off there is a thick layer of moist soot in almost all of the heads i guess thats called caking? finally the egr cooler i pulled it out and its round with garret stamped on it and it looks like one of the bullet proof or sinister coolers with the small tubes running through it there was water where water is supposed to be and a light cover of soft soot where the exaust runs through it. ill have it pressure tested on mon. so now the BIG question why am i losing coolant out of the degas bottle and lacking so much power?

 

Head gasket?

 

thats what im afraid of. its going to be an in the truck job now so once again the battle continues

 

how was your ect vs eot spread

even though your egr cooler didnt leak coolant into the intake if the oil cooler is plugged not giving the egr cooler enough coolant the egr cooler would flash boil what it did get and cause excessive coolant pressure causing the puke [ this may or maynot be your problem ]

if I pulled out my egr valve out and found the chamber was dry no coolant a cylinder compression test would be next

a compression test would verify a bad head gasket or sreched bolts cracked head and so on

with the upgraded parts on it looks like someone tried to fix it does the oil cooler cover look clean like its been changed