So what's the.consensus on fuel with stage 2? Think my stock system with the in tank mods and lift pump will support that? I talked with jody's helper who suggested that i wouldn't get the full benefit with what i have.

 

thats another reason to stay small....might have to upgrade your HPOP and possibly your fuel system. I guess it would depend on how hot of a tune you are wanting to run.

 

I'm running a stock fuel system with my 238cc/100% stix, except for the DFA RR, and it fuels fine. There are varying degrees of both stage 1 and stage 2 injectors, I've seen "stage 2" sticks up to 200cc. I've seen "stage 1" sticks at 175cc (Swamps). So, not all stage 1 or 2 injectors are equal. Stage 2s will get you to about 400rwhp, or a little more depending on injector, tuning, & turbo. I remember Ryan getting about 435 out of his Hypermax 200cc stage 2s with a van turbo & Tony's tunes, so smaller stage 2s (more common 160 or 175cc) will get you 375-400ish.

 

I don't think you'd have fuel issues with stage 2's with a stock setup, but the money would be well spent to put on some sort of regulated return, it would definitely be beneficial with or without new injectors.

The HPOP could be an issue, if you have a weak one. But going with single shot injectors would only help. For $100 Joey at Terminator could work his magic on it and make it capable of handling new injectors. I upgraded to 17*from a junkyard ("was" an e99 w/15*) and it holds up well with my 2's. It seems to be a strong HPOP compared to some of the numbers I've seen from other people.

 

Thanks guys, this really helps. I either have some ADD or im a little bipolar cause im just not sure if i should even do sticks and a turbo, etc. Keep going back and forth, and im also considering getting a bts trans before mine goes, it has 190,000 on it. My wife would rather me.do the trans for reliability and just do joeys hpop to replace my weak one and be happy with what i've got. She's a smart girl, but her way doesn't sound as much fun lol.

 

I haven't made 'big' HP yet, but I have played with the fuel system ALOT.

IMHO, regulated return is a waste of time and a severe compromise over your stock fuel system. (Notice FORD didn't put any rubber hoses under the hood? ) Not trying to debate this - just sharing an (often unpopular) opinion. The bottom line is the fittings in the head are 1/8" NPT and they have an even more restrictive CV/adapter screwed into it. Additionally, the stock fuel pump is rated for 110PSI and flows probably 10x the volume our trucks can consume - especially deadheaded.

After having (finally) done the in-tank mods, I am a firm believer in it. My tank was clean, but those screens were JAM FULL of stuff. I believe many people who have fuel pressure issues likely have this problem. (you can fix this for same price as a case of beer )

 

PMS is a vicious sickness! Even though I'm a young guy and like stuff like this, I'm kinda tired of working on my truck, it just keeps snowballing. I got it to place where I'm extremely happy with it's performance and think I'll call it quits for power-adders. Plus, I don't think my old motor will take much more!

If you want to change one thing, then something else needs changed or improved, then it's another thing, it's hard to quit because you want the best performance out of products you have. It just get's expensive!

I love my setup and reccomend something like it to those that are looking to tow. But I think your wife may be right that your money would be better spent on a trans... yes, I did just agree with your wife...

 

Jason, you lost me on the "non benefits" of a RR?? What is being compromised when it is added?

 

Amen Brother, it never ends.... well, i am saving for a BTS, and maybe new bumpers....Damn PMS

 

You said it well. But we can't race anymore if you agree with my wife, or i'll be right back here again next year.

 

We can't race... but our wives can!! Then she'll be the one wanting newer, bigger, better injectors, turbo, you name it!!

 

Nice, that was a lot of fun for her. Too bad she didn't care she got.smoked.

 

Long-term reliability.

Rubber fuel hoses under the hood aren't as durable as factory steel lines and the driver-side test port puts that hose VERY close to the up-pipe which hits 1200*+ (over and over again). One of these hoses will fail at the WORST POSSIBLE moment - if it ever does.

I just think its a silly compromise with little real world benefit. Cackle? Thats how it started, and I bet you can't find a single engine that was damaged by 'cackle'. Yes, trapped air in the fuel rails WILL make engine louder, but damage is not likely even if somehow ALL of that air went to one injector at one time... This fuel system is inherently very tolerant of air.

The FRx is in the same category. I'm not saying names or vendors, but I know someone who lost a hose on FRx and sprayed 10gals of diesel under the hood just a few weeks ago.

The problem is basic human nature. When we invest our time and money in something - we tend to justify it to ourselves, then defend that decision to others. Combine that with the 'culture' of a particular forum and you have a fad that many people follow without truly understanding how and how/why it came to be.

How many people have a zoodad mod??? (yes, I did it too...) I don't think anyone can prove there is ANY benefit for this, but since its FREE and it sounds like a good idea - it was a first mod for many of us.

I really don't want to step on anyones toes. I have friends with these mods and I don't think they (the mods) are stupid - its just stuff I decided NOT to do!

 

Here's the problem with that logic: I've NEVER lost a fuel hose, but I HAVE lost a couple Parker Sleeves that caused me leaks. And *those* are in the stock lines. Also, you're forgetting that the RR kits replace the stock orifice adapters in the heads with new non-restrictive ones. So that is a non issue...

 

I think the biggest benefit of a RR is that ability to return unused fuel and air back to the tank (mostly air), instead of pushing it through the injectors. I think the PSD is one of the very few diesels that DOESN'T have some sore of fuel return system. Pretty much all the big rigs on the road have them, the few that I have do, all our farm equipment with a diesel engine have a fuel return of some sort.

If you're looking for long-term reliability, isn't it in your best interest to remove as much air form the system as possible, instead of forcing it through injectors where it can do harm?



I'd have to disagree with that statement, assume it's referring to the "culture" here. I would say it's the complete opposite. Everything here is explained with utmost detail in words and pictures; how it works, why it's done, the best way to do it. If we were reccomending to people to go buy Banks or Superchips products because their adds make the best/highest claims, then ya, you'd be correct. But everything here that most of us reccomend has been tried and proven one way or the other. If you've tried a RR and it didn't work for you, then great, share your info. But using theory doesn't get too far with most of us, or at least me.