Go Back   Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums > Diesel > Bio-diesel, Propane & Alternative Diesel Engine Fuels
Sign in using an external account
Register Forgot Password?


Welcome to Ford-Trucks Forums!
Welcome to Ford-Trucks.com.

You are currently viewing our forums as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join the Ford-Trucks Forums community today!





 
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 08-06-2010, 08:14 PM
natew natew is offline
Senior User
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 132
natew is starting off with a positive reputation.
1996 powerstroke fuel lines?

My father just bought F250 Powerstroke. Does his truck have viton fuel lines? Will he need do to anything to run B100??


Thanks
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 08-09-2010, 11:57 AM
TurnerBioDiesel's Avatar
TurnerBioDiesel TurnerBioDiesel is offline
Junior User
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Chippewa Falls
Posts: 93
TurnerBioDiesel is starting off with a positive reputation.
I dont know if there viton but most cars and trucks 1996 and over have compatable lines. Run Bio and just check them after1 or 2 thousand mi. See if they are sweating.
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 08-09-2010, 02:32 PM
zhilton's Avatar
zhilton zhilton is offline
Postmaster
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Ft. Smith, AR
Posts: 4,318
zhilton is a name known to allzhilton is a name known to allzhilton is a name known to allzhilton is a name known to allzhilton is a name known to allzhilton is a name known to all
It seems like I read somewhere that Ford switched to synthetic rubber lines around '93 or '94. But I can't swear on that. At 15 years old...what do you have to lose if the fuel lines start to leak? They're reaching the end of their expected life anyway. But that's just my twisted way of thinking.
__________________
FTE Arkansas chapter member
1972 Ranchero GT (351C CobraJet intake)
2001 Explorer XLT 2WD
2004 F250 6.0L 2WD CC "Pavement Princess"
2007 Monaco Starwood SL 31BHD
2012 Focus SEL (Wife's ride)
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 08-12-2010, 03:07 PM
SkySkiJason's Avatar
SkySkiJason SkySkiJason is offline
Postmaster
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: N.GA Mountains
Posts: 3,655
SkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant future
Quote:
Originally Posted by zhilton View Post
...what do you have to lose if the fuel lines start to leak? They're reaching the end of their expected life anyway. But that's just my twisted way of thinking.
Its just 60psi of HOT, FLAMMABLE liquid spraying under the hood, don't worry! It will never fail 1/2 way up a bridge or on your way to the airport with mother-n-law, in the rain...

At 60psi, it'll go from sweating to spraying in a hurry! These ain't no IDI 'return lines'!

That said, it should be fine. AFAIK, ALL high-pressure fuel line is viton-lined, aka OK for B-100.

Be sure to use 30R9 'fuel injection hose' or similar if you decide to replace any of it. I used ptfe (teflon)-lined SS braided hose w/JIC swivel ends for all the fuel lines under the hood on my junk. You can do this style of hose DIY from discounthydraulichose.com - they also carry all the adapters, etc to get from JIC to NPT fittings on truck...
__________________
2001 F350 CC flatbed - headstuds, AC codes, T4/S366, custom leather interior, '07 facelift, big honkin bumper, 180k miles on DIY veggie conversion and a few other things...
2000 Excursion, Limited, 4x4, BTS trans, 120k on veggie! - wrecked spring 2013 - RIP
veggiegarage.com authorized installer
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 08-16-2010, 02:33 PM
whiteaddiction whiteaddiction is offline
Senior User
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 123
whiteaddiction is starting off with a positive reputation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SkySkiJason View Post
Its just 60psi of HOT, FLAMMABLE liquid spraying under the hood, don't worry! It will never fail 1/2 way up a bridge or on your way to the airport with mother-n-law, in the rain...

At 60psi, it'll go from sweating to spraying in a hurry! These ain't no IDI 'return lines'!

That said, it should be fine. AFAIK, ALL high-pressure fuel line is viton-lined, aka OK for B-100.

Be sure to use 30R9 'fuel injection hose' or similar if you decide to replace any of it. I used ptfe (teflon)-lined SS braided hose w/JIC swivel ends for all the fuel lines under the hood on my junk. You can do this style of hose DIY from discounthydraulichose.com - they also carry all the adapters, etc to get from JIC to NPT fittings on truck...

First of all Bio is not flammable, If your making it right. And second, I have had my 95 f250 running on Bio for 2 years and no problems with fuel lines or anything else for that matter.
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 08-20-2010, 09:15 PM
SkySkiJason's Avatar
SkySkiJason SkySkiJason is offline
Postmaster
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: N.GA Mountains
Posts: 3,655
SkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant future
Quote:
Originally Posted by whiteaddiction View Post
First of all Bio is not flammable, If your making it right.
Really?? Depending on the feed stock, it may have a higher flash point than dead dinosaur juice (diesel) - but it will certainly make the fire hotter if ya spray some B100 on it. A 1200*F exhaust manifold will be well above ignition temperature of any bio-d - no matter how ya make it! Please be careful.

Luckily, there is nothing to fear. The factory fuel lines should last as long as they would have - as long as you never allow bio-d on the OUTSIDE of them. That goes for heater hoses, vacuum lines and everything else made of rubber under the hood.

On a side note, there is finally a fuel stabilizer for VO-based fuels. This stuff should extend the life of VO and B100, preventing oxidative polymerization that leads to short filter life and build-up in fuel tank, lines and even engine heads/injectors. http://www.frybrid.com/vegstable.htm
__________________
2001 F350 CC flatbed - headstuds, AC codes, T4/S366, custom leather interior, '07 facelift, big honkin bumper, 180k miles on DIY veggie conversion and a few other things...
2000 Excursion, Limited, 4x4, BTS trans, 120k on veggie! - wrecked spring 2013 - RIP
veggiegarage.com authorized installer
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 08-23-2010, 08:44 AM
davidpa28140 davidpa28140 is offline
Freshman User
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Altoona PA
Posts: 44
davidpa28140 is starting off with a positive reputation.
I think the lines to and from the tank will be fine, but the fuel lines that sit in the engine valley(next to the turbo) are sweating on my 97 powerstroke, I plan on replacing them when I find a kit to do so. I have put about 4000 miles on B-100 in this truck, my other I upgraded my other vehicles to viton hose and they have been trouble free.
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 08-24-2010, 09:49 PM
SkySkiJason's Avatar
SkySkiJason SkySkiJason is offline
Postmaster
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: N.GA Mountains
Posts: 3,655
SkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant future
I just dropped my diesel tank to repair a leak and investigate poor fuel pressure and discovered the factory coating/lining is dissolved and falling off. I stopped using B100 after 1.5 yrs (45k miles?) because I was having fuel stability issues - due to the fact that a tank of diesel/B100 lasts me a loooong time since I only use it to start-up/shut-down. In addition to polymerized B100, I was finding this shiny, gritty stuff in my factory fuel filter - now I know it was the tank lining. I removed handfulls of it from the tank today and the screens/filter thingys in the tank were fubar. I took pics if anyone cares.

B100 was waaaay more trouble than it was worth to me - and I was making it with a BioPro 190! SVO is sooooo much easier and cheaper. IMHO, the best thing to leave in these HOT, carbon steel heads overnite is diesel. Sorry for the hijack.
__________________
2001 F350 CC flatbed - headstuds, AC codes, T4/S366, custom leather interior, '07 facelift, big honkin bumper, 180k miles on DIY veggie conversion and a few other things...
2000 Excursion, Limited, 4x4, BTS trans, 120k on veggie! - wrecked spring 2013 - RIP
veggiegarage.com authorized installer
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 10-01-2010, 05:57 PM
Bounds-Electric's Avatar
Bounds-Electric Bounds-Electric is offline
FORD USER
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: EARSTERN SHORE OF MD.
Posts: 376
Bounds-Electric is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
flash point
deisel 150*f
biodeisel 450*f

I have been running bio in my 1997 7.3 for 5 years no problems.
__________________
2008 F-350 XLT Lariat King Ranch DRW 4x4
(Truck 225,500 miles )(New Motor at 127,000 miles)
2001 F-350 XLT Lariat DRW 4x4 (232,650 miles) Totaled
1997 F-250 XLT Lariat 4x4 (210,500 miles)
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 10-02-2010, 06:27 AM
SkySkiJason's Avatar
SkySkiJason SkySkiJason is offline
Postmaster
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: N.GA Mountains
Posts: 3,655
SkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant future
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bounds-Electric View Post
flash point
deisel 150*f
biodeisel 450*f

I have been running bio in my 1997 7.3 for 5 years no problems.
actually, FP of diesel is anywhere from 125*-240*F and the B100 I've tested was in the 240*-250* range... semantics really - you prove the point the fuel lines are up to the task! The coating in my fuel tank however...

Click the image to open in full size.
Click the image to open in full size.
Click the image to open in full size.

This was the result of 1.5yrs of B100 - probably about 60-70k miles??? However, I also burn SVO in a separate fuel system, so my tanks of B100 lasted a looooong time (I got 10k miles out of a single tank once...). After all of this happened, I just put good ole dead dinosaur fuel in the diesel tank.
__________________
2001 F350 CC flatbed - headstuds, AC codes, T4/S366, custom leather interior, '07 facelift, big honkin bumper, 180k miles on DIY veggie conversion and a few other things...
2000 Excursion, Limited, 4x4, BTS trans, 120k on veggie! - wrecked spring 2013 - RIP
veggiegarage.com authorized installer
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 10-02-2010, 08:29 AM
Bounds-Electric's Avatar
Bounds-Electric Bounds-Electric is offline
FORD USER
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: EARSTERN SHORE OF MD.
Posts: 376
Bounds-Electric is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
Was that a new tank when you first put b-100 in it. If it was I would not burn that b-100. I would guess old tank and I would say that what was left behind from deisel fuel, bio cleans that out. I also would say it depends on what kind of bio you are burning!
__________________
2008 F-350 XLT Lariat King Ranch DRW 4x4
(Truck 225,500 miles )(New Motor at 127,000 miles)
2001 F-350 XLT Lariat DRW 4x4 (232,650 miles) Totaled
1997 F-250 XLT Lariat 4x4 (210,500 miles)
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 10-02-2010, 10:01 AM
SkySkiJason's Avatar
SkySkiJason SkySkiJason is offline
Postmaster
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: N.GA Mountains
Posts: 3,655
SkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant futureSkySkiJason has a brilliant future
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bounds-Electric View Post
Was that a new tank when you first put b-100 in it. If it was I would not burn that b-100. I would guess old tank and I would say that what was left behind from deisel fuel, bio cleans that out. I also would say it depends on what kind of bio you are burning!
No, truck had over 200k miles when I first used bio-d. Yes, there was some minor 'crud' that was cleaned out during the first few tanks - but I never did plug a filter, just turned them black. I have a fuel pressure gauge, so its easy to see filter performance.

What may be difficult to see in the pics is the coating (gray stuff) is SOFT and wipes off the inside of the tank EASILY. This 'stuff' along with polymerized B100 is what you see in the screens inside the mixing chamber. My only solution here will be to remove the existing coating and have the tank re-sealed/coated.

I totally agree there is a HUGE variation in bio-d, from feedstock to processing - many things affect the characteristics of the 'fuel' we make. All I can say is we use a BioPro 190 which uses a acid/base esterification/transesterification reaction which produces higher yields (more efficient reaction) and a triple wash water washing to ensure no soaps, methanol or other chems are present in the finished fuel. We also performed 27/3 test, etc on every batch we make.

The fact remains - and the PROBLEM is, the stability if B100 is poor (without anti-chelating agents and anti-oxidants). The fact is, VO begins to degrade the moment it is squeezed out of the plant. The producers add enough BHT and citric acid to provide an acceptable life in the fryer, but beyond that all bets are off. The variations in feed stock include but are not limited to: the type of oil (PHO, canola, soy, rice oil, etc), the amount of time spent in the fryer (heat cycles), the type of food cooked in the oil, what metals the WVO was exposed to after the fryer (copper, carbon steel?), the type of pump used for collection, amount of UV exposure, etc, etc...

Polymerization is actually a fairly slow chemical reaction that starts LOOOOOOONG before you ever see any 'chicken skin'. This reaction is expedited by a few things including time, heat and exposure to oxygen and oxidants (primarily copper and carbon steel). You don't need all of these 'ingredients' enough of any single one can cause the reaction, but the more of any you have - the faster the reaction takes place.

The petroleum industry has gotten alot better at fuel stabilty with dino-fuels. I'm not that old and I can remember if ya left gas in a dirt bike or lawnmower over the winter, the varnish in carbs, etc was brutal!! The fact is, they have gotten better at 'stabilizing' these fuels - but these 'biofuels' are a whole new ballgame. In fact, currently no bio-d for sale 'at the pump' still meets the ASTM standards for 'stability'!!! This is largely why no OEM will recommend over B5 blends.

Anyway, I'm the first one to admit I ain't tooo brite!! I don't think that running B100 will ensure you get the results I did, in fact I'm sure the extended amounts of time the B100 was in my tank largely contributed to my problems. I would still recommend anyone using WVO for fuel learn about polymerization and use their fuel as soon as possible after making it. VO/B100 stabilizers like Vegstable or maybe BioExtend 30 are also a good insurance policy against long-term problems.
__________________
2001 F350 CC flatbed - headstuds, AC codes, T4/S366, custom leather interior, '07 facelift, big honkin bumper, 180k miles on DIY veggie conversion and a few other things...
2000 Excursion, Limited, 4x4, BTS trans, 120k on veggie! - wrecked spring 2013 - RIP
veggiegarage.com authorized installer
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 10-02-2010, 05:51 PM
Bounds-Electric's Avatar
Bounds-Electric Bounds-Electric is offline
FORD USER
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: EARSTERN SHORE OF MD.
Posts: 376
Bounds-Electric is gaining momentum as a positive member of FTE.
I have dropped 2 tanks (97 f-250 7.3)(2001 f-350 7.3) over the last year due to failed fuel gauge senders, might be bio related. One tank (2008 f-350 6.4) to shorten drop tube. Tanks were clean as new tank. I first had bio made from linseed oil, then soybean oil, now it is chicken fat. I get all my fuel from a oil company that makes b-99,b-50,b-20, b-10,. All they sell is b-10, b-20 other(b-99,b-50) is for their use and mine, (b-99 is $4.00 )(b-50 $3.75 )(b-20 is $3.24) I changed to b-50 today, will change 3 to 4 weeks to b-20 for all winter! I have found filters are the main thing for running bio!
__________________
2008 F-350 XLT Lariat King Ranch DRW 4x4
(Truck 225,500 miles )(New Motor at 127,000 miles)
2001 F-350 XLT Lariat DRW 4x4 (232,650 miles) Totaled
1997 F-250 XLT Lariat 4x4 (210,500 miles)
Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2010, 05:51 PM
Reply

Go Back   Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums > Diesel > Bio-diesel, Propane & Alternative Diesel Engine Fuels

Tags
1996, 250, 73, braided, f250, f350, ford, fuel, line, lines, powerstroke, pressure, return, steel, truck

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On
Forum Jump



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:59 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Advertising - Terms of Use - Privacy Statement - Jobs
This forum is owned and operated by Internet Brands, Inc., a Delaware corporation. It is not authorized or endorsed by the Ford Motor Company and is not affiliated with the Ford Motor Company or its related companies in any way. FordŽ is a registered trademark of the Ford Motor Company.

vbulletin Admin Backup