Early ICP in a late year model engine: Any benefits?? - Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums



6.0L Power Stroke Diesel 2003 - 2007 F250, F350 pickup and F350+ Cab Chassis, 2003 - 2005 Excursion and 2003 - 2009 van

Early ICP in a late year model engine: Any benefits??

Reply
 
 
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
  #1  
Old 07-22-2014, 10:11 PM
bismic's Avatar
bismic bismic is offline
Post Fiend
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 15,132
bismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputation
Early ICP in a late year model engine: Any benefits??

Cheezit sent me a PM recently with a very interesting question. It came from a recent thread on the interchangeability of ICP sensors. He has been wondering if installing an early model ICP sensor (03, early 04) on a late model engine (late 04 and up) might have some benefits. He gave me a brief summary of his thoughts and it sounded interesting so I scrounged up an early ICP to try on my 2006 truck.

I have no idea on how to really test out the theory, but I wanted to see if the truck drove any differently (or better for that matter), so I went for it.

Anyone game for posting up your thoughts on what the effect might be - just to get some discussion and some brainstorming going!

There truly may be no difference, but then again ........ who knows!!

Scott (Diesel_Dan) posted some ideas that I think were pretty good. I will quote them below to get this started! Hope you don;t mind Scott!

Quote:
Originally Posted by diesel_dan View Post
You two are looking for intelligent guesses (speculation), and this is not:

1) quicker reacting
2) allows for higher ICP (final fuel pressure at injector is higher)
3) ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by bismic View Post
Interesting (and intelligent) thoughts Scott. What mechanism are you thinking might produce those benefits?
Quote:
Originally Posted by diesel_dan View Post
Later pump is both more efficient and capable of higher pressure without issue. Quicker reacting, is, well a guess... Something that could be advantageous if one had a more effective injection strategy let's say... (a quicker turning **** so to speak).

How far off am I...?
Quote:
Originally Posted by cheezit View Post
Well the icp just registers what the pump is putting out. The pumps pressure is set by engine rpm (its gear driven) and ipr (controled by the pcm).
Does that awnser your question or add more mystery?
Quote:
Originally Posted by diesel_dan View Post
So the PCM gets more accurate or faster and accurate feedback on what it is asking the IPR to do. It is another **** to turn in the complex system that creates a high pressure pulse of fuel.

If we have to "wait" for ICP to come up, we can't pulse the injector at perhaps the most optimal pressure/width for what our intended purpose is. We could send potentially different pressure/width fuel pulses, maybe even within a revolution, given the electronics are far quicker than the hydraulics of the system...

I'm not sure what it would help with stock tuning... But maybe it could.

Am I getting colder? And how come nobody else is playing?! Are they worried of a:
Quote:
Originally Posted by cheezit View Post
The system can only update as fast as the pcm can make changes. The later pcms were faster iirc.
Theres no way an icp can make a pcm correct faster.
I won't copy the other posts, but I enjoyed them!!
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 07-22-2014, 10:13 PM
cheezit's Avatar
cheezit cheezit is offline
Post Fiend
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: N. Fort Worth, tx
Posts: 12,115
cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.
Suscribed.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 07-22-2014, 10:14 PM
Shaneb75's Avatar
Shaneb75 Shaneb75 is offline
Strokin Okie
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 1,717
Shaneb75 has a great reputation on FTE.Shaneb75 has a great reputation on FTE.Shaneb75 has a great reputation on FTE.Shaneb75 has a great reputation on FTE.
Subscribing....
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 07-22-2014, 10:27 PM
bismic's Avatar
bismic bismic is offline
Post Fiend
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 15,132
bismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputation
Post #21 in the thread below may help generate some thoughts:

http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/11...d-voltage.html
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 07-22-2014, 10:33 PM
cheezit's Avatar
cheezit cheezit is offline
Post Fiend
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: N. Fort Worth, tx
Posts: 12,115
cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.
Mark I have never seen that thread before. Makes it more interesting.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 07-22-2014, 10:43 PM
bismic's Avatar
bismic bismic is offline
Post Fiend
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 15,132
bismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputation
Here is a graph of the relationship:


Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 07-22-2014, 10:44 PM
Yahiko's Avatar
Yahiko Yahiko is offline
Post Fiend
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Spanaway
Posts: 15,649
Yahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputation
For us that only have the new style and have not one clue how
they differ. Can you post a photo of them side by side?

Also if Diesel Dan is not a dan why the DD?

Sean
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 07-22-2014, 10:50 PM
bismic's Avatar
bismic bismic is offline
Post Fiend
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 15,132
bismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputation
I have pics (or used to) in one of my albums. The site's database error message is popping up on me, so I might not be able to access the pics for a while.

The main difference is that the sensors "bolt surface" takes a 1 1/16 inch wrench for the early sensors and a 15/16 inch wrench for the late model year sensors.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 07-22-2014, 11:00 PM
Yahiko's Avatar
Yahiko Yahiko is offline
Post Fiend
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Spanaway
Posts: 15,649
Yahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputation
So with the larger size can you take the valve cover off
and not remove the sensor?


Sean
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 07-22-2014, 11:06 PM
bismic's Avatar
bismic bismic is offline
Post Fiend
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 15,132
bismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputationbismic has a superb reputation
pics:

old



new


Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 07-22-2014, 11:47 PM
jswartz84's Avatar
jswartz84 jswartz84 is offline
Postmaster
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Roseburg, OR
Posts: 2,617
jswartz84 has a great reputation on FTE.jswartz84 has a great reputation on FTE.jswartz84 has a great reputation on FTE.jswartz84 has a great reputation on FTE.jswartz84 has a great reputation on FTE.
The newer, smaller plastic connector was for weight reduction if I recall
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 07-23-2014, 01:03 AM
04badford 04badford is offline
Post Fiend
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Manteca,Ca
Posts: 6,315
04badford has a brilliant future04badford has a brilliant future04badford has a brilliant future04badford has a brilliant future04badford has a brilliant future04badford has a brilliant future04badford has a brilliant future04badford has a brilliant future04badford has a brilliant future04badford has a brilliant future04badford has a brilliant future
Good work Mark, Moe, Scott (DD) Reps your way when I can
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 07-23-2014, 01:19 AM
diesel_dan's Avatar
diesel_dan diesel_dan is offline
Postmaster
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Cool, CA
Posts: 3,728
diesel_dan is a splendid one to beholddiesel_dan is a splendid one to beholddiesel_dan is a splendid one to beholddiesel_dan is a splendid one to beholddiesel_dan is a splendid one to beholddiesel_dan is a splendid one to behold
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yahiko View Post
For us that only have the new style and have not one clue how
they differ. Can you post a photo of them side by side?

Also if Diesel Dan is not a dan why the DD?

Sean
Yahiko = Sean vs. Scott = Diesel Dan (I do say that is the truck's name)...

I still envy your cats tho, but my cats would not ever want to meet yours (like in a back alley, or anywhere else )

they would spank my cats!
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 07-23-2014, 02:00 AM
Yahiko's Avatar
Yahiko Yahiko is offline
Post Fiend
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Spanaway
Posts: 15,649
Yahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputationYahiko has a superb reputation
Quote:
Originally Posted by diesel_dan View Post
Yahiko = Sean vs. Scott = Diesel Dan (I do say that is the truck's name)...

I still envy your cats tho, but my cats would not ever want to meet yours (like in a back alley, or anywhere else )

they would spank my cats!

Sorry for the slight

The boys would want to play once Mokkun got over being a BIG Chicken.
Bella would most likely think she got a new chew toy. She has been
chewing on Tetsu this last week. And she was being a home wrecker the
last few days. I have to go replace a ceramic pot that she crashed into.
Right now she is sitting on top of the computer desk and grooming ME.
She pulls hair with that tongue of hers. 40# grit sand paper I think is
what you call it.

BTW what Mokkun thinks of all this typing





Sand paper tongue her self.







Tetsu The Thinker





Hot car. After the 2001 garage fire I think it sort of looks like a face.

I thought I would post a sort of funny. Well I can laugh at it now. Toyota Solara.
The Door opener failed at about 11PM everyone got out along with the cat at that time. I think the house suffered about $125K in damage.


Sean
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 07-23-2014, 01:29 PM
cheezit's Avatar
cheezit cheezit is offline
Post Fiend
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: N. Fort Worth, tx
Posts: 12,115
cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.cheezit has a spectacular reputation.
No one's playing. ...
You people are no fun
Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
P2284 after oil cooler work, Ford 6.0 hawkco66 6.0L Power Stroke Diesel 23 10-23-2016 09:49 PM
Some great sensor information fordpride 1999 - 2003 7.3L Power Stroke Diesel 15 05-23-2016 02:00 PM
Are early and late ICP sensors "interchangeable"? bismic 1994.5 - 1997 7.3L Power Stroke Diesel 8 01-01-2015 03:46 PM
FAQ Found some good sensor info fordpride 1994.5 - 1997 7.3L Power Stroke Diesel 7 06-26-2012 11:49 PM
CODES... FINALLY embry1123 6.0L Power Stroke Diesel 54 03-22-2010 10:13 PM


Go Back   Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums >

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:49 AM.


This forum is owned and operated by Internet Brands, Inc., a Delaware corporation. It is not authorized or endorsed by the Ford Motor Company and is not affiliated with the Ford Motor Company or its related companies in any way. FordŽ is a registered trademark of the Ford Motor Company.