I have had my 23 W/ SO 6.7 for about 2.5 years and 60K miles. From day 1 I have been running the original Banks iDash to fulfill my OCD tendencies and desire to track Regens closely. I am not towing heavy on a regular basis and during the workday frequently have short 5-10 mile trips, which is what prompted the desire to keep an eye on DPF health. Just as others with similar driving habits report, my truck will regen religiously at 498 miles, with trucks DPF percentage averaging about 50% as shown on trucks DPF gauge. I would occasionally notice that the iDash woud not trigger the REGEN Active PID on my iDash, but would confirm the regen is active due to EGT's. I just assumed this was a case where the iDash "missed" the REGEN PID on the CAN bus and didn't worry about it too much. As I tracked even more closely I realized These Regen cycles last about twice as long a standard one , approx 20 min vs 10 min, and happen every 5th cycle. I stumbled accross the attached document from these related threads;

https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...l-reading.html

https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1...which-pid.html

I noticed the reference to a "Stage 2" active regen that is used "occasionally" that combines the DSI, as well as in cylinder late fire. At that point I now assumed that is what is happening, and Ford must be using a different PID for these "Stage 2" regens, so I reached out to Banks a couple months ago to see if this is something they are aware of, and something they can maybe research to see if it could be addressed in a FW update to the newer iDash platform. About the same time, Ford releases recall 26C10 and software update ECM-25.33.5. I received that OTA a while ago, and shortly after I hit a "5th regen cycle" . My iDash acknowleged the active regen this time, and acted much different , cycling back and forth from active to inactive the entire regen period. So it appears this update fixed the reporting of the Stage 2 regen and is able to differentiate it from a standard active regen.

Hope this may help some other OCD person!

 

Great post... and yes, it helped me, an OCD guy, better understand how the latest and greatest 6.7s, 23 plus trucks, do regens.

Absolutely interesting that a "Stage 2," must be for heavy cleaning or certain situations that when required, that the normal active regen with direct injection via the 9th injector in the DPF only will not handle.

My buddy has a 26 F350 but he's not OCD like me... I plan on sending him a link to the 23 plus 6.7 Powerstroke Coffee Book...

He does have a car hauler trailer and occasionally uses it for work, but he did send me two pics... at 280 miles >> DPF at 60% and at 440 miles >> DPF at 75%. That was awhile back, so I am sure he went past 498 miles and had a active regen. Just sent him a text...

 

That is interesting! I have a 22, so it behaves differently during regens. But, that could shed a little light on the recent rash of recalls that Ford has issued, of which their was a lot of confusion around them... Interestingly, the 26C10 recall was actually for the Trailer Controller Module, however, at the same time there was also a 26E01 recall that was an "Emissions recall." It seems that those recalls may have been bundled together, so it may have been the 26E01 that made the difference in your case... Who knows though. I do know that I received none of the recent recalls for my truck though, so I am happy about that. I do have an open recall, which is also an "emissions recall" from back in 2022, 22E04. I have chosen not to have it completed though. My truck has done great and I am afraid of letting Ford start fiddling with it...

 

My buddy just texted me back... currently at 654 and DPF at 0%. Said, the truck did a regen last night. When I ask about mileage, he looks at me like I'm nuts... so definitely not a forum guy like me...

They sure suck DEF went from 76% at 280 miles to 70% at 654... if the gauges are accurate at all. But I guess DEF is better than EGR... so I'd take it...

 

When my truck is nearing a regen, I'll make sure to take a certain route that's long enought to let it fully complete (per the PID on my iDash) and get the EGTs back down to a normal range. I've also noticed that a few have taken much longer to complete, but didn't really know why. Another interresting thing that I've noticed is that the regen cycle isn't complete when the trucks DPF% hits zero. The EGTs stay elevated and the DPF% on the iDash continues to drop for another 3-5 minutes before the regen PID shows that it has completed.

 

That is interesting... mine shuts off and I keep driving to cool the particulate filter (yeah older truck... ), EGT4 or EGT5 for you 23 plus guys... appreciate the input into this...

 

Even on my 22 I do the same, plan a longer trip until the regen completes and then continue to drive until EGTs are cool (I always wait till EGT1 is below 400F before shutting the truck off, regen or no regen). Also, probably 90% of the time, I found the same, just because the truck hits 0, I will still go a few miles before the regen turns off. However, there has been a few times that the regen has turned off with say 10% remaining, but then after another mile or 2 the DPF% will then drop to 0% as the EGT's are cooling down. There has been one time that it shut off around 20% and it only made it down to 10% by the time it cooled off.

I did a regen a few days ago. Driving down a divided 4 lane, I set my cruise at 65 mph and also locked out 9th & 10th gear to keep my RPM's around 1850. No issues... however, there has also been times that I simply left it in 10th gear and it all went fine. It's tough to get my thumb on exactly how it works sometimes, but I think keeping an eye on it and let it completely regen when it's time is the best option for these things. I am excited because in less than 2 weeks we will be pulling our camper 2500 miles across the country and I know my DPF will sit at 0% due to passive regen the entire time! We then have 2 1000 mile round trips planned after that, then at the beginning of August we will be pulling our camper 2600 miles back across the country... so my DPF should get some good cleaning time in the next 2 months!

 

I always want EGT1 under 400, usually at 350, when I shut my truck off... do not want the oil to cook in the turbo. Read that here when I first got here, to have EGT1 under 400.

My concern with the drive after an active regen is to get the particulate filter, EGT4, down to normal temps so the substrate doesn't crack when I shut the truck off...

 

From what I have observed on my 24 and what I have been told by a mech at Ford, the "Stage 2" folks speak of, occasionally occurs when the DOC/SCR needs cleaned based off specific monitored criteria. At first, it seemed like bull to me but the way it was explained was that pressures and NOx readings are what the PCM uses. Once that threshold is reached, the PCM will use the the 9th injector along with the injection into the exhaust stroke so that the entire exhaust flow temps are high enough to bake off the accumulated soot in those areas outside of the actual DPF. That all made sense as to why the variance since prior to the 9th injector the regen was essentially like the "Stage 2" in the new trucks so there was never the need to have anything but a single regen process. The mechanic I spoke with didn't mention a specific frequency such as every 5th regen or anything so I will have to pay closer attention to see if mine holds to that. However, I have noticed the same where the normal DPF only regen takes about 10 minutes and the "Stage 2" takes about 20 minutes. The actual % full on my rig depends on the time of year. In the summer (I'm in AZ) my DPF usually hits about 40% to 45% when I hit the 800km default mileage trigger and in the winter the DPF hits around 60% full.

 

That's interesting information. Thank you...

Very interesting to me that Ford would still have the direct injection on the exhaust stroke, or Stage 2, regen method to accompany the 9th injector.

I'd think that as long as a 23 truck was pulling a load and EGT5 was hot enough for passive regens to occur, all that would be required would be the 9th injector to keep the substrate clean.

But more stop and go local driving along with less hill climbing, reminds me of what happened with my truck recently, the soot load builds quicker and to a higher level, or if the 9th injector regens are NOT completed, then the DPF would require a Stage 2 regen.

Cool stuff... appreciate the insight.

 

A stage 2 regen is a thing. Here is the info on that Ford Service Content.

See the active regeneration paragraph below

 

I think it speaks volumes that Ford carried over the original method of direct injection during the exhaust stroke into the 9th injector gen of 23 plus trucks.

Even with the less EGR and more DEF usage strategy of the newer trucks, it seems that Ford had a concern with the 23s that were bought by first time diesel buyers and used as grocery getters...

This is not a shot towards anyone because not everyone who buys a diesel and does not need one like myself, are like me. I mean that I realize I am not a typical 6.7 owner.

I researched to learn that my truck needs to be worked to keep the emissions functioning and happy.

I also am referring to my friend who owns a collision shop. You guys would laugh if I told you what he just did but anyways, he is one of the guys who does not look into stuff like me and is on his fourth Super Duty...

Anyways, it is my opinion that Ford retained the method of direct injection as a second stage active regen in case owners do not drive their trucks in a manner that the 9th injector keeps the DPF clean.

As always, I could be wrong...

 

Good thoughts. Three things, this makes me think:

1. Like you mention, (also) on the 23+ models) folks are driving unaware of their regens and may not be allowing a full regen to complete when it is time, so at some point, a bit more of an extreme regen is required which uses both the old way with the exhaust stroke + the 9th injector. As a note on this, do the 23+ (9th injecter models) have the OCR function? On my 22, I keep my regen turned off until the truck decides a regen is needed based on the target soot load rather than a mileage target. If OCR is available on the 23+ models, maybe folks could defeat this second stage regen by keeping auto regen turned off and then turn it back on to fully complete a regen when it is necessary. If this is the case, then by completing each regen fully, the truck may never actually need to use the old exhaust stroke method since the soot load is staying in check.
2. A second though, the 9th injector regens just aren't as efficient as the exhaust stroke method? Maybe the regens using the 9th injector just aren't getting as complete of a regen as needed each time, so on occasion, maybe even a set occasion, it will perform both methods together to more thoroughly clean the DPF?
3. And third, timing? The 23+ MY's regen in half the time it takes the pre 23 models to regen. Maybe the regen simply doesn't have enough time to complete such a thorough clean in the time frame that the 23+'s use. So, just as with thought #2, a combo regen is completed at certain intervals to complete a more thorough cleaning.

Or maybe none of this...

But, it is interesting that Ford is still using the exhaust stroke method to regen even on the trucks with the 9th injector... This makes me think that the 9th injector method is to some degree subpar... I think I would still rather have the 9th injector, but this also leads me to believe that my method of leaving auto regen turned off and only completing a regen when necessary based on soot load (not mileage) is a good idea for 2 reason:

1. I am only completing regens when they are necessary, so there are less regens taking place, which is a good thing for the motor!
2. I am also letting every regen fully complete rather than only accomplishing partial regens.

 

Over time sulfur poisons the SCR, reducing its ability to convert NOx and urea to nitrogen gas and water. Regenerating the SCR extends its life. From what I’ve read, regenerating a copper-iron based SCR poisoned with sulfur requires temps in the 670C (1240F) range! This fits with a comment in the coffee table book that the stage2 regen uses exhaust stroke injection plus the 9th injector together to raise the temperature higher. My guess is the sole purpose of a stage2 regen is to burn sulfur out of the SCR.


On my truck the 9th injector consistently cleans the DPF every 800km and is very effective at getting soot down to between 0 and 2% every time (measured by iDash). However, it does stand to reason a +1200F regen would do a better job on the DPF. However, like most things, it wouldn’t surprise me if the higher temperature has a negative impact on DPF life.


I’ve had no luck figuring out when stage2 regens happen, which I assume manifest as +1200F regens and higher than usual EGT11 temps. The OP’s observations are terrific and appreciated!!

 

So, I wonder if trucks without the 9th injector occasionally do a regen at +1200F to regen the SCR?