428CJ power problems
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Joined: Jan 2003
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428CJ power problems
A question for my dad. He has a '71 F-100 Ranger that originally came with 360 two barrel, C-6 transmission, and I believe 3.79 rears (doesn't sound right on ratio, but thats what dad said). This is a project truck, when the 360 died he replaced it with a '68 or '69 428 CJ bored .40 over with a 2.72 duration cam ( I think) and a 850 dual line holley. The problem is we can't seem to spin the tires. There should be more than plenty of power to turn tires on an empty pick-up truck. For all other purposes there is plenty of power (pulling, hauling etc.). We have questioned the rear-end ratio several times but always get different answers. It is a 9 bolt rear end if that helps any. The truck was ordered with a 3.90, but one mech. says its a 3.79, another says 2.79, and a third says its a 3.35. Any help would be greatly appreciated as my dad wants to show off in front of all the young hot rod kids in town.
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Joined: Sep 2000
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From: Idaho, USA
428CJ power problems
Nirrad,
My Dad and I have done almost the same exact conversion as you. We have a 410 with Cobra Jet heads, the 268 Comp cams, and a 750 Holley along with a C-6. It's all in a 65 Ranger. It will not spin the tires over either, but it will leave two (posi-trac) faint black marks for a long ways. Just on the verge of spinning. While it runs okay, it does not run like I think it should. The reason is simple. It still has the lame stock exhaut manifolds that came on the original 352 and a farm truck dual exhaust. What kind of exhaust system are you running?
When I get finished spending money on my crewcab, I think I'm going to invest in a set of headers, or factory cast iron shorty headers and a new exhaust. I think that will really wake up that engine.
My Dad and I have done almost the same exact conversion as you. We have a 410 with Cobra Jet heads, the 268 Comp cams, and a 750 Holley along with a C-6. It's all in a 65 Ranger. It will not spin the tires over either, but it will leave two (posi-trac) faint black marks for a long ways. Just on the verge of spinning. While it runs okay, it does not run like I think it should. The reason is simple. It still has the lame stock exhaut manifolds that came on the original 352 and a farm truck dual exhaust. What kind of exhaust system are you running?
When I get finished spending money on my crewcab, I think I'm going to invest in a set of headers, or factory cast iron shorty headers and a new exhaust. I think that will really wake up that engine.
Post Fiend
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 8,238
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From: Oregon
428CJ power problems
I have a mildly built 428CJ and I can roast my 36" tires into third. Bragging? No, simply making a point that that engine shouldn't have any problem with it. As the previous poster mentioned, its all about your combination. What is your gear ratio to tire size? This in and of itself can prevent you from melting rubber. More importantly, your 428 is only as strong as its matched components. There is something very wrong if a .40 over 428 with a cam, CJ heads and intake won't put a hurt on your rubber. We need more info on whats on this engine so that we can help you. Exhaust is a good question, as your engine is just a giant air pump. But even with stock CJ logs you should be melting them...so I really wonder about your gearing.
Last edited by proeliator; Feb 23, 2003 at 03:00 PM.
Lead Driver
Joined: Apr 2001
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From: Texas
428CJ power problems
I wonder if there are some typical difficulties with big cam and big carb setups. My 69 will barely spin the tires, and maybe get a small chirp from 1st to 2nd gear. It has a rebuilt C6 auto and has a shift kit and a really good feel to it.
I have headers, and 2.5" true duals dropping just behind the cab.
So, I don't think exhaust is my problem.
I'm running stock, heads and that may be hurting, but I wouldn't think that would hurt at the lower RPMs where tire spinng starts.
I really think there is something to usung bug carbs and cams on these FEs. As there appear to be many with similat problmes. ine also has a bog just off idle that I see reported here frequently for hopped up FEs.
I'm running all MSD igintion, including the billet distributor, and I have tweaked the timing many times. I dn't believe that is the issue.
I have headers, and 2.5" true duals dropping just behind the cab.
So, I don't think exhaust is my problem.
I'm running stock, heads and that may be hurting, but I wouldn't think that would hurt at the lower RPMs where tire spinng starts.
I really think there is something to usung bug carbs and cams on these FEs. As there appear to be many with similat problmes. ine also has a bog just off idle that I see reported here frequently for hopped up FEs.
I'm running all MSD igintion, including the billet distributor, and I have tweaked the timing many times. I dn't believe that is the issue.
Post Fiend
Joined: Feb 2001
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From: Missouri
428CJ power problems
I'm not sure why that is either Greg. If I smash the gas at a stoplight the tires immediately go up in smoke. I never get a bog. My cam is not as big as yours though.
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Senior User
Joined: Jan 2003
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From: Balfour
428CJ power problems
Maybe running an 850 4v is too much for the motor to swallow at low rpm killing off tire spinning power.
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428CJ power problems
Am I doing this right to reply? More information for you guys to ponder. We are still running the original manifolds for the 360 with 2" all the way back. It has the Mallory electronic ignition. We first used a 650 Holley and was told it just wasnt getting enough gas so we switched to the 850. We are still using 15" tires which were original equipment. Thanks for the info so far it has def. raised questions for us to consider.
Post Fiend
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 6,624
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From: Missouri
428CJ power problems
It is possible for a 1100cfm doninator carb to not get enough gas to a stock 302 if it is jetted incorrectly. If the 650 causes your engine to run lean then put some bigger jets in the primaries. A 428 in even less than stock form is easily capable of demolishing a set of stock tires. Try advancing the timing first though like I said. If you don't have a light just loosen it up and barely turn it clockwise. Just a hare. Then try it out. If you think it made a difference turn it a little more. If it starts sounding like popcorn then you went too far.
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Joined: Dec 2002
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From: Nor-Cal
428CJ power problems
I'd say you ought to get rid of those stock log type exhaust manifolds. Put a set of good headers in and 2 1/2" dual exhaust with an H or even better an X type crossover. Then tune that 850 carb and you'll have no problem "Hazin' the skins". 
Posting Guru
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,214
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From: Minneapolis, MN
428CJ power problems
Is that 850 a double pumper or vacuum secondary. If vacuum, take the screw out of the secondary throttle actuator (if you know what I mean. If you don't, forget that last part.) Put in a stiffer secondary spring.
Just my 2¢
Greg
Just my 2¢
Greg
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428CJ power problems
This truck is a work in progress, we needed for other things so we cant strip it down and take several years to rebuild. The exhaust will deffinately be next. As with all projects, we put money into it when we have it, just never seem to have enough all at one time (imagine that). I'm not sure I understand the X crossover, could you explain a little about it? Yes, it is a 850 double pumper, forgot to mention that earlier.
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Joined: Dec 2002
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From: Nor-Cal
428CJ power problems
Go check out Flowmaster exhaust web site, they offer an X type crossover and should have a pic. Another place you could look is at summit racings' web site they should have something you could see as well.