351M/400 build
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351M/400 build
I am tearing down the 351M/400 I have in my 77 F250. I think its a 400, but I want to make sure because this thing has had a couple of owners before me. How do determine what crank you have? I figure that you probably can tell by the pistons you have.
I have some open chamber cobrajet cleveland 4v heads I want to use for the build.
Right now the motor has/came with a Weiand 8010 intake. I want to see if I can use this... it will need porting, or if I can get one that is a closer match.
Also I have a Cleveland Foundry block, which is think is preferable to the Michigan castings....
Want to put in a roller cam, and new slugs and get it back on the road.
Thanks
I have some open chamber cobrajet cleveland 4v heads I want to use for the build.
Right now the motor has/came with a Weiand 8010 intake. I want to see if I can use this... it will need porting, or if I can get one that is a closer match.
Also I have a Cleveland Foundry block, which is think is preferable to the Michigan castings....
Want to put in a roller cam, and new slugs and get it back on the road.
Thanks
Lead Driver
Joined: Mar 2004
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If you are set on using those heads then you will need a set of TMI's zero deck pistons to get some compression. Those heads won't even work as good as the stock heads with a good port and polish job though. The ports are way too big for a 400.
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I figured the heads would be an upgrade from stock... and I have them lying around.... got them way back when I bought a mustang that they came with... and I thought they would be an upgrade from stock.
I will look into the pistons, I know the stockers are junk. I figure since I use the truck for towing I want like a nine to one CR....
I will look into the pistons, I know the stockers are junk. I figure since I use the truck for towing I want like a nine to one CR....
Laughing Gas
Joined: Jan 2006
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From: New-brunswick,Canada
check on crank for numbers on the first conterweight (front engine). I had a 351m and i bought a 400 crank with TMeyer.inc piston to make a 400 (408 0.030 over). On my 400 crank the # 5mab. Hope this help. you can also mesure the center of the crank to the center of the connecting rod.1.75"(1.75" X 2 =3.5 or 351m), 2"(2" X 2=4) or 400. The piston size are the same 4" 351m and 400. The piston pin in the 400 is higher to compensate for the longer stroke. 351m 3.5" stroke and 4" for the 400.
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I got pleasant surprise.... its a 400 with .060 over pistons in it and the still hatching in al the bores.... the plugs looked great... so despite looking ugly and unwanted its a good motor! The pistons were stamped at the top with .060 and the look really fresh... truch had all kinds of guages is it.... so I guess it wasnt just all for show.... you never can tell...
I am keeping the stock heads... I am not that grinder happy to use the CJ heads.... My calculations tell me that with stock 400 pistons and head gaskets... I got about a 9.4-9.5:1 CR....
Wondering about a cam swap... I know I need to check this before I run it, but sill stock 400 pistons allow for running a .550 to .575" life cam? Generally speaking
I am keeping the stock heads... I am not that grinder happy to use the CJ heads.... My calculations tell me that with stock 400 pistons and head gaskets... I got about a 9.4-9.5:1 CR....
Wondering about a cam swap... I know I need to check this before I run it, but sill stock 400 pistons allow for running a .550 to .575" life cam? Generally speaking
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Joined: Feb 2009
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From: Southern NM
You will never obtain that compression ratio with stock pistons and stock heads.As Mark mentioned,look into the 400 pistons that Tim Meyer carries.Stock compression ratio is around 8:1.
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Guys... I dont really care about the CR... but .060 over is why I say 9.x... used the CR calculator.... what do you guys have as the -xx for the pistions? I used -18cc... here is a link for the compression ration for a 408W... which is about the same as a .060 400...
KB Pistons for Automotive Applications...
it says -27cc for the piston and comes up with 9.0 exactly.... and those pistons probably have more dish then the ones I have because most windsor heads are 64ccs and most people want to run on pump gas and want less than 10 to 1.... you gotta remember... with a big stroke like that boring can really up the CR... I know from other people experiences with strokers where they built up an engine with a in use chime because of that....
What I wand to get a guess on is what is the max lift for a cam I can put it.... I am thinking I will need a custom ground hyd roller.... which is something if its wrong is money down the drain so I dont want to check the came only to find out its too much like.... I definitely have aftermarket slugs in this thing.... I wish I could ID them... but so far cant.... and want to know if usually you can get .550 to .575 to work in these motors with standard type aftermarket pistons... if anybody knows.....
KB Pistons for Automotive Applications...
it says -27cc for the piston and comes up with 9.0 exactly.... and those pistons probably have more dish then the ones I have because most windsor heads are 64ccs and most people want to run on pump gas and want less than 10 to 1.... you gotta remember... with a big stroke like that boring can really up the CR... I know from other people experiences with strokers where they built up an engine with a in use chime because of that....
What I wand to get a guess on is what is the max lift for a cam I can put it.... I am thinking I will need a custom ground hyd roller.... which is something if its wrong is money down the drain so I dont want to check the came only to find out its too much like.... I definitely have aftermarket slugs in this thing.... I wish I could ID them... but so far cant.... and want to know if usually you can get .550 to .575 to work in these motors with standard type aftermarket pistons... if anybody knows.....
Posting Guru
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Nope, unfortunately you are wrong my friend, first of all you have to take in account that those pistons are .067" down in the hole and stock heads have huge open chambers with 76-78ccs, i calculated your cr around 8.2:1.....
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First of all... You dont guess compression ratios and I never trust mystery stuff. I'm going to have to CC the combustion chambers with oil to determine actual volume... I never trust mystery stuff... one would assume that its low compression junk... I was going to toss the engine for a 460 swap without even opening it up... I can always flex hone the motor and swap in new slugs... the bores are good...
What I am asking I is what the aftermarket pistons generally clear in cam lift.... A motor like that generally will want about .550 to .575 lift to run.... I also know I have to check the cam too... and then size the pushrods as well... Its not the first time I put together an engine... I have built many a 289-302-351W-347 small block....I know what works there....
I just know nothing about these engines.... never cared about a cleveland....
What I am asking I is what the aftermarket pistons generally clear in cam lift.... A motor like that generally will want about .550 to .575 lift to run.... I also know I have to check the cam too... and then size the pushrods as well... Its not the first time I put together an engine... I have built many a 289-302-351W-347 small block....I know what works there....
I just know nothing about these engines.... never cared about a cleveland....
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Anyone know the cc\'s of the dishes on stock 351c pistons????? - Ford Muscle Forums : Ford Muscle Cars Tech Forum
If you scroll down on the link and see the pic of the pistons... this is what mine look like... except they have an arrow that points forward on the bottom and are stamped with .060 in the middle...
If you scroll down on the link and see the pic of the pistons... this is what mine look like... except they have an arrow that points forward on the bottom and are stamped with .060 in the middle...