While climbing a grade and towing my 12000 lb fifth wheel (approximately 98 degree ambient temperature), I had a loss of power. First the engine began to whistle like a tea kettle (as it has done frequently on hot days for years now and Ford techs can't figure out). I was stepping into it and allowing it to whistle to see if I could try and figure out why it whistles like that. After about 10 seconds of whistling, the truck started loosing power. I looked at the boost gauge and it showed 10 psi. The engine was tacking out at 3400 rpm with only 10 lb of boost and barely making it up the grade... The grade lessened a bit and I gained momentum and the boost came back up to about 22 psi on the gauge and she seemed to be scooting along. The grade again got steeper and the boost dropped back down to about 12 psi on the gauge and lost power, barely making it up the hill.

Later, on another hill, I tried to replicate it and it seemed to climb OK. Once I got home (about 15 minutes later) I shut off the engine and opened the hood and noticed what appeared to be a brownish burn stain on the turbo and I could hear what sounded like coolant boiling in the engine. I don't think the boiling was from the degas bottle and there was no indication or stain of coolant overflowing from the bottle as you would see from overheating.

This engine has just over 80K miles on it and is bone stock. I have never changed the oil cooler or egr cooler. I had the coolant flushed and changed about 1000 miles ago at the Ford dealership.

I have been thinking of doing the egr delete or block off but can't seem to figure out which option is the best to make this happen. There is so much information on this forum that I find myself confused as to what I should be doing to remove or bypass that WART (egr).

Sooo, two questions:

1) What's going on with my lowering boost and loss of power? I'm getting ready to do a long road trip with my trailer in a couple of weeks and need to get this sucker fixed soon. Does this sound like a turbo problem? or could this be egr and coolers related???

2) Someone PLEASE simplify my decision on what avenue to take to eliminate future egr cooler and oil cooler problems. What mod should I do to rest my concerns for future cooler problems?

I have been reading up on leaving the egr in place and blocking off the exhaust to the egr. Please set me straight... I'm confused and am beginning to see cross eyed from all the reading.

 

Help!!! (please?)

 

I am going through the same issues right now with my 04 F250 SD 6.0L. Pulling a travel trailer in the Texas hill country I found the truck was very under-powered and puked the coolant out of the expansion tank. My trailer is only 9000 pounds and I don't (yet) have a turbo boost gauge to see what it was putting out.
Like you I have spent the last two weeks reading hundreds of posts (very informative) on this site and on the vendor's websites for EGR coolers, delete kits, tuners etc. I can summarize what I now believe.

The Oil cooler is most likely at the root of the problem - it acts as a filter for all the crud in the cooling system until it blocks up.
-- Somewhere I read that the engine management system monitors the EOT and if it gets too hot then it limits the power output from the engine (which is what I think we are experiencing as a loss of power).
-- Once blocked up, the flow to the EGR cooler is reduced, causing surface boiling and premature failure of the EGR cooler (you can hear the boiling / mine blew out the coolant).

Solutions I am currently working on my F-250 :
-- Flush the cooling system thoroughly
-- Replace the oil cooler heat exchanger
-- EGR Delete kit (I decided as there is no regulation making me keep it - why not eliminate any possibility of exhaust gas and coolant coming into contact, also should reduce the cooling load on the cooling system). I went the Sinister route.
-- Turbo inspection and cleaning - make sure the guide vanes are moving
-- In my case Head gaskets and studs - because I don't want to have to do this twice.

Finally a set of monitors / gauges to alleviate my paranoia that has set in after the last two problem-filled vacations with my travel trailer.

Hope this helps

 

Thank you, thank you, thank you Paul.

I was beginning to feel a bit alone on this one and was wondering if my posts were actually making it to the public board. Thought I heard crickets when I went back and checked this thread for replies last night.

It sounds like your situation and deductions have been in relative parallel to mine. There certainly is a lot of great information on this site but it can become overwhelming when your trying to diagnose a problem on these complex engines.

I did have Ford give my truck a cooling system a flush and coolant change not too long ago (general maintenance, not for any problems) and I had them use distilled water that I brought in to them. This boost and possible coolant boil problem only surfaced yesterday. The only reason I think the coolant is boiling is that I heard it. There is nothing coming from the reservoir (degas) bottle.

Are you doing the job yourself? Where are you getting the parts and what is the cost? I am a little short on money right now as I am planning to head out on a trip with the grand kids in two weeks but I'm also running short on time for the same reason so I may need to have it done at a shop. Oh what to do... Is this job such that it would be a mistake to not do the ARP studs while its apart? If so, I may have to bite the bullet but I would like to hear the facts before missing the opportunity to get it all done or, vice, having to do it all again in the future for head gaskets...

One thing that caught my attention is the brown staining on the side of the turbo next to the forward rubber cooling tube connection.

 

Do you have a very small leak in the CAC hose that may be intermittent? Does it puke coolant out the degas bottle? ARP studs certainly help with potential problems down the road but a stock truck without egr/oil cooler issues has been proven reliable. I would get a method to see my ect/eot difference and go from there. An Edge Insight is a great start.

Regards

 

If you are refering to the short blue elbow hose then I would say you should check it for a tear and the brown stain on the side of the turbo is possibly oil. I know your tech's say they are checking the system for leaks on the whistle, but I'm thinking you have one of those little metal gaskets leaking in the y-pipe. Have they smoke tested the system for leaks? Also, check your map sensor hose from the passenger side intake manifold runner to the map sensor itself (on top of the evap core box) for a crack, which would/should show up in a smoke test.

I've followed your complaint about the whistle for a long time now, and the only thing that comes to mind is the y-pipe and degas bottle cap OR the turbo itself is leaking. Has it ever been out or replaced?

 

Got an email today from Edge Products the new Insight will not read EOT or boost. Their reasoning not all trucks have Turbos.

 

I do not know who sent that info to you but my Edge Insight certainly does read eot and boost right from the OBD port. I had boost and ect on page one and ect over eot on a 2 bar graph on page two. It does require an optional probe to read egt. Oil pressure and fuel pressure are not supported by the truck computers so you need gauges for them. These are facts and supported by many satisfied Edge Insight owners on this forum.

 

ok so first off everyone is right check the blue boots that go to the turbo and the one at the cooler itself.
second no mention of losing coolant or puking from the degas. the squeel is comming from one of to places more then likly.
place one is the degas cap. you can try a new cap but if its a headbolt/gasket issue it wont fix it.
place 2 is going to be the belt slipping. check the water pump pully for a loss of paint were the belt rides. if the paint is gone then replace the waterpump pully, the belt and the belt tensioner, also if any of the flat side pullies are missing paint or have lumps of black built up on them replace as well.
this is imo were to start looking for issues.
also sorry I did not see this thread sooner.

 

As far as the CAC hose having a leak, I think the brown staining looks more like the metal just got damned hot, rather than an oil stain. Is it possible that the turbo browned a little due to extreme temperature?

There is no coolant puking from the degas bottle and the coolant is at the minimum line when cool so I don't see that there could be a leak or puking coolant.

I suppose I should break down and get some gauges, or maybe a tuner that monitors temps and such. It sure would help with diagnosis when giving info to you guys.

Is there a limp mode that would occur if temps are too high? It seems that the loss of boost may have been a result of high temps (indicated by boiling coolant) from a clogged oil cooler or clogged egr cooler, putting it into limp mode to protect from further overheating??? Does this make sense. Once again, though, there was no CEL. It seems that there should have been a CEL if the temps got too hot, wouldn't there?

I think I'm going to have to yank out that damned egr cooler and change the oil cooler. Who knows, maybe the Y pipe is the cause of the whistle, and the sinister egr delete would replace the y pipe with the kit replacement pipe... But first I would like to know if this is the immediate problem as I would hate to dump all that money at it and still have something else going on to cause the boost loss... Do you think I'm on the right track? Any thoughts?

 

Rictac
I am speaking of the new Insight Cs/CTS that just came out.

 

Is it possible for you to get a picture of the brown stain? If it's on the cold side of the turbo then it should never get hot enough to burn the metal unless the impeller is rubbing the housing.

 

tim the cold side goes from the cac to the intake.
the hot side is cac to turbo.

 

You posted this while I was posting my last post. Thanks for chiming in. I'll check what you stated. Also, please see my last post with a couple of theories I made. Please tell me if they make sense. I am ordering the sinister egr delete kit anyway as I am DONE with the egr. (at least until they begin checking for them). Please let me know if you think my theorizing makes any sense.
Thanks Cheezit, Tim

 

I'll take a photo and try to post it. If I can't figure out how to post it I'll send it to you via e-mail.
Thanks, T