new ties + bad handling?
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Junior User
Joined: Jan 2010
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new ties + bad handling?
Well, I replaced a cheap set of load range c tires and just had some Yokohama Geolander a/t-s tires in load range E instaled yesterday. Somehow it seems my handling is worse now. I can definately feel the extra stiffness in the sidewall, I can feel the bumps in the road more. I picked it up and the installer had 45 psi in each tire. The front end felt like it was on ice is the best way I can describe it. I inflated to 58 psi when I got home and it felt a litle better, but still worse then with the old tires. I had an alignment done two moths ago and the tie rods ends were replace a year ago, so that should eliminate those. Could it just be the tires or should I start looking for a problem. I changed tires to a higher load range to feel safer but the oppsite happened, I dont like the feel of driving it now. Above 40 mph the front ends wanders, I can't drive a straight line, and it feels like its sliding before it turns. Just a weird feeling, anyone experienced anything like this before.
Posting Guru
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,198
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From: Tulsa, OK
I'd say ball joints and/or steering box. For a 2000, probably both. Does the truck follow tracks / grooves in the road? How does it feel on a totally flat new road?
Stiffer tires can actually be worse when they "climb" out of ruts/grooves and push the steering linkage to one side of free play or the other. Then, you have to react to the other direction. Kind of like trying to control one of those cars on the kiddie track at the amusement park.
How many miles on this truck?
Stiffer tires can actually be worse when they "climb" out of ruts/grooves and push the steering linkage to one side of free play or the other. Then, you have to react to the other direction. Kind of like trying to control one of those cars on the kiddie track at the amusement park.
How many miles on this truck?
Post Fiend
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 11,314
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you changed one thing and things are different now....
pretty easy debug if you ask me... it IS your tires...
probably because your new tires are much more "square" than the rounded corner old tires....
so undulation (ruts and ridges) will 'catch' the side of the tires more and pull it one way or the other...
Good job getting away from the c's !!! whew, I'd be scared of the weight on those !
but give it a bit to wear in (just like you break in a new pair of shoes)
search for the chalk test to set the air pressure correctly, and enjoy....
pretty easy debug if you ask me... it IS your tires...
probably because your new tires are much more "square" than the rounded corner old tires....
so undulation (ruts and ridges) will 'catch' the side of the tires more and pull it one way or the other...
Good job getting away from the c's !!! whew, I'd be scared of the weight on those !
but give it a bit to wear in (just like you break in a new pair of shoes)
search for the chalk test to set the air pressure correctly, and enjoy....
Cargo Master
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,566
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From: The Great White North!
Check the max air pressure rating on the tires, and see if you can pump them up some more to test that way. say 65-70 psi. If that makes a difference then I would say give them a bit of wear in. If that doesn't work then go back to the tire shop and get them to change to something else.
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Junior User
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The truck has 135K. I have no idea if ball joints have been replaced, but I am going to jack it up and try to check them. I think first I am going to try 65 psi, the tires say 80 max, and see if that makes a difference. Would the softer sidewall of the old tires hide a worn out suspension piece? I got the tires from discount tire and I have heard they are good about customer service if you have a proble with the tires, but I hate to think about taking them off and sending them back.
Posting Guru
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,198
Likes: 2
From: Tulsa, OK
The truck has 135K. I have no idea if ball joints have been replaced, but I am going to jack it up and try to check them. I think first I am going to try 65 psi, the tires say 80 max, and see if that makes a difference. Would the softer sidewall of the old tires hide a worn out suspension piece? I got the tires from discount tire and I have heard they are good about customer service if you have a proble with the tires, but I hate to think about taking them off and sending them back.
If they cannot be greased, they are more than likely original.
If ball joints are original, even on your 2wd, they need to be replaced. And yes...soft and worn tires can hide steering/suspension geometry problem(s). The tires cause the problem to be exaggerated but they are not the root cause of the issue. Others are correct when they say try different pressures, but I would not run that truck under 65 psig. I typically run about 70 psig.
So...the bad news is that you probably need to spend more money on both ball joints and maybe steering components (recommend Red Head steering gear).
Since the ball joints are a "given" (being worn out), start there and have it aligned before spending money on Red Head. If you do the ball joints yourself, it can be done for around $300. The Red Head steering gear is about $400 exchange. If you pay others to replace these for you, the ball joints will be about $700 installed, and the steering gear about $600 installed.
Just remember that you are restoring and improving the truck. It is a worthy investment.
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Freshman User
Joined: Nov 2008
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dude its your tires just went through this with my wifes excursion. Drove into discount tire and installed the yokohama's drove home from work that night and the worst set of tires i have ever had felt like they were flat with 80psi in them drove it back the next day day and had michelins put on (ltx ms2) which are NOT worth the money, my friend works at discount tire and said they have had three sets come back this week of the michilens. Put bfg rugged trails on it and they are awesome.
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Thread Starter
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Junior User
Joined: Jan 2010
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I went up to 65 psi and no real change. I jacked up the front end and I couldn't tell if the ball joints were bad or not, although I can hear a slight clunk when I hit a bump. They do not have a grease fitting so I'm guessing original or replaced with oem, previous owner had most work completed at a dealership. I am going to tighten the steering gear in the morning, I can turn the wheel almost a 1/4 turn before I get any steering response. I agree with others thinking the older soft sidewall tires hid the problems.
Last edited by tacurt; Apr 16, 2010 at 01:26 AM. Reason: typig error
Bleed Ford Blue
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 13,578
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From: Anchorage Alaska
my balljoints did not seem too bad to me, i could not get much play out of them. but i just had them replced and he said there was alot more play then i was able to find(w/limited trying on my part). they were shot bigtime. i also had a clunk over bumps. it drives so much better now its like a new truck! so that would be somewhere to look. mine were prolly gone 10k miles ago but i just changed them at 95k miles.
Elder User
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 762
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c'mon, guys - please PLEASE - tell me this whole "thread" is a joke ? If this is the limit of a typical modern American's analysis of mechanical issues, well......
Posting Guru
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 1,198
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From: Tulsa, OK
I've had similar experience as AlaskanEX. On my 03, I finally replaced the ball joints at 85K miles even though I could not find anything wrong with them with simple 'jerk on the tire' techniques. I think the forces are just too big for us to duplicate like this.
The 03 change-out really improved things dramatically. The 03 never had any adjustments to the steering gear--even up to 180K miles. It drove just fine after BJs were replaced.
I went ahead and changed the 05 BJs just in the last 3000 miles--it now has 70K. In this case, however, the ball joint replacement did not dramatically help. Improve, yes, but cure no. The 05 still had a 'wandering' issue. The 05 case turned out to be the steering gear.
With 1/4 turn free play in your steering wheel as you say, and with 135K miles on the original ball joints, I really think you should do both. Start with ball joints, then move to steering gear. Don't go OE with steering gear, get the Red Head SG.
The 03 change-out really improved things dramatically. The 03 never had any adjustments to the steering gear--even up to 180K miles. It drove just fine after BJs were replaced.
I went ahead and changed the 05 BJs just in the last 3000 miles--it now has 70K. In this case, however, the ball joint replacement did not dramatically help. Improve, yes, but cure no. The 05 still had a 'wandering' issue. The 05 case turned out to be the steering gear.
With 1/4 turn free play in your steering wheel as you say, and with 135K miles on the original ball joints, I really think you should do both. Start with ball joints, then move to steering gear. Don't go OE with steering gear, get the Red Head SG.
Elder User
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 783
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From: Nova Scotia
For the small investment, install camber/caster shims when/if you do the ball joints. Part of your wandering issues at highway speed are from too low of a caster angle. The shims will help with this. You should be trying to get as close to the 5 degree max spec as possible without taking your camber spec out of tolerance....