Military Pay ***


This is an Airman's response to Cindy Williams' editorial
piece In the Washington Times about MILITARY PAY, it should be printed
in all newspapers across America

Ms. Cindy Williams wrote a piece for the Washington Times,
Denouncing the pay raise(s) coming service members' way this year.
Citing that she stated 13% wage increase was more than they deserve.

This Cindy Williams is NOT the "Laverne & Shirley" Cindy
Williams. She is a Assistant Director for National Security in the
Congressional Budget Office....


A young airman from Hill AFB responds to her article below.
He ought to get a bonus for this.


"Ms Williams:

I just had the pleasure of reading your column, "Our GI's earn
Enough" and I am a bit confused. Frankly, I'm wondering where this
vaunted overpayment is going, because as far as I can tell, it
disappears every month between DFAS (The Defense Finance and Accounting
Service) and my bank account. Checking my latest earnings Statement I
see that I make $1,117.80 before taxes per month. After Taxes, I take
home $874.20. When I run that through the calculator, I come up with an
annual salary of $13,413.60 before taxes, and $10,490.40, after.

I work in the Air Force Network Control Center where I am
part of the team responsible for a 5,000 host computer network. I am
involved with infrastructure segments, specifically with Cisco Systems
equipment. A quick check under jobs for Network Technicians in the
Washington, D.C. area reveals a position in my career field, requires
three years experience with my job. Amazingly, this job does NOT pay
$13,413.60 a year. No, this job is being offered at $70,000 to $80,000
per annum........... I'm sure you can draw the obvious conclusions.

Given the tenor of your column, I would assume that you
NEVER had the pleasure of serving your country in the armed forces.
Before you take it upon yourself to once more castigate congressional
and DOD leadership for attempting to get the families in the military's
lowest pay brackets off of WIC and food stamps, I suggest that you join
a group of deploying soldiers headed for AFGHANISTAN ; I leave the
choice of service branch up to you. Whatever choice you make, though,
opt for the SIX month rotation: it will guarantee you the longest
possible time away from your family and friends, thus giving
you full "deployment experience."

As your group prepares to board the plane, make sure to
note the spouses and children who are saying good-bye to their loved
ones. Also take care to note that several families are still unsure of
how they'll be able to make ends meet while the primary breadwinner is
gone, obviously they've been squandering the "vast" piles of cash the
Government has been giving them.

Try to deploy over a major holiday; Christmas and
Thanksgiving are perennial favorites. And when you're actually over
there, sitting in a foxhole, shivering against the cold desert night;
and the flight sergeant tells you that there aren't enough people on
shift to relieve you for chow, remember this: trade whatever MRE
(meal-ready- to-eat) you manage to get for the tuna noodle casserole or
cheese tortellini, and add tabasco to everything. This gives some
flavor.

Talk to your loved ones as often as you are permitted; it
won't nearly be long enough or often enough, but take what you can get
and be thankful for it. You may have picked up on the fact that I
disagree with most of the points you present in your opened piece.

But, tomorrow from KABUL , I will defend to the death your
right to say it.

You see, I am an American fighting man, a guarantor of your
First Amendment rights and every other right you cherish. On a daily
basis, my brother and sister soldiers worldwide ensure that you and
people like you can thumb your collective nose at us, all on a salary
that is nothing short of pitiful and under conditions that would make
most people cringe. We hemorrhage our best and brightest into the
private sector because we can't offer the stability and pay of civilian
companies.

And you, Ms. Williams, have the gall to say that we make
more than we deserve? You can kiss my royal red a**!!!

A1C Michael Bragg Hill AFB AFNCC

 

while very cool, it's old 10 years old
Our GIs Earn Enough (washingtonpost.com)

 

It does not hurt to run these type of "letters" through snopes.com.

 

I'm glad you pointed that out. I was going to point to the pay discrepancy. When I left the recruiting command January of last year, the starting pay for an E1 in boot camp was in the neighborhood of the $1,117.80 per month touted in the letter. You also have to remember that we don't pay taxes when deployed to a war zone, we get free meals and a place to live over there and we also get extra pay and allowances. If we are married, we also get a pretty good housing allowance, in addition to whatever special pays our rate is eligible for. Here's the pay chart for 2009:

http://www.dfas.mil/militarypay/mili...yPayTables.pdf

Now that I've said all that, I want everyone to understand that it should be higher. Whatever I made in the navy, once I learned to live within my means, was enough. It certainly won't make you rich, but it is a comfortable living. It should have been more- there's a lot of sacrifice involved in serving. What I do like about that letter is that it points out the ignorance of those that have never served. This person has likely never donned the uniform, nor had to endure substandard living accommodations. She probably had her college paid for by parents, and slid right into a nice position. I have no problem with that, either. Good for the ones that can do it. My problem lies in the fact that she thinks she knows what it takes to train and keep good military men and women. She has no idea that these people are courted by the private sector all the time. Cisco engineers (I hope to be one of those in another year or so) rightfully earn $60-80,000, yet an E5 with the same certificate only makes $35? You'd better pay them more!

 

I haven't seen one in a while but the Navy, Army, Air Force Times newspapers used to run the numbers showing what the equivalent pay was for the military and an E5 makes a hell of a lot more than $35K a year when you factor in all the benefits, allowances, etc.

An example, an E5 in my state with dependants would get his base pay (around $2900 per month) plus a houseing allowance (tax free) of $1500-2500 per month depending on where they live. Then add in all the other allowances and the like and the pay isn't that bad.

Now, as for the original article posted, not only was it dated, it neglects to consider the fact that many people go in under some sort of accelerated pay scale deal. All of the kids we have gotten in my squadron lately have been HANDED E4 as soon as they finished Tech School. Seven weeks of Basic and another seven weeks of our school and they are E4. Not a bad deal.

I will be on Active Duty for the next two+ months and I will be getting base pay of over $3500 per month plus another $2200 per month housing allowance. Per diem, family separation allowance and whatever else I get make it a pretty good paycheck.

 

I agree. I was bringing home over $50,000 a year when I retired. It still isn't enough. We expect you to miss birthdays, anniversaries and holidays, and we expect you to do it with a smile. We want you to go away to a foreign country for up to a year and a half, miss your kid's first step, miss their graduation and everything in between. That's asking a lot, and the compensation doesn't really match.

Look at another example: an E4 (possibly an E3) can be a qualified tower air traffic controller (Control Tower Operator cert.). What does this mean? It means that a 19 or 20 years old sailor or soldier could be directing 15 multimillion dollar airplanes on whom to follow, and when they can take off and land. When he is plugged in, he owns the airfield- his responsibility. Compare that to the FAA. E4, married, may be making $40k per year with all his allowances. His responsibilities are worth much more than that.

 

I was waiting for a few posts to go up before I commented. Those of you who have posted did so with very well thought out replies and got me to thinking about some things. I'll try not to bore you.

I was fortunate, lucky, skilled and good at what I did and retired as an E-8. With my final promotion came a set of orders to the USCGC Hamilton in San Diego, Ca. In the two years I served aboard Hamilton, prior to retirement, I served in many capacities. I'm making a point so please allow me to break them down as this is typical of all military people. The CWO supply officer that I worked for was unable to go to sea. She had some stress issues.

I was the:

1. Command Senior Chief / Chief of the mess / Chief of the boat
2. Supply department head (while at sea)
3. Food Services officer
4. Member: damage control training team
5. Member: Morale committee
6. Member: health and habitability team (old *** ship)
7. Member: Ship's welcoming committee
8. Ship's financial representative for enlisted personnel.
9. Qualified: In Port Officer of the Day (Duty Officer)
10. Assistant command career councilor
11. I chaired the "Chief Petty Officer Performance Review Board" If a young sailor got into trouble, the board reviewed the investigation package and made recommendations to the command.

Likewise I purchased all the food for the ship, all the consumable items for the food service areas and I completely rehabed the entire galley and dining areas in two years.

When I was job searching as retirement neared, it became very clear to me that many of my skills, training and experience just didn't matter in the outside world. Many skills and jobs don't even have a civilian counterpart.

I say this. I earned great money as a Senior Chief aboard a major Coast Guard asset but I worked 60+ hours a week doing it inport and at sea.

We expect so many things from our service members attached to deployable assets and yet the folks on the outside can't begin to imagine how all this happens, why it happens and for whom.

An E-5 cook in the Coast Guard attached to a ship will have three times the responsibility and accountability than his civilian counterpart. He/she should earn more money.

 

I have yet to meet anyone who doesn't think they shouldn't make more money than they do and I guess military people are no exception.

Tim and Stu, you both make good points but as a long time military member myself (in my 25th year, all but five of it reserve), I see it differently. Yeah, the responsibilities and the technical nature of the some jobs would make it seem like we/you/they should be paid more, I still think the compensation is quite good.

The Air Traffic Controller that was mentioned probably has a $150k a year job waiting for him when he either retires or gets out. If he stays in he is getting nice re-up bonuses. His pay while in is based on his rank and years and with the exception of SRB's and some incentive pays, he'd get the same if he was swabbing decks or controlling planes. There would be no other equitable way to pay military people. Get rank, stay in longer, make more money. On the other hand, the Boatswain's Mate or the infantry soldier who works hard and gets promoted (but may have fewer marketable skills) has the opportunity to advance and make a real decent paycheck.

Where else but the military could the opportunity to get the kind of training available exist to anyone.....the dirt-poor kid from Podunk, the ghetto kid from Chicago or the spoiled rich kid from Beverly Hills. I've met them all over the years.

Another thing not mentioned is all the other bennies.....tuition assistance, health insurance, generous leave policies, cheap life insurance, travel, etc. etc. Oh yeah, and there is also the pretty good retirement package that costs us nothing.

I've never seen my military service as a means of getting wealthy. I saw and still see it as a calling. Many times it costs me money to serve due to lost opportunities in my civilian career. If I was strictly in it for money, I'd have taken one of several commissioning opportunities that I was offered.

Remember too that we are an all volunteer service - anyone unhappy with what they make can finish their contract and try their luck in the civilian job force. Ive seen many of my friends parlay a four-year hitch into a great civilian career, especially those in the electronic fields. I've also seen a good number of them realize that they had it pretty damned good and return to active duty after a short time out.

As always, just my opinion.

 

I went in the Navy in 1960 and an E-1 then was making $78.00 a month. I stayed for 20 years retiring as an ENCS(SS) (E-8) in 1980. My base pay when I retired was $1207. Today the base pay for an E-8 is four times that. Not to mention the sea pay and BAQ increases over them years.

 

Ray, you also have made excellent points in each of your posts. I would like to thank you for your continued service. This year would have been my 30th year of service and I was in line to for the next and final promotion, but, I was geographically unsatisfied with no future options for an east coast assignment. So, I made the tough choice and retired. Looking back, I made the right choice at the right time.

I think the military should and must be considered as a high end employer. It all stems from a previous thread I started called a veteran. This person writes a blank check to the United States and cashing it would cost you your life. I was very fortunate to not have seen combat at war though I fought the war on drugs for many years where there many tense situations.

Todays military folks face a very different scenario and must be well compensated.

 

The whole pay/benefits package is very competitive (in terms of attracting good folks), and it's worth nothing that the military system relies on DEFERRED compensation because it is structured to retain career people which it needs to wage complex wars. Stay the course and you get taken care of for life.

For those still serving, stay in until at LEAST 20, and consider more since you'll be working somewhere either way. The freedom of the retirement check retains its joy long after the job annoyances of being a senior NCO pushing papers fade away. I enlisted during one recession and am now recession-proof. That was worth every latrine I ever cleaned with a toothbrush...

Fun things to do when you plan your career:
Buy an (AFFORDABLE, houses, like cars, can be traded off later) house whose mortgage payment is under/at BAH.
Spend the last few years paying off any accrued debt. 50-percent of BASE pay isn't "half of what you were making with allowances". Disability (valid for most since military service wears out body parts) can be a large boost, but you need to acquire a documentation fetish and copy your medical records (multiple times, store in different places) as well as get everything you can noted in your separation physical.

IMO what is needed more than an increase in Active Duty base pay is more funding for the Veterans Administration, especially for combat-related programs, traumatic brain injury care, and PTSD care. (I wouldn't fall into any of those, so this isn't a troll for personal benefit!) The average active duty troop has plenty of disposable income unless he/she makes dumb decisions, but doesn't think about what they'll need after they are done serving or what to do if they are taken out by disease/wounds/accident.

Thanks to all who served, and for those still in, get smart about what you have earned so you can properly cover your posterior. For the old folks who have three years in after 9/11. don't forget you can go to school for four years and get costs plus E-5 BAH while you are training to become an even more productive citizen.

 

Great post. My retirement pay covers my mortgage, car payment and all insurances and I still have $500 per month to boot. The years of sacrifice and low pay were well worth it.

Todays military people have the ability to pay into a TSP, buy into a great GI bill and have financial accounts available to them while on active duty for educational benefits. Most of these goodies became available as I was winding down my career.

The military and corporate America still have miles to go to better identify similar skills and experience in order to ease the transition into a good job.

 

The free meals and all the benefits and pay look good until you get your legs blown off or end up brain damaged for the rest of your life because your head is the only part of the body unprotected from an IED for a H1 gunner.

 

There is plenty of risk involved (including accidents. of which the public are much less aware of than combat)

iCasualties | OIF | Iraq | Fatalities Details

, but the numbers are low (historically low compared to other wars) in relation to the overall number of folks involved, and G.I.s can do the math.

Everyone serves for their own reasons, and given the high re-up rates it would appear that most of the troops are reasonably content.

 

This will always be the case during weak economic times. But, as things get better, retention will take a hit among the first termers.

I was trying to get my oldest daughter to join any branch but I was steering her in the direction of the Air Force or the Coast Guard. She ended up not going and losing interest all together and decided that the lifestyle that I lived was not for her.

Oh, to be a veteran in today's times. Hopefully she'll come around.